Illegal Data Release Massachusetts

[HARRYM]

I just read up on some of the Mahoney case. Never says anything about a gun collection or any other property they were after?..I think I remember you saying that it was alleged that the thieves thought he had a gun collection??.. What if they were after Cash,jewelry, gold etc. Home invasions happen for a lot of different reasons. With that said, it’s alleged the thiefs wanted to get to a wall safe per what I read. I’m sure there probably was a gun or multiple guns in there..but does one single wall safe equate to a massive collection that multiple Gangbangin thieves wanted to get into? Who knows…

Is it easy to say that this release could lead to another home invasion or string of invasions? I’ll bite…sure, i’m sure there’s some really really dumb people out there that would try some thing stupid.

I think somebody is way more susceptible to what the state might do to them because of this. I’m not being dismissive of the Mahoney case but I’m not worried about a home invasion that happened over 40 years ago..home invasions happen all the time for many different reasons like I’ve already stated. This database or the Mahoney case is not making me shit my pants if that helps.

I know the Mahoney case fairly well.

 

[kevin9]

Must have missed the big time arm flapping and pants shitting in this thread. Perhaps some of the worries were a stretch but I didn't really notice anyone tripping out. The amount of sleep I have lost over home invasion worries is zero, but I do think it prudent to ensure I'm not neglecting home security and I support Comm2A's efforts to take down the lists.

Anyone remember the outrage over that NY newspaper that published a map of gun owners? That sh*t made global news on every major news service. While Mass has not published a map, connect a couple dots and you have a map. Not going to go through the steps nor would I out anyone's sh*t, but it's child's play to either find a specific person and what the state has listed in his/her possession and/or map out locations for specific firearms. Takes about 5 minutes or less- I've done it. Just imagine it: Shitbirds shopping for Dragunovs!

One angle Comm2A should consider is that there is a much more limited list of one specific gender in this mess, which makes targeting those individuals that much easier.

Perhaps this is a stretch but another angle to have these lists nuked is free speech. Let's say some rich anti killy-rifle Mass Fudd wants to discuss via online forum his $37K Perazzi and scores at the latest club trap shoot. This list now prevents him from doing that anonymously. (OK @ssholes, I am not daring anyone to out a rich Fudd! Seems that some of you bastards have already done it? )

Yep.
Bottom line is there is absolutely no appropriate or legal reason for the state to make this data available to the public, but many inappropriate and/or illegal reasons.

 

[sieveboy]

LEO I think are exempt from the data release but it's an interesting question if they really were or not.

grunt-level LEOs are on this

 

[Drix]

grunt-level LEOs are on this

I looked back at the download page. There's no indication anyone is exempt, so maybe there is no exemption. I'm going to look for MSP issued licenses this evening, that should give an indication

 

[TJRaccoon]

LEO I think are exempt from the data release but it's an interesting question if they really were or not.

My best friend is now retired cop. I found his earlier purchases and when he bought his service piece at retirement.

Found my stuff retail, eFA10 and C&R registration. Wife's and Kid purchases all in less than half hour.

Having dinner with a friend tonight, Checked one file and got three pages. This is an egregious breach by the state of Massachusetts

 

[EJFudd]

grunt-level LEOs are on this

... and higher ups too depending on where you feel grunt ends and elites begin.

 

[namedpipes]

I don't want to make light of all the reasons why the publication of this list is so bad, but I believe the main reason they published this list now is so that legislator's in the state can use the aggregated data to push for laws that haven't normally gained traction in this state. At the hearings for this session there will colorful charts and graphs showing how many "assault weapons" are really owned in the state, or stats showing "5000 people own 50 or more guns and nobody needs that many guns!". The publication of the data is egregious, but I think the short-term goal was to use it to push some really crappy Linksy bills this session. They're going to beat the drum hard about how our laws "aren't working" and they'll use this as hard evidence. Say bye to FTF transfers.

And yet out of those tens of thousands (or more) of "assault" rifles, they'll be hard pressed to find the one or two that might be used in a crime.

I can't find the source, but I once read that since NFA was enacted in 1934, exactly two lawfully owned machine guns have been used in a crime. There are over 600k machine guns on the NFA list.

With a few obvious exceptions (you know who you are), we are NOT a wild bunch of savages running around killing people willy nilly.

 

[drgrant]

Anyone else notice an absolutely staggering amount of stuff missing? For any of us that have been buying/selling for a long time (I used to do more years ago not so much now) theres just a shitload of stuff missing. Stuff that went through MA dealers even, stuff that I /definitely/ reported.

Just shows you what a huge pile of shit their records are.

