1911 Questions

[joehaus]

In the next few months I plan on buying a 1911. I always liked them but I have yet to own one. I'm looking for something for target and carry but not competition. Proposed budget is 1,200.

Regarding S&W 1911s in MA, will they shoot with the magazine removed?

Would you recommend buying a frame from a company you can't get in MA and building it that way?

Does a fitted barrel with bushing make a big difference in accuracy?

Thanks all

 

[PaulD]

In the next few months I plan on buying a 1911. I always liked them but I have yet to own one. I'm looking for something for target and carry but not competition. Proposed budget is 1,200.

Regarding S&W 1911s in MA, will they shoot with the magazine removed?

Would you recommend buying a frame from a company you can't get in MA and building it that way?

Does a fitted barrel with bushing make a big difference in accuracy?

Thanks all

My SW1911Sc could be shot without the magazine in it. I can't speak to all S&W 1911s but I believe that is usually the case.

 

[Len-2A Training]

TTBOMK that is SOP for S&W 1911s. I think that all models will fire with the mag removed.

 

[jkelly]

In the next few months I plan on buying a 1911. I always liked them but I have yet to own one. I'm looking for something for target and carry but not competition. Proposed budget is 1,200.

Regarding S&W 1911s in MA, will they shoot with the magazine removed?

Would you recommend buying a frame from a company you can't get in MA and building it that way?

Does a fitted barrel with bushing make a big difference in accuracy?

Thanks all

I think S&W has both full and Commander sized 1911s as well as light weight versions of both in 45 acp. They also have new full sized 9mm in stainless.
They all shoot with the magazine removed.

You can have a gun built but you will be over your 1200 budget.

Respectfully,
jkelly

 

[Warrior102]

1911's thankfully really don't have required MA special neutering as they are single action and don't require absurd trigger pulls. My 1911PD will fire without the mag btw.

 

[drgrant]

SW1911s even have a big printout on the side of the frame proclaiming that it will fire with the magazine removed.

I realize it's S+W... but it's about the dumbest rollmark/etching ever seen on a 1911.

-Mike

 

[bostonasphalt2]

SW1911s even have a big printout on the side of the frame proclaiming that it will fire with the magazine removed.

I realize it's S+W... but it's about the dumbest rollmark/etching ever seen on a 1911.

-Mike

it is something I would like to get filed off and then get the slide re-finished

 

[Chrisg67]

sorry i piggy back on this, but it seemed a good place to ask

S&W make a 1911 in 10mm? if not, is there a ma compliant one that can be had new?

 

[joehaus]

SW1911s even have a big printout on the side of the frame proclaiming that it will fire with the magazine removed.

I realize it's S+W... but it's about the dumbest rollmark/etching ever seen on a 1911.

-Mike

It can't be as bad as the safety manual engraved into the barrel of my Vaquero

 

[CRSIII]

My Govt. mod S&W bone stock shoots better than I can.
If $$ is not a concern, talk to the folks at Remsport, Gregg Derr, LaRocca, I have seen with mine own eyes the wonderfull thing these men do w/ John Moses Browning's favorite child!

 

[drgrant]

it is something I would like to get filed off and then get the slide re-finished

Well, on the 1911s its usually on the dustcover or something like that, unless they moved it.

I'd still buy one of their 1911s I'd just live with it, but it is kind of stupid- especially considering that save for some possible oddball models, there really aren't any 1911s with a magazine safety even on the market from any manufacturer.

Then again, maybe S+W screwed themselves with this, by putting a mag safety on 95% of the 3rd gen autos they made/make. The lawyers probably went "well, most of your guns have this "feature", so now you have to be explicit about the guns that don't have it..."

-Mike

 

[drgrant]

It can't be as bad as the safety manual engraved into the barrel of my Vaquero

Yeah, ruger is a bit absurd. At least the LCR I just picked up only says "READ INSTRUCTION MANUAL" on the barrel in relatively small print.

-Mike

 

[M1911]

S&W make a 1911 in 10mm? if not, is there a ma compliant one that can be had new?

No, S&W does not. Your best bet would be to look for used Colt Delta Elite. I picked one up here on NES way back in 2002.

 

[meth0d]

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=140890913 10mm Delta Elite.

 

[drgrant]

No, S&W does not. Your best bet would be to look for used Colt Delta Elite. I picked one up here on NES way back in 2002.

I've seen plenty of used DEs floating around in MA at reasonable prices, too.

Last yr at the Fitchburg gun show there was at least 4 of them. Since they
don't move very fast, I'd wager a few vendors still have them.

-Mike

 

[PaulD]

Well, on the 1911s its usually on the dustcover or something like that, unless they moved it.

I'd still buy one of their 1911s I'd just live with it, but it is kind of stupid- especially considering that save for some possible oddball models, there really aren't any 1911s with a magazine safety even on the market from any manufacturer.

Then again, maybe S+W screwed themselves with this, by putting a mag safety on 95% of the 3rd gen autos they made/make. The lawyers probably went "well, most of your guns have this "feature", so now you have to be explicit about the guns that don't have it..."

-Mike

Yeah, it was on the dust cover of my 1911Sc. I have to admit, one of the things that attracted me to the Sig GSR was it doesn't have any of that stupidity.

 

[joehaus]

A friend of mine had a mega-star(or something) 1911 and it had the mag saftey. I owned a Smith auto that did too, hated that damn feature. But since it's not a factor I am leaning towards a S&W.

Some internet research has lead me to the S&W 1911PD. I even found a thread on here about it http://http://www.northeastshooters.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=68186. I called a few places and found one new for around 900. I think I'm going to pull the trigger on this and pick it up Monday.

Thanks for the help everyone.

