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Chris Costa training MA LEOs

bill o

bill o

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There's a video on fb of Costa demonstrating prone one handed (presumably injured) shooting to police somewhere in MA.

https://www.facebook.com/Official.Chris.Costa

Do you guys think this is a good use of scarce police resources? For a typical police officer who shoots once or twice a year, would he really retain how to pull off this highly stylized maneuver in a real gunfight? Or is it just trendy weekend warrior stuff you'd see at a typical Pincus/Yeager course?

Has there ever been a case of a cop actually using this skill (weak handed draw then go to prone) on the street?
 
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My random opinion, not worth much: It's a good drill, and it doesn't cost any more (time or ammunition) then standing there and shooting targets any other way. Being able to get to your gun with either hand, to transfer it hand-to-hand in various ways, to reload one handed, and to fire effectively from any position is just good training. There is no reason to be a bad weak hand shooter, to be completely reliant on the dominant hand to get the pistol into action, or to be unable to deliver hits from a bad position. Obviously, basics should come first, but this looks like a reasonable exercise to me.
 
Is Costa an LEO?
Curious to know if he was using pre-ban or limited capacity mags? How many of us could show up at Moon Island with standard cap mags.
 
You're assuming the regular LEO who only shoots to requal when they are forced to is taking that class. I'd put money on it that the LEO's in that class aren't shooting once a year.
 
We all complain because cops in general can't shoot minute of barn, yet bitching and moaning ensues when they are provided training to be better.

I hope they would continue to practice what they've learned on their own time to be more proficient, and hopefully, next time they engage a hostile, there will be less holes in the nearby homes and innocents.
 
Now all the cops are going to start doing slow motion reloads and shooting while urban prone.

And I'm sure Chris Costa gets about what I make in a year just to do a 6 hour seminar.

I wonder if he taught them how to have buttecks with Travis.
 
I know a dude that took this class, he said it was operationally awesome. I only have a beef with cops getting fun toys and training that the rest of us can't.
 
edmorseiii said:
I know a dude that took this class, he said it was operationally awesome. I only have a beef with cops getting fun toys and training that the rest of us can't.
Click to expand...

He needs to spread the wealth around. Good training like that is like herpes, it's a gift that could potentially keep on giving, unless your a greedy bastard and keep it under wraps.

Give me your training warts.
 
AllaSnackbah said:
He needs to spread the wealth around. Good training like that is like herpes, it's a gift that could potentially keep on giving, unless your a greedy bastard and keep it under wraps.

Give me your training warts.
Click to expand...

Do you think Costa has unique expertise that one can obtain only through paying for his class? It seems to me that the method for weak hand draw is obvious; how else would you do it?
 
bill o said:
Do you think Costa has unique expertise that one can obtain only through paying for his class? It seems to me that the method for weak hand draw is obvious; how else would you do it?
Click to expand...

Honestly it wouldn't matter to me. I jump at any opportunity to better myself, what you take from it is your business.

Its pretty obvious how to hit the piss puck at the urinal too but if Chris Costa, or any instructor for that matter, is willing to take the time to teach me a new way, or even how to perfect the old trick, I'm there.
 
I feel fairly confident that there have been LEOs (and others) who have been injured and had to carry on the fight in that condition.

The 64 dollar question is, do you spend countless hours practicing such a tactic (which you may never need) or do you learn it once in a class and practice it a bit for the (highly unlikely but possible) event that you might need it one day?
 
FSTC said:
Is Costa an LEO?
Curious to know if he was using pre-ban or limited capacity mags? How many of us could show up at Moon Island with standard cap mags.
Click to expand...

The reality on the ground is the AWB is pretty much universally ignored unless a prick LEO or a DA/ADA wants to use it to wreck someone. That entire law is mostly a running joke in this state, with limited exceptions.

-Mike
 
drgrant said:
The reality on the ground is the AWB is pretty much universally ignored unless a prick LEO or a DA/ADA wants to use it to wreck someone. That entire law is mostly a running joke in this state, with limited exceptions.

-Mike
Click to expand...

Imagine if more people realized this, NES threads would be a lot less cluttered with useless "are those prebans?" posts.
 
edmorseiii said:
Imagine if more people realized this, NES threads would be a lot less cluttered with useless "are those prebans?" posts.
Click to expand...

They are pretty useless, but then again, I suppose some people don't want to be "the limited exception"- even if the odds of winning mass millions are probably better.

-Mike
 
AllaSnackbah said:
Honestly it wouldn't matter to me. I jump at any opportunity to better myself, what you take from it is your business.

Its pretty obvious how to hit the piss puck at the urinal too but if Chris Costa, or any instructor for that matter, is willing to take the time to teach me a new way, or even how to perfect the old trick, I'm there.
Click to expand...

