224 Valkyrie

lazypengu1n

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With all the crazy hype about 224 Valkyrie being the next biggest thing for the AR-15 platform, I'd like to share my experiences so far with this cartridge.

I've been shooting long distance for the past 3 years and by no means an expert. I go on a yearly prairie dog hunt in Texas shooting anywhere from 200y out past 1000y at dogs, coyotes, cottontails and jacks. Year 1, my longest shot was 325y at a running coyote and this year was 725y at a various jacks and dogs.

Shooting out that far requires practice and good ammo, reason I roll my own and unless I get 1 MOA or better @ 100y with my ammo I keep developing it. I shoot 17WSM (rimfire) and 22-250 and 6.5 Creedmoor.

This year brought a custom built AR10 in 6.5 Creedmoor (hits at 725y) and it was heavy and required an extra case in which the airline smacked me an additional $150 (on the way home, on the way out the lady was nice and only charged me $35 but did warn YMMV on the return flight) as it was my 3rd rifle case because the first two are $35 each. I was looking for a lighter semi-auto package that could reach out to 1000y so this wouldn't happen again. This is where the 224 Valkyrie comes in.

The only factory ammo I could my hands on is the Federal Ammunition 75 gn TMJ ammo. Listed BC is .35, not bad right for "range" plinking ammo I thought. Zeroing for 25y to make sure I get on paper and WOW!.... right one the money! Zeroing at 100y, I put a few rounds down range and establish a group and make adjustments. I shoot the remaining 4 - 1MOA diamonds with 5 rd groups. Various results, horizontal stringing, 3 out 2 in, 4 out 1 in, 2 out 3 in. Weird, perhaps it's a new barrel, maybe it's me. It's holding at least a 2MOA group ok fine. Whatever, close enough.

Next day I go and shoot Ft. Devens at 600y. I make my adjustments for distance and wind and I get on paper. Fliers left and right in the 7 ring, various 8, 9 10 ring hits and 1 X. Not my best day at 600y but fine whatever. I go back to my range and shoot at 100y after undoing my original adjustments for 600y. Same exact pattern. Fine, good enough to qualify for 200M if it's holding 2 MOA. I shoot 200m and same pattern after I zero and my qualification shots, 5 rds, same pattern. Grouping about the size of a baseball.

Hitting a group the size of a baseball at 200m, not bad but that group is no good if this ammo was going to be pushed out further to 1000y. Looking up various reviews on this cartridge and everyone is raving about how it shoots better than 223/5.56 etc. No where has anyone done any group testing with 5rd groups. I check out Federal's website and look at the reviews and other people have had the same issue with the ammo not grouping. I add my review into the mix. My friend is also experiencing the same results. Reviews online mention a spread in MV at approx 200fps. Blah... I got fed up and decided to shoot all the ammo I had so I can reload and really find out if this cartridge can live up to this hype for the AR-15 Platform.

I ordered RCBS dies, the new Hornady 88 ELD-M projectiles and will be doing load development on this so stay tuned. I plan on loading 53 AMAX (BC .290) for close up and 88 ELD-M for longer distances (BC .485)

Now back to the ammo. There are 5" steel targets at the 200m range I was shooting and I got 38 out of 40 on the targets so the ammo shoots steel just fine, just doesn't group. So as far as the hype and being able to stay supersonic out past 1000y and hitting your targets, it's true of the 75 gn TMJ ammo. Just don't expect it to group. If yours does group, I'd like to know what you are running to compare notes.

Running PSA 20" SS 1:7 with Superlative Arms Adjustable Gas Block and PSA 224 Valkyrie BCG.

So, if you want to be able to shoot heavier bullets, 75+ because they have better BC in the AR-15 platform then 224 Valkyrie is your answer. Cost can vary from $250 (the way I went with just the barrel and bcg from PSA) or a complete upper $499.
 
Scope issues? Worth checking.

What are your 6.5 CM groups?

I’m not a fan of Federal. Some lots of their match .223 were great, others VERY inconsistent. Have a chrony? Reload and try to get a SD in the low teens or better.
 
