The point is, you are going to shoot iso naturally under stress. It is how your body reacts to high stress. Why would you teach anything else. especially when it limits you mobility and agility.
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Calling all experts - can it be that I simply cannot handle Glock (19)? I shoot
- Thread starter sbi
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The point is, you are going to shoot iso naturally under stress. It is how your body reacts to high stress. Why would you teach anything else. especially when it limits you mobility and agility.
Honestly, in the unlikely event I'm ever in a gunfight, I suspect that I'll either be hauling ass to cover, or shooting from behind cover. The chances of my needing to consider the best stance while standing still out in the open are slim. My arms will still likely be in Iso, but the lower body may be contorted every which way.
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because I don't base real life on that article. I'm talking about guys who can't shoot, and need help. What works for you doesn't necessarily work for the other guy, and the idea of training him ( or her) to something completely foreign to them is ridiculous. You use what you have. Sally is comfy in the isosceles, she's hitting, then bingo, Sally shoots from that stance. Harry can't hit the backstop from the isosceles, so you try something different, something you know he's gonna default to. If it works for you then that's great, and I'm not trying to sell books like that guy in the article, I'm trying to get shooters on the paper with what they're comfortable with.
I do actually wear the same rig on or off duty, but m not a great example because I'm a detective lol.
Agreed- cover is a lovely commodity in a gunfight.
GJH86
NES Member
Why is everyone getting so butt-hurt about effin stance? I actually move and shoot in weaver and, if circumstanes permit, will square up to my target once movement is no longer required or necessary. Do what works for you...problem solved.
D
Deleted member 12999
I split the difference between iso and weaver... stress... no stress. Pistol rifle shotgun or fistfight... I try to stay consistent. It just works for me. Less decision making.
Nope. I'm suggesting that if Jerry Miculek was having tennis balls shot at his nuts while he was shooting, things would be a lot different.
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Exactly that. It appears you have grasped the concept perfectly!
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I'll word it a different way, because the same philosophy you are talking about applies in my field. There are different ways of doing something, and sometimes you have to find the right technique and tool that works in your hands. If the textbook method doesn't get the job done, then you try something else until you find a way to produce consistent, repeatable, and clinically excellent results & everyone goes home happy.
So isoceles works for one person, Weaver the next. Pad works for some, whole finger for others. All i know is if I'm ever getting shot at, I'm returning fire any which way I can.
The very fact that the OP in this thread, can 1. Already hit the side of a barn, 2. Has a willingness to spend his own money on ammo 2. Will invest his own money and time on training, 3. Is not a 17 year old rookie and 2. Does not assume he knows everything. Seems to already exclude him from your line of specific training by your description of clientele and ability
It seems as though this thread was already answered by post no 3 anyway.
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What I can't figure out is why you only have one green doohickey under your name?
+1
The most important thing is to tuck your pistol close to your chest after shooting and look up and down the range...
Seriously, any time a human being interacts with a mechanical device: hammer, drill, scalpel, or handgun, it is a compromise between comfort and operation. You need to find a comfortable grip and stance that still allows you to maintain control of the handgun. This requires experimentation and practice, and may not be the same for every handgun. Figure out what does not work for you and then don't shoot that way. Eventually you will figure out what does work.
Chris
Seriously, any time a human being interacts with a mechanical device: hammer, drill, scalpel, or handgun, it is a compromise between comfort and operation. You need to find a comfortable grip and stance that still allows you to maintain control of the handgun. This requires experimentation and practice, and may not be the same for every handgun. Figure out what does not work for you and then don't shoot that way. Eventually you will figure out what does work.
Chris
The thread surely went off topic, but the reality is, it's all part of shooting well. Without actually seeing the OP shoot, we are launching advice his way. It's tough to fix an issue without seeing at least a target. Watching the OP shoot is clearly the best way to diagnose his issues. My guess, and quite a few others, was jerking/ flinching on the trigger squeeze. I'm sorry I don't have any videos for ya, but I'm sure you can learn from YouTube and COD.
I find it amusing that you mock my initial curiosity at the advice you were offering. Many internationally respected law enforcement, military and competition shooters offer free videos demonstrating their individual views on specific techniques.
