Anyone Use a 12:00 Hold for Sighting?

[Mountain]

A few weeks back I picked up a Remington R1 1911 from a fellow NESer. Great pistol- nice trigger, smooth action, good slide to frame fit. Only issue is that POI is low for me. I intend to use for CMP As-Issued 1911, so fixed sights are required.

While practicing this weekend on 25 yd NRA B-8 targets, I determined that a 12:00 hold puts the shots right on the money. My last full mag / 7 shots resulted in scores of 3-X, 2-10, an 8 and a 7 flyer from a twitch / flinch. Clean up that 7 and I'd be pretty happy with that level of scoring at such a distance.

I actually like the 12:00 hold. It was easy to determine when the sight post was creeping above the top of the bull and also seemed easy to center. SIG refers to their 'Combat Sights' as covering the bull, so maybe this is similar to that.

Anyway, I thought about trying this with a rifle, such as my Garand, so long as I'm not too high with the rear sight near bottom. Not going to try it in the JCG match this weekend, but maybe in the future. Normally I use a 6:00 hold. I prefer that over the 'flat tire hold' as I have some difficulty maintaining a consistent 'flat'. Same for center hold- too difficult to determine if exactly at center.

Anyone else use or try a 12:00 hold?

 

[jasons]

Some rifle shooters I know use something similar (sometimes called a "reverse flat tire hold.") I've tried and it doesn't seem to work for me but everyone's different. If it works for you then go for it.

General shooting rule #63: If it's wrong but it works then it's right.

 

[Mountain]

Some rifle shooters I know use something similar (sometimes called a "reverse flat tire hold.") I've tried and it doesn't seem to work for me but everyone's different. If it works for you then go for it.

General shooting rule #63: If it's wrong but it works then it's right.

Thanks. So it's not a completely goofy method. Just seemed easy to see the corners of the sight post creeping above the top of the bull. My biggest displacement on a match target is usually vertical stringing, and this might help.

 

[jasons]

Thanks. So it's not a completely goofy method. Just seemed easy to see the corners of the sight post creeping above the top of the bull. My biggest displacement on a match target is usually vertical stringing, and this might help.

Not at all. If it works it works.

 

[white feather]

I suppose you have a go to target load for .45 but if you increased the velocity with a lighter bullet and a bit more powder, you should hit lower...

 

[M60]

I suppose you have a go to target load for .45 but if you increased the velocity with a lighter bullet and a bit more powder, you should hit lower...

Pretty sure he's already hitting low. He wants to hit higher with a 6 o'clock hold.

 

[white feather]

Pretty sure he's already hitting low. He wants to hit higher with a 6 o'clock hold.

Oops. Reread it and you are correct. Go with a heavier bullet and a lower velocity?

 

[mac1911]

A few weeks back I picked up a Remington R1 1911 from a fellow NESer. Great pistol- nice trigger, smooth action, good slide to frame fit. Only issue is that POI is low for me. I intend to use for CMP As-Issued 1911, so fixed sights are required.

While practicing this weekend on 25 yd NRA B-8 targets, I determined that a 12:00 hold puts the shots right on the money. My last full mag / 7 shots resulted in scores of 3-X, 2-10, an 8 and a 7 flyer from a twitch / flinch. Clean up that 7 and I'd be pretty happy with that level of scoring at such a distance.

I actually like the 12:00 hold. It was easy to determine when the sight post was creeping above the top of the bull and also seemed easy to center. SIG refers to their 'Combat Sights' as covering the bull, so maybe this is similar to that.

Anyway, I thought about trying this with a rifle, such as my Garand, so long as I'm not too high with the rear sight near bottom. Not going to try it in the JCG match this weekend, but maybe in the future. Normally I use a 6:00 hold. I prefer that over the 'flat tire hold' as I have some difficulty maintaining a consistent 'flat'. Same for center hold- too difficult to determine if exactly at center.

Anyone else use or try a 12:00 hold?

I mean if you like that sight picture roll with it....or shorten the front sight? rough guess is .007" front sight height change will move impact about 1" at 25 yards, roughly

 

[whatluck]

I mean if you like that sight picture roll with it....or shorten the front sight?

This

Also, how's the lockup? Nice and snug?

 

[M1911]

It is fine for bullseye shooting. Back when I competed in service rifle, I used a 6:00 hold. It is not so good for defensive shooting.

 

[Mountain]

CMP As-Issued rules dictate 230 gr ball, so ammo somewhat fixed. R1 running well. I'm going to go with it for now.

 

[PatMcD]

The problem I see with a 12 hold would be that once you are above the bull in that perfect spot, how do you know if you've drifted higher? You would have to have perfect trigger discipline (nobody does) to let the shot go once the sight is at the perfect "12".

File the sight.

 

[mac1911]

It is fine for bullseye shooting. Back when I competed in service rifle, I used a 6:00 hold. It is not so good for defensive shooting.

Can't you just think of 6 o'clock as belly button hold?

 

[Mountain]

The problem I see with a 12 hold would be that once you are above the bull in that perfect spot, how do you know if you've drifted higher? You would have to have perfect trigger discipline (nobody does) to let the shot go once the sight is at the perfect "12".

File the sight.

I've never done this with a rifle, just the R1 1911. At least with that 1911, I can easily see the corners of the front sight post begin to creep over the arc of the bullseye circle. The 'hold' is with the corners of the front sight post just touching the top arc of the bull, so maybe not all the way to a true 12:00 with the top line of the sight post touching the very top of the bullseye circle.

Just an exercise at this point. Right shoulder was still too weak (surgery) to hold the pistol steady for the New England Games, so I just shot an AR and will try the goofy 12:00 hold for my R1 in a competition some other time.

 

[Gammon]

I much prefer a six o'clock hold. You can see more of the target.

 

[Wendell]

...Anyone else use or try a 12:00 hold?

IIRC, John Pride did.