The barrel came from PSA, but who made it? Lowest bidder? Put a good tube on there and I bet things will get better.
Why are you going to try 53 grain bullets? That's not why you have that caliber. I thought the entire reason it was dreamed up was to shoot the 90's better than the .223. To shoot 90's you want a 6.5 twist.
 
Scope issues? Worth checking.
What are your 6.5 CM groups?
I’m not a fan of Federal. Some lots of their match .223 were great, others VERY inconsistent. Have a chrony? Reload and try to get a SD in the low teens or better.

My 6.5CM groups are 1/2 MOA.

The barrel came from PSA, but who made it? Lowest bidder? Put a good tube on there and I bet things will get better.
Why are you going to try 53 grain bullets? That's not why you have that caliber. I thought the entire reason it was dreamed up was to shoot the 90's better than the .223. To shoot 90's you want a 6.5 twist.

At 100y I don't think it barrel would have that huge of a difference, especially when the same results were observed with 5 different shooters at the same distance. 53g bullets to compete with 22-250 for speed and I would run 88's in the 1:7.
 
That twist rate is for heavy bullets.

1:7 twist and 53 grains? I can blow up 53 gr projectiles or sometimes keyhole them even with .223 at 1:7 twist if I load a little hot. Same barrel with 77’s is sub .5 moa.

Agreed regarding it matters who made that barrel.
 
the factory ammo may have shot great in their test gun. which is not your gun. reload for your barrel doing a ladder and see how it shoots. factory ammo is supposed to shoot ok, its up to you to make it shoot great.

I'm going to roll the new pills once they come in tomorrow and report back. I have a feeling it's the ammo since other people have reported the same.

That twist rate is for heavy bullets.
1:7 twist and 53 grains? I can blow up 53 gr projectiles or sometimes keyhole them even with .223 at 1:7 twist if I load a little hot. Same barrel with 77’s is sub .5 moa.
Agreed regarding it matters who made that barrel.

My mistake, I listed AMAX, I meant VMAX projectile. Hornady loads this in their Superformance loads and has a MV of 3465. This is the same projectile I loaded when I took the coyote my first year out of a Mossberg MVP with a 1:9 twist. Only one way to know if it will fly correctly out of the 1:7 I have is to try it.

Hopefully everything shows up tomorrow and I'll have some time to roll the 53 and 88 pills and report my results. I really think the 75 TMJs are just junk at this current time.
 
Weekend update.

Removed and reinstalled barrel and torqued to 80ft/lbs. Checked and using 1 finger, barrel moves in a circular motion when placed in a vice using a mag block.

Load Data used

Powder - R15

Power Weight - Average Speed - StdDev

Hornady 53g VMAX @ 2.110" COAL
26 - 2887.38 - 18.17
26.5 - 2958.80 - 16.50
27 - 3060.33 - 13.24

No pressure signs

Hornady Factory ammo shows MV @ 3465 and according to Sierra weights - 3250 is their recommended max speed. I might load some at 28. 28.5 to see what speeds can be achieved.

Hornady 88g ELD-M @ 2.260" COAL
23 - 2485.70 - 14.46
23.5 - 2531.20 - 15.01
24 - 2600.90 - 10.92
24.5 - 2641.00 - 12.41

No pressure signs

Hornady Factory ammo shows MV @ 2700 so I am pretty close. I may try to up it to 25 grain to achieve the same speed as the factory ammo since it would appear .5 grains gets me approx. +50fps.

Both bullet weights liked the higher loads. Groups started pretty open but tightened up to about just over 1MOA at the end. Still the same circular pattern.

PSA barrel I have is the A2 profile (hindsight - I should have payed more attention to the barrel profile than the price for the barrel BCG combo) - Tapers down to .645 and then back to .750

On my 6.5 Creedmoor AR10 22" Ballistic Advantage barrel, it's a heavy profile barrel. With my previous experience with their barrels, I opted for their 18" .224 Valkyrie SPR Profile barrel. It starts at .830 and then tapers down to .750 at the gas block. It would appear that the lost in velocity between the 20" and the 18" isn't a huge difference since I will also be mounting a QD mount.

More updates later this week.
 
What is the "one finger barrel check" moving it in a circular direction? I haven't heard of that one.

80 lbs is a LOT of torque on that barrel nut.
 
