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DQ video

M1911

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Are you insinuating I can't shoot. I do pretty well for an old guy with failing eyes. I have gone and watched a couple IDPA matches and most of the shooters there seemed to be under control but there was a lot going on, lot of room for mistakes.
Videos like the one that started this thread scare the shit out of me. I will have to take the word of people who go to these all the time that these events are rare. I just don't want to be the rare guy who gets shot.

When was the last time you heard of someone getting shot at an IDPA/USPSA competition?

Seriously, go to one of those competitions. I suggest Steel Challenge as it is the most approachable. Just watch.

As it is, you are making a decision based on no first-hand information. You are like the folks who say you should never have guns in your house because you saw an article about a moron who shot himself in the hand while "cleaning" his Glock.
 
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When was the last time you heard of someone getting shot at an IDPA/USPSA competition?


As it is, you are making a decision based on no first-hand information.
So the video is fake and the shooting while someone was down range didn't happen.
You are like the folks who say you should never have guns in your house because you saw an article about a moron who shot himself in the hand while "cleaning" his Glock.
Your comparison is irrelevant and wrong. I am all for everyone having a gun in the house. The guy who shot himself in the hand is the same kind of guy who would shoot his balls off trying to upholster in the car. you cant fix stupid[/QUOTE]
 

bigblue

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Are you insinuating I can't shoot. I do pretty well for an old guy with failing eyes. I have gone and watched a couple IDPA matches and most of the shooters there seemed to be under control but there was a lot going on, lot of room for mistakes.
Videos like the one that started this thread scare the shit out of me. I will have to take the word of people who go to these all the time that these events are rare. I just don't want to be the rare guy who gets shot.


The level of awareness for safety and muzzle direction, skill, and healthy respect at the average USPSA event is far beyond that of any range I have seen. Come and watch to see for yourself: safety is take very seriously and newcomers are treated with respect while being carefully guided. This video is a compilation from years and years of events across the country yet how many people were injured?

I am more afraid to shoot at a public range than I would ever be at a USPSA event.
 

drgrant

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So the video is fake and the shooting while someone was down range didn't happen.

It's not fake but it happened at one match out of god knows how many that year, etc. You gotta put risk into perspective; if I treated something else, driving, like that; where I got shocked because of some heinous shit I saw one time while I was doing it.... by that standard, basically I would literally never be able to drive a car ever again. Ever. [laugh] I've had several "hey I probably just avoided death or serious injury" experiences while driving, same can't be said for shooting, and even out of the few safety issues which could have potentially hurt me, none of those ever happened at a sanctioned match.

If we were to put such things into an actuarial table of risk or whatever, attending a USPSA/IDPA/Steel Challenge match would probably still be far safer than riding on a commercial airliner, which is pretty safe, in relative terms.

-Mike
 
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When was the last time you heard of someone getting shot at an IDPA/USPSA competition?
You cannot make an omlette without breaking eggs. Yes, it has happened - VERY rarely.

Auto racing and skydiving have occasional breakage as well and it is not always the fault of the victim. Neither of these sports uses the rare example of an accident as "proof" that the activity is, in general, unsafe or should not be engaged in.
 
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Are you insinuating I can't shoot. I do pretty well for an old guy with failing eyes. I have gone and watched a couple IDPA matches and most of the shooters there seemed to be under control but there was a lot going on, lot of room for mistakes.
Videos like the one that started this thread scare the shit out of me. I will have to take the word of people who go to these all the time that these events are rare. I just don't want to be the rare guy who gets shot.

No one has any basis to insinuate anything about your shooting ability because you don't shoot matches. Your fears are not based in reality, and if you came to a match you'd be pleasantly surprised.
 
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No one has any basis to insinuate anything about your shooting ability because you don't shoot matches. Your fears are not based in reality, and if you came to a match you'd be pleasantly surprised.
Fair enough, I will try to take in another and I will pay close attention to the safety measures in place.
 
