• If you enjoy the forum please consider supporting it by signing up for a NES Membership  The benefits pay for the membership many times over.

Guns are for liberals, too

Joined
Dec 28, 2006
Messages
1,148
Likes
70
Location
Florida
Feedback: 1 / 0 / 0
Guns are for liberals, too
By: Mike Eber
The Michigan Daily
University of Michigan
Posted: 11/26/07

If there is one issue that alienates me from my liberal counterparts, it's gun rights. So when the Supreme Court decided last week to hear its first Second Amendment case since the 1930s, and as the College Libertarians raffled off a gun voucher, I felt a bit alienated from other liberals. This experience has forced me to re-evaluate what it truly means to be a liberal.

I attribute my liberal leanings to my upbringing in a politically liberal home. Because of the ideology of my parents and older sister, I get plenty of heat for my beliefs about gun ownership. When I turned 21, my mother asked me if I was excited to finally drink legally on campus. I responded that I could really care less about joining my peers in the teeming, sweaty mess people call Rick's. For me, turning 21 was really exciting because I gained the right to carry a concealed weapon in the state of Michigan. I was met with the usual emotional response - comments that I was "sick" and would never be welcome in my mother's house if I chose to buy a gun.

As I wonder what led me to be the black sheep of my liberal family, I remember my middle-school social studies teacher, Mr. Jankowski. Mr. J, as we called him, sported a glass eye and a passion for civil liberties. I now realize Mr. J educated our class indirectly in the political philosophy of John Locke. While teaching lessons on the Bill of Rights, he would explain that this perceived necessity to bear arms is not only for self-defense but is also essential to preserve a democratic society. If a government does not fear an armed populace, then that government is not truly democratic, because it does not need to respect the electorate's authority.

Through our lessons, we learned that a democratic and civilian-controlled military is never to be taken for granted, which necessitates civilian armament. Gun ownership rights are, in fact, the first rights restricted when a democratic society turns for the worst. Weimar Germany was a free society that treated Jews better than most other places in Europe. Then Adolph Hitler came to power. As The New York Times reported in 1938, after Kristallnacht, Hitler declared an edict "forbidding Jews to possess any weapons whatever and imposing a penalty of twenty years confinement in a concentration camp upon every Jew found in possession of a weapon."

Consider our presidential election in 2000. Blatantly ignoring the will of Florida voters, the U.S. Supreme Court handed victory to Bush on a technicality. Liberals agreed that there was nothing more to do in appeal, but according to Locke, if a government is guilty of systematic abuse of its power, then citizens have a right install legitimate rule. Instead, liberals stood by willingly after the ruling, acting as if they had just lost a close football game.

We may not need a compelling reason to own a firearm other than the fact that an armed populace is necessary for the security of a free state. Anti-Patriot Act liberals should realize that if they cannot trust the government to respect the privacy of their phone calls or to grant proper due process, then they should probably not also assume the government can be trusted not to disarm its citizens in the name of public safety.

My liberal friends love to cite instances like the Virginia Tech shooting and violent crime statistics as emotional appeals to restrict gun rights. I have heard that guns are more lethal than knives and make society more dangerous rather than promoting general safety. I definitely concede this fact: In the best of all worlds, nobody would need to ensure for his or her own defense. Similarly, in this utopia, we would not need to bother with the constraints of due processes because the government would always be righteous.

Like Ben Franklin and all other liberals, I would not give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety. Weighing public safety against the liberty of gun ownership and establishing militia follow in the same vein. Many Americans scoff at the necessity of modern day minutemen, and I hope they will not be needed in our lifetime. However, preserving the Second Amendment is like having a good insurance policy: You may hate making the monthly payments, but you sure are glad you did when an inferno consumes your house.
 
Someone should clue in the author about the 2000 election. SCOTUS upheld the law and affirmed the FL voters.
 
Someone should clue in the author about the 2000 election. SCOTUS upheld the law and affirmed the FL voters.

He didn't say they broke the law, he said they used a 'technicality'.

If a crazed murderer gets released on a 'technicality', it doesn't mean he wasn't guilty.
 
Good post. Sounds like he's a Classical Liberal. When anti-gun liberals complain about the religious right nut jobs, and the neocons running amok I suggest they go to the nearest gun shop to "level the playing field".
 
He didn't say they broke the law, he said they used a 'technicality'.