Check out some of these classes.

http://www.neshooters.com/styled-51/styled-44/index.html

You'll learn a lot from any one of them and probably more by attending the Summit in April.
 
IMHO, the more firearms training that LEOs get, the better. From what I've been told, injuries to the hands are common during gunfights, as shooters often tend to focus on the other shooter's gun. So I think weak hand draw and weak hand shooting are a good thing.

Is it likely that an officer will have to shoot weak hand prone? Probably not, but the drill gets him out of his comfort zone.
 
derek said:
You're assuming the regular LEO who only shoots to requal when they are forced to is taking that class. I'd put money on it that the LEO's in that class aren't shooting once a year.
Click to expand...

This too. I bet the guys in the class were not a random selection, but rather the small percentage who want to train or get to train because they are go-to guys (SWAT, whatever) when shooting is anticipated.
 
I wasn't going to comment in thread with the initial derp, but I'll toss in some thoughts.

bill o said:
Do you guys think this is a good use of scarce police resources? For a typical police officer who shoots once or twice a year, would he really retain how to pull off this highly stylized maneuver in a real gunfight? Or is it just trendy weekend warrior stuff you'd see at a typical Pincus/Yeager course?

Has there ever been a case of a cop actually using this skill (weak handed draw then go to prone) on the street?
Click to expand...

I wouldn't really call it that stylized. It was more like a small subset of the entire CCW day. Chris makes stuff look easy, and there are details that he covered (relative to safety) that were important. Add the fact that it was a CCW day, and guys were wearing all types of rigs, we spent some time talking about all of the variations, and how it impacted your draw. Especially relative to any kind of h2h transition or groundfighting. I don't have any documented accounts of a guy having to draw weak hand and go prone, but it was 30 minutes out of my day to try it.

derek said:
You're assuming the regular LEO who only shoots to requal when they are forced to is taking that class. I'd put money on it that the LEO's in that class aren't shooting once a year.
Click to expand...

You would win money.

whatluck said:
Now all the cops are going to start doing slow motion reloads and shooting while urban prone.
And I'm sure Chris Costa gets about what I make in a year just to do a 6 hour seminar.
I wonder if he taught them how to have buttecks with Travis.
Click to expand...

Why would we do slow motion reloads? He was really fast. $700 for 3 days. There wasn't a buttsehks portion, but cough up some money and ask him to do a custom syllabus?

edmorseiii said:
I know a dude that took this class, he said it was operationally awesome. I only have a beef with cops getting fun toys and training that the rest of us can't.
Click to expand...

Agreed. I'm not going to discuss in open forum, but to put it simple... it wasn't just cops... and no-one eye-****ed anyones gear.

FPrice said:
I feel fairly confident that there have been LEOs (and others) who have been injured and had to carry on the fight in that condition.

The 64 dollar question is, do you spend countless hours practicing such a tactic (which you may never need) or do you learn it once in a class and practice it a bit for the (highly unlikely but possible) event that you might need it one day?
Click to expand...

I don't think it's a matter of practicing countless hours on a tactic. It's about testing variables, and not wanting the first time I experience a problem to be in real life.

drgrant said:
The reality on the ground is the AWB is pretty much universally ignored unless a prick LEO or a DA/ADA wants to use it to wreck someone. That entire law is mostly a running joke in this state, with limited exceptions.

-Mike
Click to expand...

Boom.

LenS said:
Check out some of these classes.

http://www.neshooters.com/styled-51/styled-44/index.html

You'll learn a lot from any one of them and probably more by attending the Summit in April.
Click to expand...

Len is right on. There are instructors in that class that Costa specifically endorsed when I asked him who he would pay money to train with.

economist said:
This too. I bet the guys in the class were not a random selection, but rather the small percentage who want to train or get to train because they are go-to guys (SWAT, whatever) when shooting is anticipated.
Click to expand...

give or take:
1/4 non-leo
1/4 patrol guys that love guns
1/4 SWAT
1/4 Instructors

and quite a few of us paid our own way... just to ease the NES butthurt.
 
I guess I'm skeptical of paying top dollar for instruction from a guy who makes zombie videos and action figures in his own likeness. If it was a solid class then that's good.
 
bill o said:
I guess I'm skeptical of paying top dollar for instruction from a guy who makes zombie videos and action figures in his own likeness. If it was a solid class then that's good.
Click to expand...

I can't excuse the zombie stuff... or No Easy Day... I can say that the action figure thing was a joke, and he makes fun of himself about it. I don't know if the guy has fired shots in anger, kicked in doors, or has bodies on his magazines. I don't care. What I do know, is that he's technically really good, and has the ability to impart that knowledge in layered drills and commentary that makes sense. There are plenty of guys who are great at shooting, but you wouldn't want to sit through a class with them.

Being a great teacher is a completely different skillset imo.
 
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