71montess
NES Member
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Army/Marines want more from their recruits.
- Thread starter 71montess
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fencer
NES Member
Duh, if we were smahrt, we wouldn't have joined the Suck. And we sure as shit wouldn't have stayed Infantry.
A guy I know was 6062 , aircraft something or other, and we got talking and he said, " You were an 03 Marine?", and he looked at me like I was retarded... LOL
A guy I know was 6062 , aircraft something or other, and we got talking and he said, " You were an 03 Marine?", and he looked at me like I was retarded... LOL
They want that along with the 'Mothers of America' pussified rules for Recruit Training. You can't have both.
Let the Drill Instructors do their jobs and get the f*** out of the way, or expect a sub-standard product...period.
Some of the guys I'm getting these days are still decent, but I'm thinking they were probably disciplined by their parents before heading to PI. The other 2/3rds of boots, I can't even believe they're in the same branch of service as the rest of us they're so f***ed up. Either the recruiters are getting really desperate, or our beloved Chesty signed a deal with the devil. Either way, things aren't exactly on the up and up right now. I'm well beyond my obligated contract, but still showing up because there's no one capable of leading right now. I understand that it's my duty to create the next leader, but i need some clay to make a brick...all I have is red mud.
Let the Drill Instructors do their jobs and get the f*** out of the way, or expect a sub-standard product...period.
Some of the guys I'm getting these days are still decent, but I'm thinking they were probably disciplined by their parents before heading to PI. The other 2/3rds of boots, I can't even believe they're in the same branch of service as the rest of us they're so f***ed up. Either the recruiters are getting really desperate, or our beloved Chesty signed a deal with the devil. Either way, things aren't exactly on the up and up right now. I'm well beyond my obligated contract, but still showing up because there's no one capable of leading right now. I understand that it's my duty to create the next leader, but i need some clay to make a brick...all I have is red mud.
DitchDigger
NES Member
Ur dealing with millelianals
Sarge I need somebody to wipe my ass
Sarge I need somebody to wipe my ass
I hate to be the barer of bad news...but...did you know Kevin Spacey touches little boys?
If your name is fencer, stop reading now...
...i mean it.
...is he gone?
...can you believe he was surprised by that? 03's are like 'box of hammers' retarded...but let's keep that between us.
I went to PI with basically all millenials. It's what happens THERE that can change someone. If Drill Instructors aren't allowed to do their jobs without all the red tape...what's the point?
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snax
NES Member
My buddy joined the navy for 4. He is going on year 19 I think. Same complaints.
Are you sure it's red mud? Could be bloody stool.
I work with a couple of young 20s kids recently discharged. Good hardworking guys. Im sure their respective branches are missing them.
I'm not picking up what you're putting down.
So it's me? And all the other NCO's in my company?
Actually just trying to understand your statement though.
M60
NES Member
Hey, go easy on the 03's.
I was an 0331 and very proud of it. I also started my international marketing company while achieving a high 6 figure income. So much for your box of hammers. By the way, how you doin $
![[wink]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/002.gif "Wink [wink]")
I hope you guys know I was kidding. Some of the smartest Marines I've crossed paths with have been ground-pounders...including my SDI at basic. He was awarded Marine of the Year in 2016 by Marine Corps Times.
I do feel bad for you guys sometimes though...I see your type on foot patrols as we roll by in our wreckers and 7-tons. We make water/chow runs to your FOB and guys look like they would trade you their sleeping system (or a hand job) for a can of dip...lol.
I guess it's the life you chose, but it's certainly not for the faint-hearted. I know I couldn't do it...so thank YOU both for doing the dirty work.
I do feel bad for you guys sometimes though...I see your type on foot patrols as we roll by in our wreckers and 7-tons. We make water/chow runs to your FOB and guys look like they would trade you their sleeping system (or a hand job) for a can of dip...lol.
I guess it's the life you chose, but it's certainly not for the faint-hearted. I know I couldn't do it...so thank YOU both for doing the dirty work.
Go figure...I never even knew there was a gen Z.
I'm not at all aware of any 'obvious reasons' for not joining though? Care to elaborate? I'm genuinely curious.
snax
NES Member
Not you, was saying my friend is running into the same issues with some of the younger guys, he keeps resigning because his superiors really value his contribution and hard work.
The two guys I'm referring to that I work with are probably missed by the military because they are stand up hard working guys.
I see alot of young kids in their 20's in the private sector who still think they are in jr high. I imagine the military certainly gets its fair share of these.