 

[Chrisg67]

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=140890913 10mm Delta Elite.

wow used at $1000+ ill pass on 10mm. figured it would be nice since i could use dies and bullets if i reload for my .40....

 

[drgrant]

wow used at $1000+ ill pass on 10mm. figured it would be nice since i could use dies and bullets if i reload for my .40....

I've seen a bunch for sale in MA from $650-900. The deals are out there if you look hard enough.

If you want to get into 10mm though the best way is, honestly, to find a Glock
20 or Glock 29.


-Mike

 

[TomH]

I'd say that if you find a 1911 with a mag safety, you can easily disable it anyway. That is, if it's the kind with a linkage going under the grip area.

 

[meth0d]

I've seen plenty of used DEs floating around in MA at reasonable prices, too.

Last yr at the Fitchburg gun show there was at least 4 of them. Since they
don't move very fast, I'd wager a few vendors still have them.

-Mike

Yea, this was part of a consignment at a local shop; everything this particular guy had was a little steep.

 

[joehaus]

How are you 1911 guys usually carrying? I'm used to either revolvers or Sigs and I'm still researching the best way for the 1911. So far it seems to be loaded chamber, hammer back and safety on. Condition 1 I believe.

What about thumb-break holsters with the hammer back?

 

[ochmude]

Thumb break isn't necessary. I carry mine condition 1 in a Crossbreed holster. Disappears under a t-shirt.

 

[M1911]

How are you 1911 guys usually carrying? I'm used to either revolvers or Sigs and I'm still researching the best way for the 1911. So far it seems to be loaded chamber, hammer back and safety on. Condition 1 I believe.

I carry mine condition 1.

What about thumb-break holsters with the hammer back?

I don't use thumb-break holsters. No need.

 

[Chris]

A friend of mine had a mega-star(or something) 1911 and it had the mag saftey.

The Star pistols were 'similar' in operation to the 1911, but they were not a 1911 design. Biggest obvious difference is the pivoting trigger and one side trigger bar. But internally there are a lot more - basically everything. (^_^)

Yes, they do have a magazine disconnect (I hate the term 'Magazine Safety' because it is NOT.) However, the disconnect is not 100% reliable. it is a piece of spring steel that the magazine holds to the side that deflects the trigger bar to trip the sear. Over time, the spring gets weak and you can trip the sear without a mag. My Star Firestar .40 pistol is in this state right now and I use it as a demonstration as to why you CAN NOT expect a mechanical device to keep you safe.

Not sure why, but Star pistols always seem to have a lot more felt recoil than most guns in the same caliber despite the fact that they are a fairly heavy pistol.

Star pistols were built in Spain, are fairly good quality, and good 'range' guns if you can find one cheap. (I paid <$300 for the .40 Firestar back in the early 2000's. My .45 Megastar was even less than that, but had a broken ejector.) They stopped being imported sometime in the early 90's and some parts are difficult to find. That replacement ejector for example was handmade because I could not find one anywhere.

I would not look at a Star as an equivalent to a 1911. Yes, its a single action semi with a single stack magazine, but that is about all they have in common.

 

[wahsben]

How are you 1911 guys usually carrying? I'm used to either revolvers or Sigs and I'm still researching the best way for the 1911. So far it seems to be loaded chamber, hammer back and safety on. Condition 1 I believe.

What about thumb-break holsters with the hammer back?

When I carry my 1911's it is in condition 1 cocked & locked. S&W is having their Columbus day sale starting on Oct. 9th. You may be able to get it at an even better price there if they have the same percentage off that they have in previous years.

 

[Chris]

How are you 1911 guys usually carrying? I'm used to either revolvers or Sigs and I'm still researching the best way for the 1911. So far it seems to be loaded chamber, hammer back and safety on. Condition 1 I believe.

What about thumb-break holsters with the hammer back?

Yep, designed to be carried in Condition 1. The safety inserts a piece of metal into the sear/hammer interface making it virtually impossible for the hammer to fall (which is why you can't engage it when the hammer is not cocked).

A properly fitted holster does not need a thumb break. An IWB style more so.

Another nice 'feature' of a 1911 safety is that it locks the slide closed, so a really tight holster can't push the slide out of battery which can cause issues in some pistols. My reholster routine with my M&P includes a check with my thumb to verify that the slide is fully in battery as it seats into the holster.

Couple of 1911 tips:

Never ever allow a 1911 slide to slam forward without a round (or dummy) being chambered. Instead, ease it forward by hand. Slamming on an empty chamber causes sear creep and eventually the hammer won't stay back every time when firing. Had this happen on a gun I was using a lot in class and was told by the smith that fixed it that this can occur in any 1911 that sees unusual amounts of empty chamber slams.

Always make sure that your muzzle is in a safe direction when flicking off the safety. It is possible with wear that the hammer will fall disengaging the safety. Usually other issues will appear before this can happen, but I've personally seen one do this after a demonstration of "see, when the safety is engaged, the gun won't fire, but take the safety off .. click CLICK

In other words, get into the habit of clearing leather before you snick off the safety.

 

[drgrant]

I agree with what Chris said, plus if carrying a 1911 I'd perform a safety function test on the gun at least once a year. I'm trying to remember where I saw it (probably on M1911.org) but there is a simple testing regimen you can use to test the safeties on a 1911 to make sure they are in working order. This is especially important on a gun that you don't really know the origin/history behind. I've seen a lot of relatively "bad" things happen with 1911s that had butchered trigger and safety systems. Slam fires, guns that fire just by flipping off the safety, etc.

There are probably more butchered 1911s out there on the used handgun market than all other types combined. (The golden screwdriver types seem more apt to ruin 1911 sears and the like, for some reason, than any other pistol. )

-Mike