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Are musket balls legal to possess in MA without LTC?

is it an ammunition component?

hmmmm we need a lawyer or someone who stayed at a Holiday Inn last night

Massachusetts resident must have a valid firearms license to possess ammunition. There’s a twist… Massachusetts General Laws Chapter 140 Section 122 defines ammunition as: “cartridges or cartridge cases, primers (igniter), bullets or propellant powder designed for use in any firearm, rifle or shotgun”
Although a firearms license is not needed to possess primitive long guns such as a muzzleloading rifle or shotgun or its ammunition, a firearms license is needed to purchase all ammunition including black powder.



 
remember this?

Legally bought at Spenser's Gifts?


FITCHBURG — A Fitchburg State University student who was expelled from the school Monday was arrested for trespassing Tuesday night and found to be carrying a belt of semiautomatic rifle ammunition.

Andrew K. Despres, 20, of 15 Stowell St., New Bedford, was arraigned in Fitchburg District Court on Wednesday on charges of trespassing on state or county property and possessing ammunition without an FID card.

According to court documents, Despres was dismissed from the university at a Monday conduct hearing for infractions from the previous week, including allegedly possessing marijuana, knives and firecrackers on school grounds. He was also suspected of defacing property in a dorm bathroom.

At the hearing, Despres was told he would no longer be allowed on campus and that when he wanted to retrieve his belongings from his room, he would be required to contact both FSU housing and University Police before setting foot back on campus.


On Tuesday, Despres returned to Herlihy Hall without making the appropriate arrangements, and when university police Officer Philip Karampatsos, who was present at Despres’ hearing, reminded him he was not allowed on campus, Despres allegedly said, “Too (expletive) bad, I’m getting my stuff.”

Karampatsos then pat-frisked Despres and discovered he was wearing a 308 rifle casing feeding belt, according to a report by university Patrolman Christopher Bouchard.

“The feeding belt is the same used by the military for feeding ammunition into large capacity rifles,” Bouchard wrote in the report. “The bullets are approximately 2 inches long, pointed ended full metal jackets.”

Despres was then arrested and sent to state police until his arraignment on Wednesday.

Earlier in the day on Tuesday, FSU President Robert V. Antonucci had sent out a holiday greeting by email to students, to which Despres allegedly responded, “Go (expletive) yourself, yesterday was my birthday and I got kicked out of your school because your staff thinks I’m a threat to society and the community. That is the opposite of good holiday wishes and joyful days you guys all suck.”


Antonucci said FSU has a zero-tolerance policy for drugs on campus, and that Despres was removed from the university for his actions through what he called “serious disciplinary action.” That move was made to ensure the health and safety of the other students in the institution, he said.

“There was no reason for him to have been carrying that ammunition. He didn’t have firearm identification card, and even if he did, he shouldn’t be carrying all that ammunition,” Antonucci said. “I don’t know what his intent was, but I don’t think it was for any good purpose. In the climate today, especially with what happened in Newtown, Conn., there is no excuse for that whatsoever. Our police took the appropriate action and how he’s not on the street.”

FSU spokesman Matthew Bruun said that as Despres is no longer a student, the university would not have any further comment on the specifics of the case as it moves through the court system.

“As always, the university takes the safety of the campus community extremely seriously and we will continue to work with all relevant authorities to assure its security,” Bruun said.

Despres’ bail was set at $50,000 cash or $500,000 surety. He was ordered to stay away from FSU and must undergo a mental health evaluation. If and when he posts bail, Despres will be monitored by GPS. He is due back in court Jan. 3.
 
Fashion accessory or deadly weapon?

That is the question facing Fitchburg District Court Judge Andrew L. Mandell.

Tuesday afternoon, Judge Mandell heard arguments and viewed evidence from both sides in the case against Andrew K. Despres, 20, of New Bedford.

The former Fitchburg State University student spent a week in jail in December on $50,000 cash bail for wearing a post-punk fashion, military-style ammunition belt his mother bought for $20 online at www.Crustpunk.com.

He was arrested Dec. 18 at FSU for trespassing on the campus, from which he had been expelled the day before, and for alleged possession of a belt of semiautomatic-rifle ammunition without an FID card.

After a week in jail, his bail was reduced to $50 by a Worcester Superior Court judge and he has remained on house arrest since.


