Dangers ? of polygonal barrels

[Executive]

I was having a discussion at the range the other day with a couple of guys shooting Glocks. They were shooting lead reloads and I politely warned them that it was not a good practice with the factory Glock barrel. It was my understanding that polygonal rifling and lead bullets are bad juju. I mentioned that H&K and Kahr also used polygonal construction. They were not impressed, and continued shooting. I let the range officer know what I said, and left. Two questions:
1. Are there any other manufacturers besides Glock, H&K, and Kahr that use this construction?
2. Should I mind my own business?


Chris

 

[jasons]

1. From Wikipedia (FWIW "Companies that utilize this method today include Heckler & Koch, Glock, Magnum Research, Česká Zbrojovka (CZ,) and Kahr Arms."
2. I think you did the right thing. If you have a safety concern (and you could definitely argue that this is at least a potential safety concern) you should tell the RSO and let him make the call. I don't see anything wrong with bringing it up. (I doubt most RSOs would do anything about it though.)

 

[highlander]

You can fire lead (cast) bullets out of a Glock,but you should run a brush thru the barrel on a regular basis. The biggest offender is the 40 S&W more for the fact that the cases are not fully supported in the chamber. A switch to an after market barrel solves the problem nicely

 

[Lugnut]

It's good to inform them IMO.. but some people are stubborn. I shoot will a good friend that insists that lead isn't a problem... but I disagree. However as you know... the manual discourages the use of reloads as well... we all do that though. Would you tell the RSO that?

 

[Executive]

It's good to inform them IMO.. but some people are stubborn. I shoot will a good friend that insists that lead isn't a problem... but I disagree. However as you know... the manual discourages the use of reloads as well... we all do that though. Would you tell the RSO that?

I have no problem with reloads in a Glock, as long as they are jacketed. I suspect Glock discourages reloads to protect their product from out-of-spec rounds. Glock must also feel theat factory centerfire ammunition is manufactured by a company with deeper pockets than the typical reloader so if there is a problem, someone is there to pay... With lead rounds, it does not matter who made it. The lead builds up on the polygonal barrel and increases the pressure in the barrel after each shot. Eventually, KB. So, no, I would not mention to a RO anything about a guy shooting jacketed reloads through a Glock.

Chris

 

[meth0d]

Lots of people shoot lead through factory barrels, as long as you keep an eye on the barrel and clean the barrel more frequently, leading should not be a problem. One of the ranges near by provides lead bullets to shoot in the Glocks they rent, and I know of no kB's at their establishment.

 

[Scrivener]

I shot hard-cast lead reloads through my G23 for quite some time without experiencing the infamous Glock Ka-Boom; neither did I suffer lead poisoning, halitosis or the heartbreak of psoriasis from doing so.

That said, I wasn't an idiot about it. I ran a couple of jacketed rounds through the gun every 80 - 100 rounds of lead and used the bore brush Glock thoughtfully provided on a regular basis.

 

[Gammon]

I have been shooting hard cast lead through my Glocks, 22 and 24L, with no problems. I do clean them religiously every four hundred rounds or so. 20,000 rounds worth of experience has convinced me that the Glock/Lead problem is a myth.

 

[Dirtypacman]

I have used them in my no longer owned H&K without any negative effects

 

[oneswithfunes]

You can fire lead (cast) bullets out of a Glock,but you should run a brush thru the barrel on a regular basis. The biggest offender is the 40 S&W more for the fact that the cases are not fully supported in the chamber. A switch to an after market barrel solves the problem nicely

How is the 40 a bigger problem with lead than any other caliber? How does the chamber affect this?

It's good to inform them IMO.. but some people are stubborn. I shoot will a good friend that insists that lead isn't a problem... but I disagree. However as you know... the manual discourages the use of reloads as well... we all do that though. Would you tell the RSO that?

If you disagree can you elaborate on any leading problems you have had? Do you have any first hand experience with leading problems and polygonal barrels?