What is the "one finger barrel check" moving it in a circular direction? I haven't heard of that one.

80 lbs is a LOT of torque on that barrel nut.

My non-scientific method to see how much the barrel flexes with one finger. Barrel profile was an afterthought on this build. Live and learn I guess.

Yes, 80lbs is a lot, I normally don't go that high, but I was trying to rule out that out as there have been suggestions if the barrel nut was on securely.
 
Your SD's are good enough for better accuracy than I see on your 200 yard target. Seems like such a caliber would come in at least a medium wt barrel?

So you are going to try a 18" Ballistic Advantage? I have a 20" BA barrel on my 6.5 CM and it shoots between .4 to .7-ish MOA if I do my part. Couldn't resist buying a 24" Criterion on sale, so eventually I'll see how that does. I'm a fan of Ballistic Advantage and Criterion for very accurate 'value' barrels.
 
Your SD's are good enough for better accuracy than I see on your 200 yard target. Seems like such a caliber would come in at least a medium wt barrel?

So you are going to try a 18" Ballistic Advantage? I have a 20" BA barrel on my 6.5 CM and it shoots between .4 to .7-ish MOA if I do my part. Couldn't resist buying a 24" Criterion on sale, so eventually I'll see how that does. I'm a fan of Ballistic Advantage and Criterion for very accurate 'value' barrels.

I agree, I feel like PSA just pumped out the A2 barrels and chambered the in .224 Valkyrie and called it day. I think if I were to set that barrel up in an M16 clone with and A2 sight and handguard that isn't free floated, it may work better.

So I looked at the article on barrel length and muzzle velocity for this round and the trade off between a 20" and 18" was ok when I add on the QD mount and the extra 6" for a SilencerCo Omega on the end.

I currently have a 22" BA barrel on my Creedmoor and I also get similar results. This was one of the rifles I took to TX with me and took several jacks and pdogs out at 725y+ using Hornady 140 ELD-M
 
Update.

New barrel is in - Ballistic Advantage 18" SPR SS 416R - Comparison of the two barrels.

224_barrels.jpg

Rebuilt rifle - Barrel torqued to 35ft/lbs

224_complete1.jpg

New Alliant data has come out stating max charges for

60g Nosler - 28.6g - My best with 53g Hornady VMAX was 27g of R15 @ 3060.33 - May try 27 / 27.5 / 28 as I am currently 400 fps less than factory spec Superformance in 223
90g Sierra - 25.2g - My best with 88g Hornady ELD-M was 24.5g of R15 @ 2600.90 - May try 24.5 / 25 / 25.5 as I am currently 75fps less than factory spec ELD-M
 
Finally have some updated information.

So I don't have my initial 24.5 - 25 - 25.5 loads with R15 and Hornady 88 ELD-M. Initial loads showed the 24.5 and 25.0 were pretty good, anything above, the groups opened up. With this information I reloaded using 24.5 to 25 with COAL 2.250 and was getting 2600fps - 2650fps.

Results in the photo

Top Left - 24.5
Top Right - 24.6
Middle Left - 24.7
Middle Right - 24.8
Bottom Left - 24.9
Bottom Right - 25

A note on the 24.5 and 24.6 - The bullet seater on the RCBS die was not exact and deforming the bullet. A few minutes and some sacrificial bullets later, the seater was no longer causing this issue.

IMG_20180701_124320.jpg

I shared my reloads with a friend who has the same barrel (swapped from the PSA as well), Fail-Zero BCG. We both have adjustable blocks, mine vents and his was the restrictive type. His best group was the 24.7. Looking at mine, looks like mine could be the same if looking at 24.7 with one flier or 24.8. Considering we both will be going to TX next year and trying to push this out well past 500y and into 800y+ territory, this setup is looking very promising.

Factory Hornady 88 ELD-M shows 2675fps out of a 24" test barrel.

With the 24.7 load - We both are getting MV of 2625fps - 50fps slower than Hornady's advertised speed. For me, that's close enough to factory and I'm ok with that.

Looks like the magic number for my barrel combination is 24.7g R15 @ COAL 2.250" w Hornady 88 ELD-M

Also, even thought we are shooting a 88 grain projectile, with the setup it shoots softer than a 223/556.
 
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