Information in your C&R Bound book...

[C-pher]

OK, so here's the deal. After having my C&R for almost two years I'm getting ready to get a firearm on it for the first time.

So, I was looking for that little book that they sent with it to let you know what you have to put in it when you put a firearm into your books. But, I can't find it.

So I'm guessing I need to put in what the gun is, the serial number, and the date that it showed up on my door.

What else do I have to put in there?

 

[Lynne]

1 - Manufacturer and/or importer

2 - Model #

3- Serial #

4 - Type (revolver/semi-auto/rifle, etc.)

5 - Caliber or Guage

6 - Date

 

[kingson]

here is a link to what it is supose to look like.
http://www.cruffler.com/boundbook2.pdf
You can do it on a sheet of paper or on the computer, just as long as it is in that format. Crufflers.com has some good info on C&R stuff..Here is alink to it http://www.cruffler.com/ Hope this helps

 

[C-pher]

1 - Manufacturer and/or importer

2 - Model #

3- Serial #

4 - Type (revolver/semi-auto/rifle, etc.)

5 - Caliber or Guage

6 - Date

So let's just say

Winchester
97
1234567890
Shotgun
12 guage
1/2/03

That's all? Sweet.

 

[kingson]

you have to put who you got it from also...eather name and address or name and FFL#

 

[C-pher]

you have to put who you got it from also...eather name and address or name and FFL#

Cool, thanks and thanks for the links above.

 

[Lynne]

you have to put who you got it from also...eather name and address or name and FFL#

That's right.... I must be really tired tonight. I was looking right at that column when I hit submit. [roll]

 

[C-pher]

So, the Disposition side is for when you move the firearm out of the book?

 

[Lynne]

So, the Disposition side is for when you move the firearm out of the book?

Yes. You then list the date, the name and address or license # of the person you're selling it to, their DOB if unlicensed, drivers license # if licensed, or other ID in non-lic'd, and if an alien, a document to establish residency (I wouls assume a utility bill).

And yes, this time I made sure to look at all the columns.

 

[dwarven1]

here is a link to what it is supose to look like.
http://www.cruffler.com/boundbook2.pdf
You can do it on a sheet of paper or on the computer, just as long as it is in that format. Crufflers.com has some good info on C&R stuff..Here is alink to it http://www.cruffler.com/ Hope this helps

Not to beat this to death, but I can just keep this in a file on my computer? I don't need to have a real, live, pile of paper bound into a book (as opposed to a looseleaf type of book, that is)?

 

[Len-2A Training]

Ross,

Better do some more reading. You can NOT keep your BB on your computer, unless you get special permission from BATFE to do so. What they are looking for prior to granting that permission, I do not know but some reading should surface the info you'd need.

 

[dwarven1]

Some quick reading in the stack of books that BATFE shipped me yields that a "bound book" is either a real bound book or an "orderly arrangement of looseleaf pages which must be maintained on the business premises."

Using a "computer system" for records in lieu of a bound book requires approval from the "Director of Industry Operations or other designated official".

Which brings up another question: Can I simply print out the "bound book" on to new pages every time I acquire or sell a firearm? IOW, say I buy a MN 1944. I put it into my spreadsheet and print it out. Viola; instant bound book. Now... I go buy an SMLE. Can't I just add it to the spreadsheet and re-print the pages? That would seem to me to be in compliance.

I don't imagine that I'll ever have more than a few pages in my entire bound book! (at least, not as long as I want to stay married. ) An actual record book just seems so... twentieth century. [roll] Besides... if you saw my office, you'd understand why I'd rather have it available for instant reprinting! I'm not the neatest person when it comes to paperwork...

 

[Len-2A Training]

Ross,

I don't think that will fly, but I'm no expert on BATFE's requirements here. A BB kept in a safe seems like the best solution to me. Brownells sells them for $3-4.

 

[JonJ]

I remember reading a thread on this somewhere where the BATF had been asked this question. I believe they stated that as long as the record was not "stored" electronically, like on a disk or memory stick you were OK. The record had to printed out and stored as per their regulations, "bound book". It was looked at like using a typewriter to type it out.

 

[C-pher]

I just picked up one of those Composition books at CVS. The ones that are bound with the black and white speckled covers.

I just keep that in my safe. Easy Peasy!

 

[matt]

I know it's off topic, but:

Easy Peasy!

Is that from Shawshank Redemption?

 

[DR]

Which brings up another question: Can I simply print out the "bound book" on to new pages every time I acquire or sell a firearm? IOW, say I buy a MN 1944. I put it into my spreadsheet and print it out. Viola; instant bound book. Now... I go buy an SMLE. Can't I just add it to the spreadsheet and re-print the pages? That would seem to me to be in compliance.