I shot hard-cast lead reloads through my G23 for quite some time without experiencing the infamous Glock Ka-Boom; neither did I suffer lead poisoning, halitosis or the heartbreak of psoriasis from doing so.

That said, I wasn't an idiot about it. I ran a couple of jacketed rounds through the gun every 80 - 100 rounds of lead and used the bore brush Glock thoughtfully provided on a regular basis.

This is what I do. Keep a eye on and shoot away. Hard cast and soft cast. I have over 5k in my 17 and no problems. It does take far longer to clean.

 

[Lugnut]

If you disagree can you elaborate on any leading problems you have had? Do you have any first hand experience with leading problems and polygonal barrels?

I have never had any as I only use plated or CMJ. I have read several articles on this. One that I recall was pretty good was in "The Glock in Competition", I've read more but can't recall the sources off the top of my head. I figure avoiding lead is cheap insurance.

 

[Gammon]

How is the 40 a bigger problem with lead than any other caliber? How does the chamber affect this?


If you disagree can you elaborate on any leading problems you have had? Do you have any first hand experience with leading problems and polygonal barrels?


This is what I do. Keep a eye on and shoot away. Hard cast and soft cast. I have over 5k in my 17 and no problems. It does take far longer to clean.

I did have some accuracy problems with the 9mm 17. Using my reloads with an industry standard 130 gr .356 lead bullet at 1000 fps I got horrible accuracy and key holing at 25 yds. A switch to a slighly larger bullet (130 gr lead .357 dia. @ 1000 fps) cured the problem and yielded four inch groups, off hand at 50 yds.

 

[Remsport Mfg]

Remsport Mfg. has stainless steel match barrels with standard rifling available for all Glock models. You can shoot lead safely through our barrels and the price is $110.00 all sizes we also have Remsport Mfg. ss match conversion barrels and threaded end barrels for your Glock at the same price. Turn your 40 into a 9 your 10 to a 45 your 45 to a 10 your 10 to a 9X25 Dillon or your 40 to a 357Sig
Contact us
413 579 1994

 

[oneswithfunes]

Interesting. I should go and check the size of my 9mm mold. The load I have for my lead bullets is very accurate. I worked it up when I started reloading and have not changed it since. More of a luck thing than anything else.

 

[DukeInFlorida]

The people shooting lead from Glocks are most likely reloaders who are very well aware of the Glock warnings, and have had no problems shooting lead. As has been said, it's always important to remove any lead buildup from the bore to eliminate any chance for the bullet to become wedged in the barrel.

Reloaders are like everyone else. No one likes it when the religious zealots of the world tell us time and time again that we are damned, and to repent, etc.

So, I am presuming that your "warnings" might been received in the same way that any preaching would have.

I don't think there's a safety issue, as long as the shooters do what they most likely do anyways. Check and clean as needed.

I don't own a Glock, but shoot a LOT of lead bullets. My Beretta doesn't mind the lead, and seldom gets any lead fouling at all.

I always mop some Militec-1 in the bore when I am done cleaning. That stuff is like Teflon for guns!

 

[drgrant]

The only reason HK/Glock/Kahr warn against this is because if the reloader is a moron and uses lead bullets which are inappropriate (eg, too soft, wrong size, etc) a catastrophe can result.

I don't consider it a safety issue worthy of "informing" someone over. If a Glock or an HK goes tits up on the line, the operator is going to receive the brunt of the KB anyways. (Usually most of the energy from the KB goes down into the frame of the gun ).

-Mike

 

[drgrant]

How is the 40 a bigger problem with lead than any other caliber? How does the chamber affect this?
.

Because if there is a pressure excursion, .40 S+W is more likely to violate the upper limits of what the gun can handle. The unsupported Glock factory chamber weakens .40 S+W brass through repeated firings. This makes .40s more likely to experience a casehead blowout in a Glock than all the other calibers put together.

This isn't just a lead thing, but in some .40 S+W KBs, it could be a contributing factor.

-Mike