Bullet Casting PID Temperature Controller

[Knob Creek]

This looks interesting:

'MYPIN PID Temperature Controller for Bullet Casting - Demo and Parts List. Using the TA4-SSR PID Controller on my Lee Pro 4 20lb Lead Casting Furnace. These instructions should work equally well for the TA4-SNR and many other Mypin controllers. This setup is not exclusive to lead furnaces. It should work great for smokers, home brewers, sous-vide cooking, or any other application that requires a PID temperature controller. Your thermocouple requirements will likely be different and you might want different size fuses, but the setup should otherwise be universal.'



View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AgixJeF0vEU&feature=youtu.be&fbclid=IwAR0dHjncTGhVDINX1RXKM27R7MnGWCk8MJr5A-o23KSMPKz1OihJMezyhbE



View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wShNNiHbJew

 

[pastera]

Have thought about it but I haven't been inconvenienced enough when adding lead to the pot to really consider the time and cost
I've found preheating ingots in the toaster oven (for Hitech coating) to ~400° and adding at half a pot is enough to keep temps stable

 

[mac1911]

I was going to build one from the cheap fleabay providers when gou could get the kit for $35 or so.
Im not sure how fast it can control the heat but if it can keep your pot stable from full to 1/4 full while casting it would be good. Not sure if its worth the $40-$100 extra though?
I have had times when i looked at my pot and seen the temp well beyond what i needed as the lead level lowers. If a PID can keep that in check thats nice, is it needed?

 

[pastera]

I was going to build one from the cheap fleabay providers when gou could get the kit for $35 or so.
Im not sure how fast it can control the heat but if it can keep your pot stable from full to 1/4 full while casting it would be good. Not sure if its worth the $40-$100 extra though?
I have had times when i looked at my pot and seen the temp well beyond what i needed as the lead level lowers. If a PID can keep that in check thats nice, is it needed?

PID should be able to keep it within a few degrees as measured at the temp probe - manual chosen at random showed a 0.5s control period which is plenty fast enough for a pot full of lead

 

[Jbarila]

I built one would not cast without one now. Been using it for about 4 years.

 

[mac1911]

I built one would not cast without one now. Been using it for about 4 years.

what/who did you use for your parts. I would like to buy everything in one spot if possible. Last I looked into it it was get the controller here, relay there, probe over there. there is a guy on castboolits selling a plug and play set up for $125 IIRC?

found it

VS: 120v/220V PID controllers for sale - MAY 2021 update

I sell two different setups. Setup #1 - $125 shipped 274975 This is a very compact setup. Designed to control 1 device. Basically it is horizontal. Setup #2 - $165 shipped - these are currently build to order https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171119/e6f1d91d819a446e310231d42c8ea357.jpg

castboolits.gunloads.com

 

[Jbarila]

Wow your are asking a lot from 4 years ago! I had some of the parts and shopped around to get the best prices. I spent probably around $70.
Here is the article I used. Simple build and it works great.

 

[38ExtraSpecial]

I built a PID controlled electric heat treating furnace once.
I sourced all of my hardware from Omega. They had an awesome selection and I didn’t have to worry about getting screwed on some eBay crap.

 

[01SVTvert]

I sourced all my parts from ebay. Only problem is I had to look up the directions for the PID by googling the PID type. Easy enough to do, though.

 

[mac1911]

what is the difference in the DIN "size" 1/32 , 1/16, 1/4 waht does that mean and why does it matter

 

[KMM696]

what is the difference in the DIN "size" 1/32 , 1/16, 1/4 waht does that mean and why does it matter

For this application, it doesn't matter. It's an industry standard for cutout sizes in control panels. Pick the size you like.