I agree with you about the next leader, it seems like this group doesnt want to lead, they want to be led. They want to make a conttibution, but only if "meaningful" and it makes them feel good. They want fun work over the hard work.
A substantial subset of Gen Z has been labeled Gen Zyklon. They're patriots and have no interest in joining any organization that puts the interests of certain "victim" groups over the purported purpose of the organization.
I'm still not trackin'...'victim' groups? like with regards to ROE?
Thank you for responding, but I think you might be overestimating my knowledge of the subject. Gotta break it down Barney-Style for me
Thank you for responding, but I think you might be overestimating my knowledge of the subject. Gotta break it down Barney-Style for me
I have a theory on the infantry, specifically as it relates to the Marine Corps. The infantrymen are the smartest members of the USMC. The reason is simple, what kind of idiot decides to go into the Marine Corps to do anything other than locate, close with, and destroy the enemy? Joining the Marine Corps to be "admin" or "food services" makes you a moron... and in my experience, they usually are. Not disparaging their MOS by any means, MOST MOS's are critical to the war machine functioning -- but don't call us grunts dumb for joining the Marine Corps to be the epitome of what the Marine Corps is... /rant (this is of course a little sarcastic... but people don't typically wind up in combat arms due to lack of intelligence when joining a force renowned for their ability to blow shit up and fight dragons).
That said... POG life is good. Glad I did the infantry thing. Glad I left the infantry.
As to the incoming Soldiers/Marines being pieces of shit, soft, etc. I feel like that's a generational thing. Everyone is boot to someone else, and the "old corps" always finds the "new corps" soft.
Mike
That said... POG life is good. Glad I did the infantry thing. Glad I left the infantry.
As to the incoming Soldiers/Marines being pieces of shit, soft, etc. I feel like that's a generational thing. Everyone is boot to someone else, and the "old corps" always finds the "new corps" soft.
Mike
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namedpipes
NES Member
It might just be lack of coffee but I can't parse those words... Wut?
Put yourself in the shoes of an 18yo male today. You've got some outdoors experience, you're physically fit, you've got some background in firearms whether hunting or target shooting. Your public education has emphasized to you that you're racist because of your white skin and you recognize the hypocrisy. You've observed that it's okay to mock Christians and denigrate them - no one gets punished or told off for that. However if you say anything remotely derogatory about Mohammed, spaghetti monsters, or mother earth, or chew a poptart into an L-shape, you immediately get detention, letters sent home, etc. Blacks and Hispanics get away with whatever they want because if any administrator says anything, the student plays the race card and the administrator is punished. You were thinking about going to college, but they don't want you because you have white skin or not female. How about the military, you've got the foundation for those skills?
About that military: a four-star general starts spouting off about diversity and how great it is. By the way he says, diversity isn't our physical characteristics, it's the way we think and our backgrounds. Five seconds later he invites you to come visit the current crop of recruits at Basic and says you can "see the diversity with your own eyes!" (This actually happened in a non-attribution environment)
This military would rather harangue men about sexual assault than perform rifle drills and discuss transgender issues than practice throwing grenades. All the same things mentioned in school above are also present in the military. By the way it's also trying to encourage women into combat roles they generally aren't physically fit for - rather reminiscent of those colleges that didn't want you either. You'll just have to lug around extra water and ammo for them because they have their hands full with just the body armor (half the time they don't even carry most of the plates or any at all). There is muzzle strike practice, and if you get squared off with a female and don't strike her hard enough dammit she's not getting the training she needs, but if you strike her a bit harder and knock her down you're bullying her (also an actual event).
Gen Z isn't blind, they know all this is going on and have no interest in being part of it. Why should they?
About that military: a four-star general starts spouting off about diversity and how great it is. By the way he says, diversity isn't our physical characteristics, it's the way we think and our backgrounds. Five seconds later he invites you to come visit the current crop of recruits at Basic and says you can "see the diversity with your own eyes!" (This actually happened in a non-attribution environment)
This military would rather harangue men about sexual assault than perform rifle drills and discuss transgender issues than practice throwing grenades. All the same things mentioned in school above are also present in the military. By the way it's also trying to encourage women into combat roles they generally aren't physically fit for - rather reminiscent of those colleges that didn't want you either. You'll just have to lug around extra water and ammo for them because they have their hands full with just the body armor (half the time they don't even carry most of the plates or any at all). There is muzzle strike practice, and if you get squared off with a female and don't strike her hard enough dammit she's not getting the training she needs, but if you strike her a bit harder and knock her down you're bullying her (also an actual event).