 

[drgrant]

Having dinner with a friend tonight, Checked one file and got three pages. This is an egregious intentional release of data by the state of Massachusetts

fixed it for you

calling it a breach is like saying "someone broke in, they stole things, so sorry, we sorry"

but you cant call it that when its obvious they did it on purpose

breach of public trust... sure

 

[EJFudd]

Must have missed the big time arm flapping and pants shitting in this thread. Perhaps some of the worries were a stretch but I didn't really notice anyone tripping out. The amount of sleep I have lost over home invasion worries is zero, but I do think it prudent to ensure I'm not neglecting home security and I support Comm2A's efforts to take down the lists.

While losing sleep may be a stretch, there is no question in my mind that criminals with at least half a brain will be able to use the data to target well-stocked homes... and the idea that "more iron" is going to stop them is wishful thinking. Once they get the jump on you (and they will), you will open your safe or you will become another very dead Massachusetts crime statistic.

EDIT: Good thing I only own one gun.

 

[Machines]

I bought a pistol from a guy who was some kind of LEO and the transaction is on here. Only one that's missing is a gun I bought from an FFL around 2015. I have the printout of the transfer form so the system must be full of errors.

 

[EJFudd]

Anyone else notice an absolutely staggering amount of stuff missing? For any of us that have been buying/selling for a long time (I used to do more years ago not so much now) there's just a shitload of stuff missing. Stuff that went through MA dealers even, stuff that I /definitely/ reported.

Just shows you what a huge pile of shit their records are.

All I'm seeing missing is the old blue card and paper FA-10 stuff. Everything filed electronically appears to be in there.

 

[HARRYM]

I bought a pistol from a guy who was some kind of LEO and the transaction is on here. Only one that's missing is a gun I bought from an FFL around 2015. I have the printout of the transfer form so the system must be full of errors.

Indeed, I haven't purchased any firearms, of any kind, ever, so if I'm on there it has to be some sort of error.........

 

[SgtHal75]

I know the Mahoney case fairly well.

You asked me how I felt and I told you

 

[OMM 0000]

Fascinating to poke around in this data. Found myself and some family members relatively easily. A neighbor as well.

Correct me if I am wrong, but searching for something like Daniel Defense DDM4 in the dealer list will basically bring up LEOs as they are the only ones who could buy that from a dealer.

Edit: Or i guess people could have purchased them with pinned mags or something.

Maybe the admins can move this thread to the members area?!

 

[Drix]

Anyone else notice an absolutely staggering amount of stuff missing? For any of us that have been buying/selling for a long time (I used to do more years ago not so much now) theres just a shitload of stuff missing. Stuff that went through MA dealers even, stuff that I /definitely/ reported.

Just shows you what a huge pile of shit their records are.

I'm actually very concerned that I'm missing a gun I sold via FTF and I have a spare gun from a FFL that I never purchased registered to me.

 

[Da_lucche]

Anyone else notice an absolutely staggering amount of stuff missing? For any of us that have been buying/selling for a long time (I used to do more years ago not so much now) theres just a shitload of stuff missing. Stuff that went through MA dealers even, stuff that I /definitely/ reported.

Just shows you what a huge pile of shit their records are.

All my EFA10 registration/FTF stuff is there. None of my paper FA10 FTF transactions show up though.

 

[Drix]

Maybe the admins can move this thread to the members area?!

Why? The data is public knowledge.

 

[SgtHal75]

Fascinating to poke around in this data. Found myself and some family members relatively easily. A neighbor as well.

Correct me if I am wrong, but searching for something like Daniel Defense DDM4 in the dealer list will basically bring up LEOs as they are the only ones who could buy that from a dealer.

Edit: Or i guess people could have purchased them with pinned mags or something.

Maybe the admins can move this thread to the members area?!

Maybe it’s time for the admins to shit can this thread….That database being in one public domain might be enough…

Think about this:

How many anti-gunners that are looking to cause real trouble are monitoring mass.gov??..and how many of them are monitoring this site???

Just my thoughts as I make my way through the forest looking for trees

 

[drgrant]

I'm actually very concerned that I'm missing a gun I sold via FTF and I have a spare gun from a FFL that I never purchased registered to me.

I wouldn't be that concerned, because its pretty obvious its just the state/database. Either theres a shitload of records not included in this dump, or they f***ed up that badly along the way, or both.

 

[Mountain]

While losing sleep may be a stretch, there is no question in my mind that criminals with at least half a brain will be able to use the data to target well-stocked homes... and the idea that "more iron" is going to stop them is wishful thinking. Once they get the jump on you (and they will), you will open your safe or you will become another very dead Massachusetts crime statistic.

EDIT: Good thing I only own one gun.