What Are The Standard DIN Sizes of Panel Mounted DIN Temperature Controllers? | West CS

 

[pastera]

@mac1911 - If you are looking at building one let me know, I'm going to be ordering some thermo couple connectors

The heat sink included with most of the kits is garbage but is fine for use on a Lee pot with a small fan on it - an old CPU heatsink that measures 60mm x 45mm or larger is 10x better.
If your CPU heatsink is a little too small, just use a piece of 1/8" aluminum in between and put thermal grease on both sides.
Old power supplies are also a good source of heatsinks and wire.
You can hard wire a USB charger into the case and use old 5v PC fans to cool everything (or use a 120v 80mm muffin fan)

With a decent scrap bin a controller can be built for <$30 (you do need a better thermocouple than the controllers come with)

PID: $9.29

REX-C100 LED Dispaly PID Temperature controller relay SSR k Type Thermocouple | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for REX-C100 LED Dispaly PID Temperature controller relay SSR k Type Thermocouple at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.com

SSR: $3.50

SSR-40DA 40A Solid State Relay Module 3-32V DC Input 24-380VAC NEW | eBay

We don't accept dispatch request to the third country. Other Countries. PRODUCT TYPE&CONDITION.

www.ebay.com

Thermo couple: $4.06

3m/10ft High Temperature K type 100mm Probe Sensor Stainless Steel Thermocouple | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for 3m/10ft High Temperature K type 100mm Probe Sensor Stainless Steel Thermocouple at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.com

For power in/out, cut an extension cord in half and use the rest of the wire length to wire the controller.

 

[mac1911]

@mac1911 - If you are looking at building one let me know, I'm going to be ordering some thermo couple connectors

The heat sink included with most of the kits is garbage but is fine for use on a Lee pot with a small fan on it - an old CPU heatsink that measures 60mm x 45mm or larger is 10x better.
If your CPU heatsink is a little too small, just use a piece of 1/8" aluminum in between and put thermal grease on both sides.
Old power supplies are also a good source of heatsinks and wire.
You can hard wire a USB charger into the case and use old 5v PC fans to cool everything (or use a 120v 80mm muffin fan)

With a decent scrap bin a controller can be built for <$30 (you do need a better thermocouple than the controllers come with)

PID: $9.29

REX-C100 LED Dispaly PID Temperature controller relay SSR k Type Thermocouple | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for REX-C100 LED Dispaly PID Temperature controller relay SSR k Type Thermocouple at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.com

SSR: $3.50

SSR-40DA 40A Solid State Relay Module 3-32V DC Input 24-380VAC NEW | eBay

We don't accept dispatch request to the third country. Other Countries. PRODUCT TYPE&CONDITION.

www.ebay.com

Thermo couple: $4.06

3m/10ft High Temperature K type 100mm Probe Sensor Stainless Steel Thermocouple | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for 3m/10ft High Temperature K type 100mm Probe Sensor Stainless Steel Thermocouple at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.com

For power in/out, cut an extension cord in half and use the rest of the wire length to wire the controller.

Looked into it last weekend. i did not find any of the long K probes in stock the places i looked.
Trying to get everything from one spot if i can.
Its a project thats about 6-8 on the list to do so no rush.

Question : do you bypass the pot thermostat knob or just crank it up and leave it.

 

[pastera]

Turn it up - I don't bypass just in case the thermo couple fails or is pulled out of the melt.

 

[mac1911]

So I dug this out of a box, power unit for a old PC and a brushless 12v fan.
Something useful for the future PID controller?

 

[Gusp]

Sorry to sidetrack for a sec. I'm intrigued by the thought of making something like this for my Lee bottom-pour pot, but I don't even have a lead thermometer. I have to remelt a lot of bullets because they either are frosted or aren't filling out.

Anything I need to know about thermometers? Are analog preferable to digital, and are cheap ones as good as luxe versions?

I mention the last point because I just got a (Hornady - cheap) dial caliper because my cheap digital one that everyone seems to use has a habit of suddenly jumping exactly .02 (or whatever it is) for no apparent reason.

ETA: correct brand of calipers.

 

[Artie]

Sorry to sidetrack for a sec. I'm intrigued by the thought of making something like this for my Lee bottom-pour pot, but I don't even have a lead thermometer. I have to remelt a lot of bullets because they either are frosted or aren't filling out.

Anything I need to know about thermometers? Are analog preferable to digital, and are cheap ones as good as luxe versions?

