Gunsmiths in MA that will assemble pre-ban upper and lower receivers?

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John35y

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So I've been doing some research into acquiring a pre-ban riffle for my new found love of the sport. Recently, I applied to my local Gun Range in Woburn and I want to take advantage of their riffle range.

So my question relates to the following, If I buy a pre-ban upper and lower receiver for an AR15 are there gun smiths in the MA area that can assemble the riffle for me? I'm assuming as long as I have a pre-ban upper and lower that the riffle will be kosher under MA law?
 
John35y said:
So I've been doing some research into acquiring a pre-ban riffle for my new found love of the sport. Recently, I applied to my local Gun Range in Woburn and I want to take advantage of their riffle range.

So my question relates to the following, If I buy a pre-ban upper and lower receiver for an AR15 are there gun smiths in the MA area that can assemble the riffle for me? I'm assuming as long as I have a pre-ban upper and lower that the riffle will be kosher under MA law?
Click to expand...

The laws in Massachusetts currently seem to be interpreted by the Attorney General. Anyone's opinion posted here is merely their opinion, some more informed than others.

If you buy a {pre-ban} upper and lower, you don't need a gunsmith to assemble them; you don't even need tools.
 
ETA: I have read what you wrote again. Are you certain that the lower is 'pre-ban' also? If so any upper can go on it and you can assemble it into a new rifle.

Anything that you do not currently own and is not 'preban' is open to interpretation given the new guidance from the MA AGO.

Confused yet? It appears that this is what she wants.
 
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Go Green.

Any/all parts of the upper are PARTS. They are not serialized, no such thing as pre-ban upper. You can buy these pre-assembled if you have no interest in putting one together yourself.

Lower...good luck, I'm not sure who's touching these right now, everything's a clusterfark right now.

You'd just need a smith for the massification of the upper (if that's a thing anymore) and putting in the lower parts kit (youtube). Connecting a barreled upper assembly and a lower is just 2 pins (as long as everything's in spec).

Oh, and Hi Maura's Minions. [wave]
 
John35y said:
So I've been doing some research into acquiring a pre-ban riffle for my new found love of the sport. Recently, I applied to my local Gun Range in Woburn and I want to take advantage of their riffle range.

So my question relates to the following, If I buy a pre-ban upper and lower receiver for an AR15 are there gun smiths in the MA area that can assemble the riffle for me? I'm assuming as long as I have a pre-ban upper and lower that the riffle will be kosher under MA law?
Click to expand...

In theory, any of them should do it since there's no transfer or paperwork involved, your lower already has a 4473 or eFA-10 done on it.

Here's the problem I see:
Suppose Joe's Gunsmith builds the upper and lower for you and hands them over (un-mated up). You mate them up and now, by MA law, have to file an eFA-10 on your completed weapon, if you haven't already pre 7/20. This is now a felony via the AG's daily FAQ (filing an AR post 7/20). If you somehow get jacked up, you tell the prosecutor that Joe's Gunsmith built the thing for you.

Now the AG has no legal grounds to go after Joe's Gunsmith, but as we know since 7/20, she doesn't need any legal grounds to do anything. She can make life miserable for the innocent FFL.

This is why they might not do it for you, and rightfully so.
 
Varmint said:
Now the AG has no legal grounds to go after Joe's Gunsmith, but as we know since 7/20, she doesn't need any legal grounds to do anything. She can make life miserable for the innocent FFL.
Click to expand...
Exactly. FFL's are under the tyrant's microscope right now and none of them can afford to be her test case. Even without the law on her side, she can bankrupt any one of them (including the biggest ones) in legal costs alone. [thinking]
 
First, an answer to the "gunsmith" portion: If you have an upper and lower and they are complete (e.g. the lower has all the lower parts kit installed and the upper has the barrel/handguard/etc. installed) then "assmbling" the rifle is literally pushing in two pins. If they are not complete, assembling the lower is a simple task that can be done with typical hand tools, and assembling the upper can be done with a bench vise and an AR "armorer's tool".

As for the legality aspect, if your lower receiver is truly pre-ban, as in it was assembled into a banned rifle configuration prior to September 1994, then you can do whatever you want with it. Even under the AG's asinine new "guidance", pre-ban rifles are exempt from the AWB. If your FFL is too scared to touch it, find a better FFL.
 
Contact Tim at Gartman Arms.

- - - Updated - - -

He may be able to set you straight regarding the legality of it.
 
HiCap said:
Contact Tim at Gartman Arms.

- - - Updated - - -

He may be able to set you straight regarding the legality of it.
Click to expand...

If this lower is pre-ban (we can check the serial number) there are literally zero issues owning, assembling, shooting, or gunsmithing this firearm. I would be happy to work with ANYONE who needs help navigating this. These laws are confusing and convoluted on purpose, don't feel too overwhelmed. I would encourage anyone with questions or concerns like this to just come by the shop and speak to me in person.

