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What would you like to shoot?

  • Total voters
    18
I thought you couldn't loan/rent MG to a non-green card holder in MA any more, or is it just an age thing, you have to be 21?
 
But if they can I hope everyone enjoys it, because with the attention it draws you can bet there will be a new law in MA as soon as they can rush it through.
 
1821gunworks said:
No Green Card is needed to rent, you will be accompanied my a license holder/Range safety officer. There is no MGL that bars rental. A few other shops rent them out in the western part of the state. No need to stir the pot, this is a great opportunity for licensed gun owners to experience something that they may never have prior.
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Actually, there is. Not rental specifically, but transfer/possession. Handing a gun to someone under supervision of a license holder is considered a temporary transfer, and there is a specific exemption allowing the handling of other types of firearms under the direct supervision of the license holder. Why does the law need this specific exemption for handguns, rifles and shotguns when there is no other law prohibiting it? It is because there is such a law, and the existence of the handgun/rifle/shotgun exemption could be used to argue that such an exemption is needed since the words of statutes are to be construed to have meaning.

I suggest you consult an attorney who specializes in firearm law (Langer comes to mind; there are others)

In a similar vein, there have been convictions for ineligible persons (PPs, foreigners not falling under a specific federal exemption who happen to hail from Muslim nations, etc.) being convicted for "possession" of a firearm even when under the direct supervision of a license holder. "That was not a transfer, I was right there with the shooter and the gun" does not cut it with the feds.

There is no such exemption for MG, no matter how much people want to "common sense" such an exemption into existence. This was largely ignored until the accidental shooting at a machine gun shoot out in Westfied, after which the state clarified it position. Some have worked around this (untested) by having the green card licensee hold onto part of the gun while the renter shoots it.

This may fly under the radar and not cause trouble, however, if there is any sort of accident you can be virtually certain that the state is not going to recognize the "common sense imagined exemption".
 
1821gunworks said:
No Green Card is needed to rent, you will be accompanied my a license holder/Range safety officer. There is no MGL that bars rental. A few other shops rent them out in the western part of the state. No need to stir the pot, this is a great opportunity for licensed gun owners to experience something that they may never have prior.
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Sounds great but...

After the Westfield death by uzi of an 8 year old the law was given more scrutiny. I think you are mistaken.

269 sec 10 (c)
... Whoever, except as provided by law, possesses a machine gun, as defined in section one hundred and twenty-one of chapter one hundred and forty, without permission under section one hundred and thirty-one of said chapter one hundred and forty

Whereas 140 sec 129C has an exemption under (m)
... The temporary holding, handling or firing of a firearm for examination, trial or instruction in the presence of a holder of a license to carry firearms, or the temporary holding, handling or firing of a rifle or shotgun for examination, trial or instruction in the presence of a holder of a firearm identification card, or where such holding, handling or firing is for a lawful purpose;

There is no such exemption for the possession of a machine gun

Handing a machine gun to an unlicensed person (MA issued machine gun license) constitutes possession by that person and likely constitutes a transfer by you.



Also, I assume you are a dealer licensed under 140 sec 122. 140 sec 123 are the terms of your license.
... Eighth... and that no machine gun shall be sold, rented or leased to any person who has not a license to possess the same issued under section one hundred and thirty-one

Note that they call out machine gun and license to possess machine gun separately.

Net net, as a dealer you cannot lease or rent to someone without a machine gun license.
An individual cannot possess a machine gun without a license since there is no exemption for being under the supervision of a licensed individual

Then again, IANAL. My opinion above is worth everything you paid for it.
 
Whereas 140 sec 129C has an exemption under (m)
... The temporary holding, handling or firing of a firearm for examination, trial or instruction in the presence of a holder of a license to carry firearms, or the temporary holding, handling or firing of a rifle or shotgun for examination, trial or instruction in the presence of a holder of a firearm identification card, or where such holding, handling or firing is for a lawful purpose;

There is no such exemption for the possession of a machine gun
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Since the OP seems to be incognizant as to the import of certain sections of MGL, it is worth noting that "firearms" as used in most sections of MGL (Chapter 269 section10j being an exception that contains its own definition) means "handguns" and does not include full auto weapon, rifle or shotgun (thus accounting for why the later two are specifically mentioned)

+1 to CrackPot for including the specific references. Well done. Bonus points for the law on rental/lease. I wonder if the OP retained legal counsel to review this business plan.
 
I hope this still happens for those who have a green card, but don’t actually own any fun guns.
 
It's also a pretty steep risk given what the charge and sentence would be. Also, the OP originally said it was for LTC holders. I wouldn't be betting on keeping your LTC even if the charges were dropped. Some people will be ok with the risk, but it's too high for me.
 
Just noticed OP's post is now blank, and I thought I saw one other post from the OP, also gone. Maybe he found a lawyer that works on Sundays.
 
One of his posts mentioned that it was done in the western part of the state. I suspect he had not done his homework (yet) and smartly removed his posts pending a discussion with a lawyer. I wish he could do what he was planning.
 
I wish he could as well, but we don't need any bad publicity, so if he can't it's better he know now than finding out when the black SUVs show up.
 
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