No, they ruled according to the law, and this ass-hat chooses to characterize it as a "technicality" because he didn't like the result. Always interesting how the law becomes a "technicality" when it doesn't support someone's preconceived ideas about what they think is good for us. I'm with Emoto on this one, and we don't need and shouldn't welcome the support of the Mike Ebers of this world.
 
Good post. Sounds like he's a Classical Liberal. When anti-gun liberals complain about the religious right nut jobs, and the neocons running amok I suggest they go to the nearest gun shop to "level the playing field".

His little jab about the election which occurred a long time ago
makes me believe, that at least some part of the guy is still
contaminated by commie brainwashing. If he really was a classical
liberal he would be pissed that neither the dems or the GOP had
managed to nominate a candidate that wasn't an authoritarian who
wishes to expand government. To a classical liberal, bush or
gore winning that election is functionally a nullity- because they're
both against everything a CL would stand for. [laugh]


-Mike
 
No, they ruled according to the law, and this ass-hat chooses to characterize it as a "technicality" because he didn't like the result. Always interesting how the law becomes a "technicality" when it doesn't support someone's preconceived ideas about what they think is good for us. I'm with Emoto on this one, and we don't need and shouldn't welcome the support of the Mike Ebers of this world.

The 2A needs all the support it can get. It's pretty sad that you'd throw the baby out with the bathwater on this one.

The real tragedy of that election is that all the voting irregularities weren't thoroughly investigated, not the SOTUS decision.
 
The 2A needs all the support it can get. It's pretty sad that you'd throw the baby out with the bathwater on this one.

Even if this guy is a turd, there might be a silver lining. Say he
takes one of his buddies shooting, and that person decides to grow
a brain and start thinking seriously about RKBA issues, etc. A lot
of people out there were either wishy washy politically, or apolitical
at best... then they became gun owners. Then they start to
care about things they didn't before, etc, or at least they pay
more attention to it.

Course, as I've found in the wild, there are some dems that call
themselves pro gun but end up allowing themselves to be held
hostage to the party because they still believe in the swindling
the dems have sold them on healthcare, education, etc.... the
problem being that just because one is pro gun does not make
them a single issue voter, unfortunately. It blows but I have
run into a few pro gun dems that don't make RKBA a "absolute
dependency" for choosing a candidate like a lot of us do.

-Mike
 
Even if this guy is a turd, there might be a silver lining. Say he
takes one of his buddies shooting, and that person decides to grow
a brain and start thinking seriously about RKBA issues, etc. A lot
of people out there were either wishy washy politically, or apolitical
at best... then they became gun owners. Then they start to
care about things they didn't before, etc, or at least they pay
more attention to it.

Course, as I've found in the wild, there are some dems that call
themselves pro gun but end up allowing themselves to be held
hostage to the party because they still believe in the swindling
the dems have sold them on healthcare, education, etc.... the
problem being that just because one is pro gun does not make
them a single issue voter, unfortunately. It blows but I have
run into a few pro gun dems that don't make RKBA a "absolute
dependency" for choosing a candidate like a lot of us do.

-Mike

The flip side of that is they might go Republican if that part weren't so in bed with the Christian conservatives and see W violating the rest of the bill of rights. I personally can't see how any person is a single issue voter. Of course, I have a hard time voting for either party.
 
His little jab about the election which occurred a long time ago
makes me believe, that at least some part of the guy is still
contaminated by commie brainwashing. If he really was a classical
liberal he would be pissed that neither the dems or the GOP had
managed to nominate a candidate that wasn't an authoritarian who
wishes to expand government. To a classical liberal, bush or
gore winning that election is functionally a nullity- because they're
both against everything a CL would stand for. [laugh]


-Mike

In my experience it's quite common for people to be Classical Liberals, but not realize it. To read his post, and to see that he's studied (and I assume agrees with John Locke) provides a strong indicator of his CL views. He probably sides with the Dems on many issues, but as you indicate there's not a great deal to chose between the Dems and Repubs these days.
 
In my experience, as people get older and smarter they start to lean away from their modern liberal emotional heavy handed government reactionist bullcrap. Some people just take longer than most to change. If you ask me, that change should be embraced and nurtured. Don't toss the guy because of one little comment. Deep down inside, he wants to change.
 
Back
Top Bottom