Additionally, I saw one piece of misinformation in this thread that stood out above all others. There is absolutely no such thing as a pre-ban upper. An old A-1 or A-2 upper may need to have a bayo lug removed, or a muzzle brake pinned if it is going on a more recent lower reciever. On a pre-ban lower receiver it can stay in original configuration. The upper is not serialized, and is not considered pre ban, it is just an old upper.
 
G&N Gunsmithing at Gartman Arms. said:
If this lower is pre-ban (we can check the serial number) there are literally zero issues owning, assembling, shooting, or gunsmithing this firearm. I would be happy to work with ANYONE who needs help navigating this. These laws are confusing and convoluted on purpose, don't feel too overwhelmed. I would encourage anyone with questions or concerns like this to just come by the shop and speak to me in person.

Additionally, I saw one piece of misinformation in this thread that stood out above all others. There is absolutely no such thing as a pre-ban upper. An old A-1 or A-2 upper may need to have a bayo lug removed, or a muzzle brake pinned if it is going on a more recent lower reciever. On a pre-ban lower receiver it can stay in original configuration. The upper is not serialized, and is not considered pre ban, it is just an old upper.
Click to expand...

Guys like you give us hope that we'll get all this crap figured out. Thanks for sticking it out with us.
 
mlaboss said:
As for the legality aspect, if your lower receiver is truly pre-ban, as in it was assembled into a banned rifle configuration prior to September 1994, then you can do whatever you want with it. Even under the AG's asinine new "guidance", pre-ban rifles are exempt from the AWB. If your FFL is too scared to touch it, find a better FFL.
Click to expand...

This is the most important piece of info you need when it comes to pre-ban lowers. It is NOT a pre-ban lower unless it was a rifle on the books before the ban took effect. If it wasn't then its the same as a post ban lower.
 
Dear Maura,
Please sign up and post your thoughts and opinions so we can have a "common sense" dialogue.
We are not the enemy, you just want to keep thinking that. As you are well aware, those of us who have been permitted by this corrupt political machine which loves to strip away our God given rights, have been through an extensive background check by our respective licensing officer. If there were any hiccups in the process we would be prohibited from owning any firearms, period.
You won't find felons here, well not until your 7/20/16 made us such, so trying to suck someone into committing a crime for your advancement is a waste of everybody's time.
Please use your time to clarify the can of whoopass you so graciously opened up on the law abiding citizens of this once great commonwealth. There is truly more to life than the advancement of one's political career while curb stomping good people for the fun of it.
Your posse of fellow law skirting co-conspiritors need to figure out what an actual "assault weapon" is.
Seth Moulton, John Rosenthal (he is a gun owner you know), and Charlie are as clueless as you can be on the issue at hand. Military weapons are NOT on the streets unless someone robs an armory.
Please refrain from wasting valuable bandwidth to have your minions clog various fora for sh*ts & giggles. This may be a game for you and yours, but it is most definitely not for those who value freedom. Freedom seems to be lost to the candidates looking to occupy 1,600 Pennsylvania Avenue but we always strive to keep it.
Now please read the Constitution and Bill of Rights carefully, then listen to your swearing in with your hand on the Holy Bible.
Sincerely, Fixxah

P.S. You already know who I am so feel free to call me. Just don't call after 7pm, you'll wake the children.
 
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G&N Gunsmithing at Gartman Arms. said:
If this lower is pre-ban (we can check the serial number) there are literally zero issues owning, assembling, shooting, or gunsmithing this firearm. I would be happy to work with ANYONE who needs help navigating this. These laws are confusing and convoluted on purpose, don't feel too overwhelmed. I would encourage anyone with questions or concerns like this to just come by the shop and speak to me in person.
Click to expand...

i assumed he meant "pre 7/20" lower, not pre '94 ban, since he seemed to be talking about stripped lowers.

Isn't an unbuilt pre '94 lower also not really pre-ban if it wasn't a complete rifle before '94?
 
Last edited:
Fixxah said:
Dear Maura,
Please sign up and post your thoughts and opinions so we can have a "common sense" dialogue.
We are not the enemy, you just want to keep thinking that. As you are well aware, those of us who have been permitted by this corrupt political machine which loves to strip away our God given rigjts, have been through an extensive background check by our respective licensing officer. If there were any hiccups in the process we would be prohibited from owning any firearms, period.
You won't find felons here, well not until your 7/20/16 made us such, so trying to suck someone into committing a crime for your advancement is a waste of everybody's time.
Please use your time to clarify the can of whoopass you so graciously opened up on the law abiding citizens of this once great commonwealth. There is truly more to life than the advancement of one's political career while curb stomping good people for the fun of it.
Your posse of fellow law skirting co-conspiritors need to figure out what an actual "assault weapon" is.
Seth Moulton, John Rosenthal (he is a gun owner you know), and Charlie are as clueless as you can be on the issue at hand. Military weapons are NOT on the streets unless someone robs an armory.
Please refrain from wasting valuable bandwidth to have your minions clog various fora for sh*ts & giggles. This may be a game for you and yours, but it is most definitely not for those who value freedom. Freedom seems to be lost to the candidates looking to occupy 1,600 Pennsylvania Avenue but we always strive to keep it.
Now please read the Constitution and Bill of Rights carefully, then listen to your swearing in with your hand on the Holy Bible.
Simcerely, Fixxah

P.S. You already know who I am so feel free to call me. Just don't call after 7pm, you'll wake the children.
Click to expand...