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As an SO I've seen some fairly stupid things.I have yet to give out a DQ though because the situations weren't of epic proportion (so far everyone has responded well to me yelling muzzle in their ears). I'm more amazed I haven't gotten a DQ myself yet. An unintentional mistake away from happening I guess. I'm also glad my son is very active in USPSA and IDPA and the other competitors and SO's have taken time to show him how to move properly and safely while moving or reloading etc. If in anyway I felt either "game" was unsafe I wouldn't let him compete.
 

bigblue

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Fair enough, I will try to take in another and I will pay close attention to the safety measures in place.

The safety rules very much apply to the action shooting sports.

Here's an example, just a little sample:

One of the biggies is keeping your booger off the bang switch when not using it. You know, like when running or reloading. Launching a round over the berm in the midst of a speed reload BC you used your booger as leverage on the bang switch is the end of your day.
 

M1911

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As an SO I've seen some fairly stupid things.I have yet to give out a DQ though because the situations weren't of epic proportion (so far everyone has responded well to me yelling muzzle in their ears).

I've DQ'ed two people on low-light stages. In the first case, it was late at the end of a long day. During unload and show clear, the competitor stowed his light, thinking that he'd stowed the magazine. He cycled the slide without removing the magazine. I was tired and saw what I expected to see. He pulled the trigger and bang -- shot a round into the backstop. No one was endangered, but it was still a mandatory DQ.

In the second case, it was also near the end of the squad's day. During unload and show clear, the shooter didn't stow his flashlight and was juggling the flashlight and magazine in his support hand. As he moved that hand to stow the mag in his right side chest pocket, he passed his left wrist directly in front of the muzzle. Another mandatory DQ.

I've since learned to be very cautious when running a shooter on a low-light stage. I tell them first to stow their flashlight, then unload and show clear. And I watch very carefully for them to actually remove the magazine, to avoid seeing what I expect to see.

I feel like I'm missing an incident, and that I DQ'ed a third person, but I can't recall it at the moment.
 
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As an SO I've seen some fairly stupid things.I have yet to give out a DQ though because the situations weren't of epic proportion (so far everyone has responded well to me yelling muzzle in their ears). I'm more amazed I haven't gotten a DQ myself yet. An unintentional mistake away from happening I guess. I'm also glad my son is very active in USPSA and IDPA and the other competitors and SO's have taken time to show him how to move properly and safely while moving or reloading etc. If in anyway I felt either "game" was unsafe I wouldn't let him compete.

Some years ago Harvard ran a sectional match. I was ROing on a stage where there was a port with 2 targets on both sides of a door. The usual procedure was the shooter would move to the left port to shoot the targets, move to the right port to shoot those targets, then turn toward the door to pass into the next section of the stage. I had one guy who, rather that turning left 90 degrees decided to do a 270 to the right, sweeping everyone downrange including myself with a loaded gun. I remember the look in his eyes as he looked straight at me and realized that something was very wrong.

Yes, I DQ'ed him.
 

M1911

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. I feel like I'm missing an incident, and that I DQ'ed a third person, but I can't recall it at the moment.

Now I remember. Also at an NER IDPA match. There was a prone stage. During the walk through, competitors were allowed to go prone to check out the shooting position. One of the guys went prone, got up, and his gun was left behind -- it had come out of his holster when he went prone.

As DQs go, that one was a bummer. Oh well. He knew his holster was too loose, but he didn't fix it and so he paid the price. Still a bummer, though.
 
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Now I remember. Also at an NER IDPA match. There was a prone stage. During the walk through, competitors were allowed to go prone to check out the shooting position. One of the guys went prone, got up, and his gun was left behind -- it had come out of his holster when he went prone.

As DQs go, that one was a bummer. Oh well. He knew his holster was too loose, but he didn't fix it and so he paid the price. Still a bummer, though.

That is a DQ in IDPA?
It is not is USPSA, as long as the situation is addressed correctly.
 

drgrant

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That is a DQ in IDPA?
It is not is USPSA, as long as the situation is addressed correctly.

Isn't the deal in USPSA you're supposed to summon an RO to retrieve the gun (presuming it was a gun that just fell out of a holster without someone handling it) but with a loaded gun if dropped, is always a DQ?

-Mike
 

M1911

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That is a DQ in IDPA?
It is not is USPSA, as long as the situation is addressed correctly.