That's exactly what I do and it is, so far as I know, legal. Be sure to put page numbers on there and dispose of outdated pages promptly.

 

[C-pher]

I know it's off topic, but:

Easy Peasy!

Is that from Shawshank Redemption?

I don't know...it's something that we've been saying since I was a kid.

 

[News Shooter]

Hope I'm not being redundant

By opening this topic over and over and over and over

BUT...

I got my C & R last week. It did not come with a bound book.
I tried to print out the pages from the site previously mentioned but they won't print. I can't find anything on ATF or Brownell's site about ordering a bound book. That's one question if anyone can provide me with a link.

Next question. It is my understanding from the readings here and the state requirements that ANY firearm including one purchased using a C & R requires an FA-10.

There is a gun store person who keeps telling me absolutely and positively that is NOT required. I'd sure like to have something to physically show him the next time I go in...can someone point me to the actual MA page that states that a C & R purchase requires an FA-10?

Thanks much

 

[Len-2A Training]

News,

BATFE will not send you a bound book. It is something you either have to buy or create on your own.

Brownells:
http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=1694
p. 238 in the paper catalog.
Cost is $3.00

Only caution is that it "may" not have everything that BATFE now requires. There was a bulletin sent to all FFL holders a couple of years ago requiring more info on person you sell a gun to (anti-terrorism stuff) that may not be in the Brownells book.

In the BATFE books you did/will receive, there is info on what is required. You can also access this on the Web, at BATFE's website.

Take a look here:
http://www.atf.gov/pub/fire-explo_pub/2005/p53004/index.htm

Doubt what I stated about FA-10s? Call CHSB, ask for Caroline Sawyer (atty) and ask her!

Since MGLs do NOT acknowledge that a C&R FFL exists (in fact, they don't recognize that an FFL exists . . . all terminology is around "Dealer", someone who possesses a MA Ammo/Firearms Dealer License), you will NOT find any such "law" stating what C&Rs must do. Thus, they must do what every common subject in PRM must do . . . file the FA-10 in all cases.

 

[C-pher]

Re: Hope I'm not being redundant

By opening this topic over and over and over and over

BUT...

I got my C & R last week. It did not come with a bound book.
I tried to print out the pages from the site previously mentioned but they won't print. I can't find anything on ATF or Brownell's site about ordering a bound book. That's one question if anyone can provide me with a link.

Next question. It is my understanding from the readings here and the state requirements that ANY firearm including one purchased using a C & R requires an FA-10.

There is a gun store person who keeps telling me absolutely and positively that is NOT required. I'd sure like to have something to physically show him the next time I go in...can someone point me to the actual MA page that states that a C & R purchase requires an FA-10?

Thanks much

Like I posted earlier in this thread. YOu can pick up a "bound" comp book from CVS for like a buck. It comes in Black and White speckeled, red and white speckled and I think blue and white speckled.

Just look at those pages and copy the info over to that book with a pen and ruler so it's even. Then use the lines in the bood for your info. It's pretty simple.

 

[News Shooter]

Just a clarification on my behalf

I'm not the one who is saying I don't need to file a FA-10 on a C & R purchase. It is the DEALER who is saying that. I want to be able to provide him with the official proof that he is wrong. The problem is that he is telling everyone who comes into the place the same thing and that adds up to a lot of out of luck people

Thanks

 

[Len-2A Training]

News,

There are lots of people who can't read, don't know anything, but claim to know the law! [I can think of one prominent candidate for that statement, he's not a member here and would not be welcome here!]

It's regrettable when they espouse their ignorance and cause others to violate the law, but we can't all be our brother's keeper in this case.

It is as I stated. Have him call Caroline Sawyer at CHSB. He probably still won't believe her, after all she's only an atty in a management role at CHSB!

Best to know what YOU have to do to stay legal, tell your friends, and move on in life.

These forums have a task of educating people. BUT some folks will refuse to be educated and there is nothing that we can do for them.

 

[Lynne]

I created forms on the computer, printed them out, 3 holed them and put them in to a 1 inch binder. They said a bound book, so I made a bound book.

Ross...if I had kept the info on my computer, I would have lost it twice already (the number of computers that have died on me since getting the C&R) Yes, I know - back up the info - but still, if I hadn't updated something, it would have been gone with the wind.

Make a book.

 

[dwarven1]

Ross...if I had kept the info on my computer, I would have lost it twice already (the number of computers that have died on me since getting the C&R) Yes, I know - back up the info - but still, if I hadn't updated something, it would have been gone with the wind.

I'm going to... I'm going to put the information into a spreadsheet, and every time I buy a gun, print out the new version. Into a three-ring binder. [lol]