In court Tuesday, he appeared wide-eyed and a little scared, and stayed silent as his lawyer argued there was no probable cause for his arrest because the ammo belt was a harmless fashion statement and not illegal to own.

Mr. Despres had a much shorter, spike haircut than the green-dyed, long Mohawk he had when he was arrested and dressed conservatively in a light-colored button-up shirt and dark slacks, opting not to dress in the post-punk style that he was known for and that helped get him into trouble.


His lawyer, Mark Meehan of Taunton, presented as evidence many photos of Mr. Despres wearing the ammo belt around his waist — his mother said he had worn it every day since she bought it in 2010 — at the college, shops, to Governor’s Island in New York City, and out with friends. His professors also commented on it before his arrest, he said, so the school was aware he was in the habit of wearing it.
 
Components for "primitive" arms: ball, non-smokeless powder, caps, do not require FID / LTC to possess in DPRM. You need one to purchase them, though.

An in-line ML using 209 primers requires FID / LTC for possession of the primers.

IIRC, a few years back, there was a "hunting accident" down around the cape way, and one of the charges leveled against the accused was unlicensed possession of ammo (primers)

 
Components for "primitive" arms: ball, non-smokeless powder, caps, do not require FID / LTC to possess in DPRM. You need one to purchase them, though.

An in-line ML using 209 primers requires FID / LTC for possession of the primers.

IIRC, a few years back, there was a "hunting accident" down around the cape way, and one of the charges leveled against the accused was unlicensed possession of ammo (primers)

Since this is NES ... but the balls can be used to reload modern ammo, such as 45/70 with 3 lead balls.
 
Since this is NES ... but the balls can be used to reload modern ammo, such as 45/70 with 3 lead balls.
Yes, and nails can be used, as can dimes.


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTfNcrQqgX0


That being said, BP sabot rounds that have jacketed bullets are considered OK, AFAIK, per EPOs at Hunter Ed classes.

The real issue is, is it a component of a fixed cartridge ( in which case, even were it to be loaded with BP, it would be "modern" ammo), or loosies.
 
Per MGL, isn't any component of ammo considered a "firearm"? Like how if you sprinkle some 22LR shells in your friend's hoodie after a range trip and he doesn't have an LTC, gona be in real trouble lol?

What about a musket ball? Legal without LTC?

View attachment 703881
So umm... if you take it out of the packaging, isn't it just a chunk of lead?
 
It's a chunk of pewter even in the packaging
And a magazine is a plastic box with a spring in it that is may be unlawful to posses if it was made after an arbitrary date in the mid 90s. Shows you what they think of you!

The question is where is the line drawn between ammo components that you need a license in MA to posses vs a being just a pewter ball 🤣
 
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Components for "primitive" arms: ball, non-smokeless powder, caps, do not require FID / LTC to possess in DPRM. You need one to purchase them, though.

An in-line ML using 209 primers requires FID / LTC for possession of the primers.

IIRC, a few years back, there was a "hunting accident" down around the cape way, and one of the charges leveled against the accused was unlicensed possession of ammo (primers)

The victim is Jonathan Way, a liberal and coyote reasurcher. It’s the guy that got coyote contests outlawed, and wants humane treatment of these vermin. He’s a cuck.
 
not a musket ball... a Freedom Seed
ddo5oia-1dba588d-9697-4c85-bba4-73c827434a8c.jpg
 
The victim is Jonathan Way, a liberal and coyote reasurcher. It’s the guy that got coyote contests outlawed, and wants humane treatment of these vermin. He’s a cuck.
That was not my point. I was using it as an example of a real-world usage of an unlicensed possession of ammo, for a primer.

Also, he may, or may not be worthy, but the guy still allegedly shot him.
 
remember this?

Legally bought at Spenser's Gifts?


FITCHBURG — A Fitchburg State University student who was expelled from the school Monday was arrested for trespassing Tuesday night and found to be carrying a belt of semiautomatic rifle ammunition.

Andrew K. Despres, 20, of 15 Stowell St., New Bedford, was arraigned in Fitchburg District Court on Wednesday on charges of trespassing on state or county property and possessing ammunition without an FID card.

According to court documents, Despres was dismissed from the university at a Monday conduct hearing for infractions from the previous week, including allegedly possessing marijuana, knives and firecrackers on school grounds. He was also suspected of defacing property in a dorm bathroom.