I mention the last point because I just got a (Hornady - cheap) dial caliper because my cheap digital one that everyone seems to use has a habit of suddenly jumping exactly .02 (or whatever it is) for no apparent reason.

ETA: correct brand of calipers.

I grabbed the Lyman Digital thermometer because it was on sale for $19.99. The reviews are 50% good and bad but mine hasn't had any issues and is accurate. I left it in my Lee furnace and the plastic on the probe started to deform so this is only used for spot checking. I still plan on getting an analog that can be left in the pot. Good luck
Amazon product ASIN B01MZ7O109View: https://www.amazon.com/Lyman-Digital-Lead-Casting-Thermometer/dp/B01MZ7O109

 

[pastera]

Sorry to sidetrack for a sec. I'm intrigued by the thought of making something like this for my Lee bottom-pour pot, but I don't even have a lead thermometer. I have to remelt a lot of bullets because they either are frosted or aren't filling out.

Anything I need to know about thermometers? Are analog preferable to digital, and are cheap ones as good as luxe versions?

I mention the last point because I just got a (Hornady - cheap) dial caliper because my cheap digital one that everyone seems to use has a habit of suddenly jumping exactly .02 (or whatever it is) for no apparent reason.

ETA: correct brand of calipers.

Your Hornady calipers are pretty much the same as the $10 harbor freight ones.
If they are jumping put a good silver battery in first (sr44 vs lr44). You can use the alkaline LR44 but the voltage drop off near end of life can cause issues.
Next, take it apart and clean it - it doesn't take much crap between the sensor and body to cause issues (some loving attention by deburring helps all around in this step)

Mechanical thermometers - cheap will drive you to Chuck them across the shop

Digital - cheap ones will have more error from poor cold junction compensation but for our purposes it's not much of an issue (a few degrees off at 700 won't matter)

 

[Gusp]

I guess I will try that, since the electronic ones aren't worth much to me if they can't be trusted.

I figured that the money I spent on the Hornady dial calipers was represented by the snazzy red bezel around the dial and "Hornady" on the face, and the fact that I needed some new dies anyway and live 40 miles from the nearest Harbor Freight.

 

[pastera]

Sorry to sidetrack for a sec. I'm intrigued by the thought of making something like this for my Lee bottom-pour pot, but I don't even have a lead thermometer. I have to remelt a lot of bullets because they either are frosted or aren't filling out.

Anything I need to know about thermometers? Are analog preferable to digital, and are cheap ones as good as luxe versions?

I mention the last point because I just got a (Hornady - cheap) dial caliper because my cheap digital one that everyone seems to use has a habit of suddenly jumping exactly .02 (or whatever it is) for no apparent reason.

ETA: correct brand of calipers.

Just reread your post - mechanical calipers.

You have smegma in your pinion gear - tooth brush and solvent to clean both rack and pinion gear

 

[Gusp]

Just reread your post - mechanical calipers.

Thanks pastera, no, the problem I have is with the electronic ones. I just got a new mechanical one to replace it. Maybe there is a piece of hair or something like that in the optical sensor. I know that played hell with my computer mouse and I thought somebody had hacked my machine until I realized what the real problem was.

 

[pastera]

I guess I will try that, since the electronic ones aren't worth much to me if they can't be trusted.

I figured that the money I spent on the Hornady dial calipers was represented by the snazzy red bezel around the dial and "Hornady" on the face, and the fact that I needed some new dies anyway and live 40 miles from the nearest Harbor Freight.

Amazon product ASIN B0799F29TXView: https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B0799F29TX/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_hTZiFb7G4YHNH


I don't like the fractional readout but they work well.
If you only use them for reloading then the plastic ones are cheaper but will wear faster

 

[pastera]

B

Thanks pastera, no, the problem I have is with the electronic ones. I just got a new mechanical one to replace it. Maybe there is a piece of hair or something like that in the optical sensor. I know that played hell with my computer mouse and I thought somebody had hacked my machine until I realized what the real problem was.

