Army looking for new submachine gun

[bfm]

BACK TO SUBGUNS? US Army Releases RFI for Sub Compact Weapons - The Firearm Blog

 

[ChevyGuy91]

If someone were smart, they would ground up design a subgun that can use one of the half million of P320 fcgs and mags the Army just ordered. Then make them available to the civilian market.

 

[whatluck]

AR Pattern 9mm SBR that accepts sig mags with a happy switch?

 

[E.Stoner]

Big army is ass backwards. They just got finished ordering up a bunch of pistols no one needs, then they decide the need a PCC subgun that is like a rifle, but has the ballistics of a pistol?
Smart.

ps. I think there are a bunch of companies that are starting to design subguns around the p320 FCU. While they might save some money on magazines. It would probably be better to design an AR around the p320 mag for best ergonomics and no new training for the manual of arms.

Still wondering why a regular rifle or SBR (with a can) wont do.

 

[eboos]

Still wondering why a regular rifle or SBR (with a can) wont do.

Because even the Army is convinced that M16 patterned rifles are too killy now.

 

[whacko]

Big army is ass backwards. They just got finished ordering up a bunch of pistols no one needs, then they decide the need a PPC subgun that is like a rifle, but has the ballistics of a pistol?
Smart.

ps. I think there are a bunch of companies that are starting to design subguns around the p320 FCU. While they might save some money on magazines. It would probably be better to design an AR around the p320 mag for best ergonomics and no new training for the manual of arms.

Still wondering why a regular rifle or SBR (with a can) wont do.

This^

We didn't need the new pistol and the line units don't need a damn sub gun in 9mm......for tank crews and breaching buildings we have this thing called an m4 carbine.

If special operations command needs a sub in 9mm they can buy pretty much whatever they want already.

And.....que the wanna be tactical mall ninjers that all are giggidy about the military looking for a sub in 9mm.

Pass the salt.

 

[whacko]

AR Pattern 9mm SBR that accepts sig mags with a happy switch?

Why do you think the army needs a full auto carbine in 9mm?

 

[enbloc]

 

[Coyote33]

Hey, I used that to weatherstrip my windows last Fall!


The Most Effective Portable Fire Arm In Existence (1925) - The Firearm Blog

 

[Dadstoys]

The originals cost $ 35.00 apiece to make.
Thanks to One Eyed Jack it's one I got off my bucket list to shoot.
And I liked it .

 

[ChevyGuy91]

If the Army really felt the need to go after PCCs, a 7" 300blk upper and a 30cal can for the m4s they already have would make the most sense.

Super quiet ~45ACP ballistics with subsonic, still pretty quiet ~762x39 ballistics with supersonic. Same mags, same training, same just about everything.

 

[Boris]

If the Army really felt the need to go after PCCs, a 7" 300blk upper and a 30cal can for the m4s they already have would make the most sense.

Super quiet ~45ACP ballistics with subsonic, still pretty quiet ~762x39 ballistics with supersonic. Same mags, same training, same just about everything.

stahhhp! you are making too much sense, we are talking about new subgun for the Army. Get drunk then post all your non-practical desires to further the discussion.

 

[bfm]

Now, if the army had kept the M9...

 

[enbloc]

love it...

 

[weekendracer]

I think anyone would be hard pressed to surpass the MP5 in the 9mm subgun market. The gun is a dream to shoot, full auto is pretty controllable from what I remember. I never got to do mag dumps, but 3 rnd bursts were kept in the 5 ring from 15 yards out.

 

[SKumar]

Why don't they make full auto FCUs for their 320 and then make carbine kits to go with it?

 

[Varmint]

I wonder if this another Army request where they have no intention of buying anything?

 

[Varmint]

I think anyone would be hard pressed to surpass the MP5 in the 9mm subgun market. The gun is a dream to shoot, full auto is pretty controllable from what I remember. I never got to do mag dumps, but 3 rnd bursts were kept in the 5 ring from 15 yards out.

If they hand out MP5s to REMFs, I’ll join the army.

 

[exo]

 

[T-Unit]

Why not a Glock 18 with a detachable stock and an RMR red dot?

 

[jrpascucci]

I think the Army definitely needs a new PCC subgun in chambered in 50AE.

Optional belt fed.

Oh, no, wait: that's me. I definitely need it now. I was confused by that "Army of One" campaign when I was younger.

 

[PappyM3]

Why do you think the army needs a full auto carbine in 9mm?

Probably because the RFI spefically mentions select fire and 9mm. I’m not saying it’s the best option, but it’s apparently what they are asking for.

 

[whacko]

Probably because the RFI spefically mentions select fire and 9mm. I’m not saying it’s the best option, but it’s apparently what they are asking for.

What I'm saying is that the line units don't need this system at all.....another big waste of money like the damn sig pistol.

 

[whacko]

If they hand out MP5s to REMFs, I’ll join the army.

Why would you want to join a military because they are issuing a substandard combat weapon? Heavy combat and a sub gun 9mm are not compatible. My point......a sub 9mm is "maybe" something the spec ops command may need.....and they Already can buy what they want.

 

[ChevyGuy91]

Why would you want to join a military because they are issuing a substandard combat weapon? Heavy combat and a sub gun 9mm are not compatible. My point......a sub 9mm is "maybe" something the spec ops command may need.....and they Already can buy what they want.

Yeah, if I were in the business of killing people with firearms, a 9mm subgun probably wouldn't even register on my list of desires.

 

[Varmint]

Why would you want to join a military because they are issuing a substandard combat weapon? Heavy combat and a sub gun 9mm are not compatible. My point......a sub 9mm is "maybe" something the spec ops command may need.....and they Already can buy what they want.

The only thing I can think is maybe they feel a need for close-in combat with unarmed jihadis, a la Mogadishu, where an MP5 would have been fairly effective. Something for downed helicopter crews or vehicle crews.

But way more likely is it's just more Army silliness, and they'll look at a bunch of offers from manufacturers, maybe do a lot of testing even, and then drop the project. I'm not sure the motivation but it probably involves money.

 

[whacko]

Yeah, if I were in the business of killing people with firearms, a 9mm subgun probably wouldn't even register on my list of desires.

Not even remotely.

The sub guns of the WW2 era filled the role of a long gun for tankers and crew members. We have the m4 now....all is well.

 

[OIFer]

e

 

[ThePreBanMan]

Sounds like .good investment for a country 21 trillion in debt.

 

[whacko]

^Agree

Specialized units can and do already have whatever weapons they need for their missions.

9mm Sub guns are generally worthless in combat. Circa 2003 the contractors in Iraq were all carrying MP5s on missions until people started shooting at them with rifles from behind cover 200 yds away. Sub Guns are good when operating in tight quarters or if you are riding in tight civilian vehicles, but 9mm is generally worthless in most combat situations.

If Big Army wants a compact rifle, I would simply suggest a M4, folding stock, SBR so they can shoot 5.56 & won't have to re-train everyone on a new guns operating system.

I was there during the "blackwater" security days. Those a**h***s thought they were all that and a bag of chips with the blacked out suburbans and their mp5s. Case in point.....only the giggidy tacticool wannabes are the ones thinking a sub 9mm is something the army needs.