While that scenario is not 100% impossible, I do think it is highly improbable. Nobody (at least nobody with a brain cell) hits a gun store during business hours. Dirtbags dislike holes in body parts as much as the next guy so why would they bother with an armed conflict when they can find someone a) with a lot of the crap they want to steal, b) someone with known hours away from the home, and c) a location with covert access and/or good getaway options. With a burner phone they could even call you at work to confirm you are out of the house without even needing a stakeout. Alternately a little social media searching could identify someone away on vacation.

Here's something to chew on:

Imagine the usual obit scanning dirtbags being able to check the firearms database for the dearly deceased's and/or spouse's firearm list?

 

[bigbravehog]

Anyone else notice an absolutely staggering amount of stuff missing? For any of us that have been buying/selling for a long time (I used to do more years ago not so much now) theres just a shitload of stuff missing. Stuff that went through MA dealers even, stuff that I /definitely/ reported.

Just shows you what a huge pile of shit their records are.

my guess is they combed through the database to remove any self incriminating info before releasing it.

 

[drgrant]

All I'm seeing missing is the old blue card and paper FA-10 stuff. Everything filed electronically appears to be in there.

I had a bunch of stuff from MA dealers post 2004 and from 3 other MA dealers there's nothing in there when there should be like a dozen guns. Like I have stuff I got from deli ticket emporium, thats in there, but there are like 3 other dealers not reperesneted in there at all. The only thing completely intact is more recent EFA10 FTF sales/transfers.

 

[drgrant]

my guess is they combed through the database to remove any self incriminating info before releasing it.

I am thinking theyre either missing data entirely or someone ran some kind of a hatchet job on it. Which would explain the presence of serial numbers in part of one file but not the rest of it.... in an incorrectly marked column. Someone doesnt know how to use sqsh or whatever they used to dump the data...

 

[wcorey]

Not sure if it's just me/my computer but all I get on these excel files is single digits for day/month dates, no 10/11/12 months, no 10 through 31 days.

Like this;

 

[TLB]

While that scenario is not 100% impossible, I do think it is highly improbable. Nobody (at least nobody with a brain cell) hits a gun store during business hours. Dirtbags dislike holes in body parts as much as the next guy so why would they bother with an armed conflict when they can find someone a) with a lot of the crap they want to steal, b) someone with known hours away from the home, and c) a location with covert access and/or good getaway options. With a burner phone they could even call you at work to confirm you are out of the house without even needing a stakeout. Alternately a little social media searching could identify someone away on vacation.

Here's something to chew on:

Imagine the usual obit scanning dirtbags being able to check the firearms database for the dearly deceased's and/or spouse's firearm list?

Or even better, someone in a nice house in a nice town with no legal guns as verified by this database. Soft targets as they say.

 

[Len-2A Training]

All I'm seeing missing is the old blue card and paper FA-10 stuff. Everything filed electronically appears to be in there.

IIRC, the dates associated with those files don't go back that far. Blue cards went extinct with GCA-1998. Paper forms went extinct on 3/15/2015.

 

[Drix]

I am thinking theyre either missing data entirely or someone ran some kind of a hatchet job on it. Which would explain the presence of serial numbers in part of one file but not the rest of it.... in an incorrectly marked column. Someone doesnt know how to use sqsh or whatever they used to dump the data...

The more I look at the data set the more it looks useless.

If someone was going to argue that the set can be used for research, as a professional researcher I can tell you "yeah, not without huge amounts of work".

One of the things I wanted to know was "How effective was Healey's Edict".

I was going to build my query the following way:

1. Take the FFL list and collect data from 7/21/2016 to the end, figure out how many days that is, and then do the same for 7/19/2016 the same amount of time prior. The 7/20 data would be interesting to me too, but I think it should say separate.

2. Take the aggregate data above and start by focusing on "scary guns". Easiest way to start is filter by 5.56, .223, and 7.62.
This can't be done because while caliber appears in the weapon size column in the 2004-2016 data, it is not present in the 2016-2021 data. It's actually really obvious if you even try, because the size columns is letter groupings in one data set.
This means the firearms will have to be sorted by model and make. This'll take longer and time = money for professional research especially funded by grants.
Data that is available for caliber is wildly all over the place- 556, 5.56, 5.56 Nato, 5.56x45, 223-556, .223-5.56, etc.
3. Expand beyond the easy firearms and pull the harder ones- the AR10's and the like.

The only way to determine the effectiveness with what we have is basically to go line by line and figure out what's an assault weapon and what is not. You'd need to parse out manufacturers to a team, train the team to identify models, and then put the set back together, but your quality and accuracy drops through the floor with that sort of manual labor.

 

[OMM 0000]

Why? The data is public knowledge.

Yeah but the 47 ideas posted about how to use it and interpret it are a freebee for a journalist or criminal.

 

[Drix]

Yeah but the 47 ideas posted about how to use it and interpret it are a freebee for a journalist or criminal.

We're not some hyper intelligent group, they had the same ideas if not worse.