Do you treat all your students curiosity with learning something new with the same level of mockery?
Any sources on this other than the one posted previously? I'm genuinely curious about this.
Personally, I find Weaver/boxing stance much more natural...
Of course, I am the inventor of the mockumentary, it's a short movie on making fun of people.
In all seriousness, I took your initial " do you have a video" post as sarcasm, and if I was incorrect, I apologize.
It's great that respected LE and military guys make videos, it gives viewers a new option to try or emulate. But most of these guys put these videos out because they are selling " their way" . Remember, everyone that's wearing an instructor hat is correct, everyone else is doing it wrong.
So no, I don't treat all my students like that ( well except for the cops, they get made fun of constantly), what I do is asses each one, if they're hitting, and they are happy with how they're hitting, then great. We then tune that to perfection ( or what passes for it). The students that are sucking, that's different. If what you're doing isn't working, then we need to make a change. Sometimes it's as simple as teaching the trigger reset, or drawing out the sight picture/ sight alignment on paper. Most people have no idea that the eye can only focus on one thing at a time, and don't grasp why that one thing( when shooting ) needs to be the front sight post. Everyone's different, and shooting well is a very different thing from individual to individual.
You offered advice that flies in contradiction of many shooting methods, military, LE, and competition, and you openly mock and critique a video by another member that I know I couldn't match ( can you?)
You insist on talking stance and being "fired at" when the OP made no mention of that, you continually state that whatever works for "you" is best and then state how wrong others are for not doing it your way.
You must be doing something special, and yes I'm genuinely interested in what you have to say/teach
Edit: I'm not a cop, so the likely hood of he option for cover is pretty low, as is the likely hood of a sustain gun battle
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I assure you I'm not doing anything special, I'm just doing what works for each individual that comes my way. If it's not broken, I don't attempt to fix it. If it's broken, I give options to help fix it, very simple. The OP didn't mention pretty much anything we've been talking about, we have very much gone astray. The reason being fired at is brought up, is because it changes things immensely. Why do we go to the range? To practice. Practice for what? The possibility of being involved in a situation where you're called to use deadly force ( yes I realize that is not why everyone goes to the range).
I am absolutely not saying that whomever isn't doing it my way is wrong, read my posts. I've said multiple times, if it works for you then keep at it. But if you're sucking, let's try something else.
I don't think I mocked the video that super moto posted, but he did post it, and asked me what I thought. If you took that as mockery, you may need thicker skin.
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Rear sight blurry, front sight clear, target blurry. Shooting 101. Just talking basic marksmanship.
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If that works for you, then great. You had your foot out MX style in 1A. I dragged knee. I did 17s regularly, how fast did you go? What am I gonna be focused on in a handgun fight? Scenario dependent, right? Distance, direction, etc. up close I'm pulling out and spraying. If I have time, I'm heading for cover, and taking aimed shots. Whether you like it or not, everything does change when shit is headed your way. If you'd like, you can come to the fall qual we do, and I will shoot tennis balls at you, and see how it goes.
youve lost me.
Basic marksmanship is rear sight blurry, front sight clear, target blurry. I'm not talking about anything other than that. So I guess I took the bait.
No idea what you mean about me double talking over myself and answering questions no one asked me.
The push-pull isometric stress of Weaver is absolutely not natural. Also, note that having your weak foot slightly in front of your strong side foot does not mean you are shooting Weaver nor does it mean that you aren't shooting Iso.
This.
I'm sure that you can indeed take an aimed shot with a target focus. Add distance though, and that changes, right? I'm talking basics. Aimed shots. Beginner shooters ( or sometimes not) that aren't hitting. Clearly, you're hitting, so what you're doing, works for you. But it doesn't mean it works for everyone else, right?
And the point of the tennis balls is to force shooters to react, get cover, and return fire. Or to shoot and move , or move and shoot. I obviously can't shoot real bullets at the shooters, because they would be dead. The tennis balls are an excellent alternative to being dead.
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we are talking basic marksmanship here, not what you do, or what supermoto does. The basics. Up close is a lot different than far away, right? Point shoulder vs aimed shots.