It is in IDPA.

2.3.2 If a competitor drops a loaded or unloaded firearm or causes it to fall within a stage boundary it is a Disqualification from the match

If the competitor was outside of the stage boundary -- say at the car, or at the safe table -- then it wouldn't be a DQ.
 
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It is in IDPA.



If the competitor was outside of the stage boundary -- say at the car, or at the safe table -- then it wouldn't be a DQ.
If at any time a USPSA competitor drops a loaded gun, It is certainly a DQ


We have a great example of IDPA silliness rules.
People bump into each other during target taping / stage reset, you could trip and fall on the way to the porta-john, any number of things can cause an unloaded gun to fall from holster.

gun falls out of holster within a stage boundary -DQ
gun falls out of holster at the porta-potty -not DQ

What is the reasoning behind that one?
 

drgrant

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The only thing I can possibly think of is it is a roundabout way of trying to deter people from using shitty equipment or at least to be mindful of their gear, but the "portapotta OK stage not" thing is kinda baffling. Maybe they think odds of the gun somehow magically having ammunition in it are greater on a stage. Even most of the speed holsters these days have some kind of a locking mechanism on them, and every time I've seen a gun fall out of one of those holsters, the locking thing was broken or either not used by the owner because lazytown.... [laugh]

-Mike
 
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The only thing I can possibly think of is it is a roundabout way of trying to deter people from using shitty equipment or at least to be mindful of their gear, but the "portapotta OK stage not" thing is kinda baffling. Maybe they think odds of the gun somehow magically having ammunition in it are greater on a stage. Even most of the speed holsters these days have some kind of a locking mechanism on them, and every time I've seen a gun fall out of one of those holsters, the locking thing was broken or either not used by the owner because lazytown.... [laugh]

-Mike

lazytown maybe, forgetfulltown more likely, under the match adrenaline I have forgot to lock my race holster. Later on the following stage I was ROing and my gun dropped while chasing a running shooter. That was an interesting one, I had to get the scorekeeper to pickup my gun after I cleared the shooter.
 

M1911

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If at any time a USPSA competitor drops a loaded gun, It is certainly a DQ We have a great example of IDPA silliness rules. People bump into each other during target taping / stage reset, you could trip and fall on the way to the porta-john, any number of things can cause an unloaded gun to fall from holster. gun falls out of holster within a stage boundary -DQ gun falls out of holster at the porta-potty -not DQ What is the reasoning behind that one?

Reasoning? From IDPA Galactic Headquarters? Surely you jest?

[laugh]

I won't attempt to defend this rule.
 
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People bump into each other during target taping / stage reset, you could trip and fall on the way to the porta-john, any number of things can cause an unloaded gun to fall from holster.
The lesson here is if you are shooting a match in which dropping a gun while working a stage is a DQ, do as little taping and steel resetting as possible.

but with a loaded gun if dropped, is always a DQ?
In USPSA, it's any dropping after load and make ready until after the gun is cleared and holstered at the end of a stage, whether loaded or not.
 
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Neither was I. I've never seen a Cooper Tunnel in a match. Are they still used?

I've seen shooters turn the wrong way on several occasions, sweeping the RO and squad. I've rarely seen an ND.

The Cooper Tunnels I have encountered were so low that you had to crawl and thus could not draw your gun until you had exited. If the tunnel's dimensions were generous enough to allow the competitor to draw while still inside, I would expect the stage brief would be required to warn against this practice.
 
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The Cooper Tunnels I have encountered were so low that you had to crawl and thus could not draw your gun until you had exited. If the tunnel's dimensions were generous enough to allow the competitor to draw while still inside, I would expect the stage brief would be required to warn against this practice.

The cooper tunnels I have seen have been in the middle of the stage, if I was using one as an MD, thats how I would use it.
 
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So my big take away from that video is the low percentage of time the RO actually stopped the competitor. A lot of time it looks like they were just letting them continue
 

M1911

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So my big take away from that video is the low percentage of time the RO actually stopped the competitor. A lot of time it looks like they were just letting them continue

No, they didn't let them continue. The video was cut off before the RO stopped the shooter and DQ'ed them.
 
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