Gen Z isn't blind, they know all this is going on and have no interest in being part of it. Why should they?
namedpipes
NES Member
I believe they dropped the hand grenade training from Basic and I don't think they mix flavors during hand to hand combat training, but other than that I see what you were getting at. At least better than the first reading!
Respectfully, I think the only thing accurate in your rant is the absurd amount of powerpoints we are subject to -- and dot be fair Mattis has said, and it has been my experience thus far, that this is to be significantly reduced.
If I ever had someone tell me they were gonna join the military BUT and cite anything from your rant I'd call them a beta little pussy and tell them we don't need them anyway. People who don't serve yet feel the need to tell others why they don't serve all the time are just little bitches. The military aint for everyone, and I hold that against nobody except those who feel the need to make excuses. They can f*** off.
Mike
If I'm correct you would be hard pressed to find anyone that would admit to it anyway much less broadcast those reasons. Their alternative jobs would be at risk because they'd be on the record as homophobic mysogynistic racists. They would likely say they had no interest without further explanation and only when directly asked.
Do you have an alternative explanation for why Gen Z's most fit members aren't volunteering for the military as much as previous generations?
I'm sure there are myriad reasons, including how divided our country is. There isn't exactly an overwhelming sense of nationalism now, nor has there been since shortly after 9/11. We are "democrats" and "republicans" now, each group trying harder than the other to destroy our country... not surprising a lot of people just want to do their own thing.
As a volunteer force most of the country doesn't serve. I can't imagine having not done it, but most of the population makes out just fine. It never seemed like a big deal to me, but I can see why some are turned off by the idea of indentured servitude.
Mike
As a volunteer force most of the country doesn't serve. I can't imagine having not done it, but most of the population makes out just fine. It never seemed like a big deal to me, but I can see why some are turned off by the idea of indentured servitude.
Mike
I suppose that's where our opinions differ. I believe Gen Z (the part that might have served otherwise) is very nationalistic and they don't see the military so. You believe the military is nationalistic and Gen Z is not.
Most people serve to serve a higher purpose, or at least that seals the deal. Not to say it's completely selfless by any means, but if you didn't have a specific adventure driven goal or want the benefits I don't see how you'd sign on the dotted line in today's climate.
I went back in for 1. The people and 2. The adventure/opportunities. I wasn't as rah-rah go America the second time around.... though I do firmly believe we are the best country in the world. Can only speak for myself though.
The military is still on average much more nationalistic and "f*** the bullshit" than the country at large.
Mike
I went back in for 1. The people and 2. The adventure/opportunities. I wasn't as rah-rah go America the second time around.... though I do firmly believe we are the best country in the world. Can only speak for myself though.
The military is still on average much more nationalistic and "f*** the bullshit" than the country at large.
Mike
Even the military still pays lip service to perception being just as important as reality. What is Gen Z's perception of the military? Is it nationalistic to defend borders in Iraq and Afghanistan while illegals flood into our homeland? It's the same hypocrisy they went through school with: being called racist and subjected to privilege-checking lectures because their skin is white. Can you see through their eyes?
The world you grew up in is not the world Gen Z is growing up in. Therefore it doesn't make sense they would make choices the way you (or I) did. I offered an explanation of their choices and the background that fed those choices, particularly for the members of that generation who, if they'd grown up 20 or 40 years ago, would have likely joined the military - but aren't doing so today. What I'm asking is, can you understand their perspective as I've offered it, or do you have evidence for a more plausible explanation?
Cap'n Mike
NES Member
My service was in the Army, but I always loved this story.
"Legend has it that the United States Marine Corps was born on 10 November, 1775, at Tun Tavern, in Philidelphia, Pennsylvania. On that day, the Continental Congress passed a resolution authorizing two battalions of Continental Marines. The resolution was sponsored by John Adams. Since 1921, the Corps has celebrated its birthday as 10 November.
Tun Tavern was a popular meeting place of 18th century Philadelphians. The tavern was frequented by sailors and other seafaring men, so it was a logical place to conduct the business of recruiting."
When the Navy officers set up a table in the Tun Tavern and started interviewing prospects, they were a bit relieved to finally find a young man who fit their requirements. They had him sign the book, paid him his dollar, and bought a round of rum to toast the enlistment. They were so happy to finally get the whole process underway, they even had a second round. They then send him off to a table in the corner to wait.
After a few more interviews, they found a second recruit, who soon joined the first.
"This is great," the second recruit said. "They paid me right away, and even bought me a tot of rum!"
"Hunh," sneered the first. "In the Old Corps they bought us two."