At the hearing, Despres was told he would no longer be allowed on campus and that when he wanted to retrieve his belongings from his room, he would be required to contact both FSU housing and University Police before setting foot back on campus.


On Tuesday, Despres returned to Herlihy Hall without making the appropriate arrangements, and when university police Officer Philip Karampatsos, who was present at Despres’ hearing, reminded him he was not allowed on campus, Despres allegedly said, “Too (expletive) bad, I’m getting my stuff.”

Karampatsos then pat-frisked Despres and discovered he was wearing a 308 rifle casing feeding belt, according to a report by university Patrolman Christopher Bouchard.

“The feeding belt is the same used by the military for feeding ammunition into large capacity rifles,” Bouchard wrote in the report. “The bullets are approximately 2 inches long, pointed ended full metal jackets.”

Despres was then arrested and sent to state police until his arraignment on Wednesday.

Earlier in the day on Tuesday, FSU President Robert V. Antonucci had sent out a holiday greeting by email to students, to which Despres allegedly responded, “Go (expletive) yourself, yesterday was my birthday and I got kicked out of your school because your staff thinks I’m a threat to society and the community. That is the opposite of good holiday wishes and joyful days you guys all suck.”


Antonucci said FSU has a zero-tolerance policy for drugs on campus, and that Despres was removed from the university for his actions through what he called “serious disciplinary action.” That move was made to ensure the health and safety of the other students in the institution, he said.

“There was no reason for him to have been carrying that ammunition. He didn’t have firearm identification card, and even if he did, he shouldn’t be carrying all that ammunition,” Antonucci said. “I don’t know what his intent was, but I don’t think it was for any good purpose. In the climate today, especially with what happened in Newtown, Conn., there is no excuse for that whatsoever. Our police took the appropriate action and how he’s not on the street.”

FSU spokesman Matthew Bruun said that as Despres is no longer a student, the university would not have any further comment on the specifics of the case as it moves through the court system.

“As always, the university takes the safety of the campus community extremely seriously and we will continue to work with all relevant authorities to assure its security,” Bruun said.

Despres’ bail was set at $50,000 cash or $500,000 surety. He was ordered to stay away from FSU and must undergo a mental health evaluation. If and when he posts bail, Despres will be monitored by GPS. He is due back in court Jan. 3.

Fashion accessory or deadly weapon?

That is the question facing Fitchburg District Court Judge Andrew L. Mandell.

Tuesday afternoon, Judge Mandell heard arguments and viewed evidence from both sides in the case against Andrew K. Despres, 20, of New Bedford.

The former Fitchburg State University student spent a week in jail in December on $50,000 cash bail for wearing a post-punk fashion, military-style ammunition belt his mother bought for $20 online at www.Crustpunk.com.

He was arrested Dec. 18 at FSU for trespassing on the campus, from which he had been expelled the day before, and for alleged possession of a belt of semiautomatic-rifle ammunition without an FID card.

After a week in jail, his bail was reduced to $50 by a Worcester Superior Court judge and he has remained on house arrest since.


In court Tuesday, he appeared wide-eyed and a little scared, and stayed silent as his lawyer argued there was no probable cause for his arrest because the ammo belt was a harmless fashion statement and not illegal to own.

Mr. Despres had a much shorter, spike haircut than the green-dyed, long Mohawk he had when he was arrested and dressed conservatively in a light-colored button-up shirt and dark slacks, opting not to dress in the post-punk style that he was known for and that helped get him into trouble.


His lawyer, Mark Meehan of Taunton, presented as evidence many photos of Mr. Despres wearing the ammo belt around his waist — his mother said he had worn it every day since she bought it in 2010 — at the college, shops, to Governor’s Island in New York City, and out with friends. His professors also commented on it before his arrest, he said, so the school was aware he was in the habit of wearing it.

Tell me that that case was dismissed and he sued for damages. What a bunch of bull shit.

My mom used to wear this back in the late 60s / early 70s:

IMG_E2236[1].JPG

Pulling the leftmost whole cartridge out of the belt acts as a clasp. Primer pockets are empty, and every case has a hole in it at some point.

You can pull those 4 bullets out, though, so there could be some arrest risk! ;)
 
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