Ahh , but you are the enemy.
You don't look like them , talk like them, act like them, or vote like them.
Remember , it's only discrimination when someone does it to them.
You work for a living , probably contribute to your community, teach your kids morality, and don't have to call a government hotline for instructions on how to wipe yourself.
Everything they hate.
Your not being attacked for anything you've done, your being attacked because you exist.
 
The original poster has contacted me offline, and was most certainly referring to the 1994 ban. My advice was also relating to the actual 1994 federal assault weapons ban as well. Lowers sold before 7/20/2016 are not considered "pre-ban" by us in the industry. It is my current understanding that if you have not FA-10d your new post-ban lowers by 7/20, then they are essentially scrap metal in MA. There is conflicting info from the state vs the feds regarding complete pre ban rifles vs just stripped pre ban lowers and their eligibility for assembly/ownership. I will have to do some more research before I make a public opinion on the matter, but the overwhelming majority of the community is doing whatever they want with verified pre 94 lower receivers.

Varmint said:
i assumed he meant "pre 7/20" lower, not pre '94 ban, since he seemed to be talking about stripped lowers.

Isn't an unbuilt pre '94 lower also not really pre-ban if it wasn't a complete rifle before '94?
Click to expand...
 
G&N Gunsmithing at Gartman Arms. said:
The original poster has contacted me offline, and was most certainly referring to the 1994 ban. My advice was also relating to the actual 1994 federal assault weapons ban as well. Lowers sold before 7/20/2016 are not considered "pre-ban" by us in the industry. It is my current understanding that if you have not FA-10d your new post-ban lowers by 7/20, then they are essentially scrap metal in MA. There is conflicting info from the state vs the feds regarding complete pre ban rifles vs just stripped pre ban lowers and their eligibility for assembly/ownership. I will have to do some more research before I make a public opinion on the matter, but the overwhelming majority of the community is doing whatever they want with verified pre 94 lower receivers.
Click to expand...

She said a stripped lower is a firearm so what difference at this point does it make if it was assembled or not pre 7/20...that is a rhetorical question with a nod to Hitlery.
 
Here is some insight from my personal experience on the AR ruling. When the ruling was past, unannounced to the shooting community, I was in the process of building an AR in 7.62x39. I had about 2 hours of work left before I could put the upper on and call it complete. At that point, by MA law, I had to register it with the MA firearms registry. Two days after the law was "enforced" by AG Healey I called the registry and told them I would like to finish my rifle and register it. I was told "they could not accept the registration until a ruling was made by the AG on unfinished rifles, call the AG's office." I called both officers for 3 weeks. The AG's office informed me the law was still "in flux, changing daily". The forth week I called the AG's office and was told "A ruling had been made on unfinished rifles. If I put my rifle together and filed with the registry I would be breaking MA law." I explained the lower was bought 4 months prior to the new ruling made by the AG. I was told that does not make any difference. I now own $650 in "parts".
If this rifle was not assemble before the ban be very careful. We are now officially a banana republic. Healey is posturing for the US Attorney Generals job and will do anything to push her agenda, including prosecuting a law abiding citizen. The only hope we have is the NSSF law suit. Let's hope this organization has the funds and will to pursue this law suit.
 
Garand1952 said:
Here is some insight from my personal experience on the AR ruling. When the ruling was past, unannounced to the shooting community, I was in the process of building an AR in 7.62x39. I had about 2 hours of work left before I could put the upper on and call it complete. At that point, by MA law, I had to register it with the MA firearms registry. Two days after the law was "enforced" by AG Healey I called the registry and told them I would like to finish my rifle and register it. I was told "they could not accept the registration until a ruling was made by the AG on unfinished rifles, call the AG's office." I called both officers for 3 weeks. The AG's office informed me the law was still "in flux, changing daily". The forth week I called the AG's office and was told "A ruling had been made on unfinished rifles. If I put my rifle together and filed with the registry I would be breaking MA law." I explained the lower was bought 4 months prior to the new ruling made by the AG. I was told that does not make any difference. I now own $650 in "parts".
If this rifle was not assembled before the ban be very careful. We are now officially a banana republic. Healey is posturing for the US Attorney Generals job and will do anything to push her agenda, including prosecuting a law abiding citizen. The only hope we have is the NSSF law suit. Let's hope this organization has the funds and will to pursue this law suit.
Click to expand...
Well, I guess you know by now that you made several tactical errors (or maybe not depending on how you feel about registration and/or the chances of success with any and all pending lawsuits). First, you tried to follow the law as written and long understood. Then you decided to trust the tyrant. Then you decided that she would act fairly and reasonably and in the best interest of the people instead of merely the best interest of herself. Wrong, unfortunately.

At least you can sell off the parts and recoup all or most of your investment if so desired. That's your Maura consolation prize. Or you can ignore Maura's lunacy and do as you please. Welcome to Massachusetts. [thinking]
 

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