Battery then disassemble and clean
They are capacitive not optical but either way they don't deal well with crap between the body and sensor

 

[mac1911]

So I dug this out of a box, power unit for a old PC and a brushless 12v fan. View attachment 376404
Something useful for the future PID controller?

Question for you Pastera, am I using the PC power pack with the pid controller or am I shredding parts from inside the power pack?
With out looking into it much how does one run the 12v fan if I build a pid with a fan to help cool the relay . Im going to gander that heat kills the inexpensive relays quickly?

 

[pastera]

Question for you Pastera, am I using the PC power pack with the pid controller or am I shredding parts from inside the power pack?
With out looking into it much how does one run the 12v fan if I build a pid with a fan to help cool the relay . Im going to gander that heat kills the inexpensive relays quickly?

You can use any case - old PC cases are good if you don't have a case and don't have access to a box brake.

Easy way to cut openings is to draw the layout 2d, print it and elmer's glue it to the panel.

The case,wire and power input is all that I used - you could recover a heatsink to mount the SSR. The 40 amp SSR will dissipate about 14 watts while heating from cold so you don't need much cooling. The pot doesn't take a lot of power steady state.
I used a 120v muffin fan from my parts bin - about $12-15 on amazon/ebay.

 

[mac1911]

You can use any case - old PC cases are good if you don't have a case and don't have access to a box brake.

Easy way to cut openings is to draw the layout 2d, print it and elmer's glue it to the panel.

The case,wire and power input is all that I used - you could recover a heatsink to mount the SSR. The 40 amp SSR will dissipate about 14 watts while heating from cold so you don't need much cooling. The pot doesn't take a lot of power steady state.
I used a 120v muffin fan from my parts bin - about $12-15 on amazon/ebay.

cool, the heat sink in this power pack is tiny. Cant see it doing much with out the fan? I will figure something out. still have not ordered the PID/Relay/probe. I might have a old HF brake at work but not sure if I got scrap metal to work with ?

 

[pastera]

cool, the heat sink in this power pack is tiny. Cant see it doing much with out the fan? I will figure something out. still have not ordered the PID/Relay/probe. I might have a old HF brake at work but not sure if I got scrap metal to work with ?

I have a couple of old ATX supplies hanging around and I was thinking about building another one. If you like I can order a spare kit (or two) - use it as a demo on how to build one.

 

[mac1911]

I have a couple of old ATX supplies hanging around and I was thinking about building another one. If you like I can order a spare kit (or two) - use it as a demo on how to build one.

If yoy end up ordering add a set for me

 

[pastera]

Ordered three PID controller kits (controller, SSR, heatsink, TC panel mount connector and 100mm probe)

The following are examples of what is needed to complete:

Case - an old ATX power supply (Check the input connector to make sure it is rated at 10 amps or higher)

old ATX (80mm fan):
Amazon product ASIN B07GTQ1TQPView: https://www.amazon.com/uxcell-Cooling-SF8025-Sleeve-Bearings/dp/B07GTQ1TQP/


Newer PS (120mm fan):
Amazon product ASIN B076H3HYX8View: https://www.amazon.com/Zhanye-Muffin-Computer-Cooling-Exhaust/dp/B076H3HYX8/


A power switch:

Gardner Bender 20 Amp Single-Pole Toggle Switch (1-Pack) GSW-121 - The Home Depot

The Gardner Bender 20/10 Amp Toggle Switch features spade terminals and on-off single-pole, single-throw circuitry. This switch fits standard 1/2 in. mounting holes and is ideal for industrial equipment

www.homedepot.com

Outlet

Leviton 15 Amp Commercial Grade Tamper Resistant Single Outlet, White R52-T5015-0WS - The Home Depot

It is easy to comply with the 2008 NEC mandate for TR Receptacles in all new residential housing. This requirement resulted from a Consumer Product Safety Commission study that reported alleged injuries

www.homedepot.com

You can skip the switch and just unplug it
You can cut an extension cord in half and use that instead of the outlet (or the PS input connector)

Heck, you can skip the case completely if you want to get lit up in the middle of a casting session...

 

[mac1911]

View: https://youtu.be/M5XNqO6-uqY