Moon clips...

milktree

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I know very little about moon clips.

What I think I know:
1) They're specific to a model of revolver.
a) They're semi-specific to the brand of brass, because of different brass has different dimensions.
i) The cylinder needs to be cut for (or come from the factory set up for) moon clips.
A) get tools for loading and unloading the clips!

1) I assume they're like speed loaders, where the inter-chamber spacing has to match. A speed loader will work for a few models, but not all. Same with moon clips.

a) The head thickness of different brass should be the same (or it wouldn't work ever) but the relief cut behind the head differs between brands, so the size of the moon clip cut-out (the moon?) and the thickness of the clip has to match. There are "normal" brass, and "weirdo" brass, so if I stick with a "normal" brass and use clips that fit, I should be fine. Just avoid the brass that doesn't fit.

i) I plan to do this myself. It'll be super scary. But I'm getting a used cylinder to practice on (or have a spare) Yes, I have a mill, and a rotary table, and a DRO, and a good vice, and V-blocks, and indicators. I don't have the specifications. But The Internet will help there. Plus a bunch of careful measuring.


so...

What in the above have I gotten wrong?

Who makes the best clips?
Who makes the best loading/unloading tools?
What have I completely neglected to consider?
 

One stop shopping. They cut the cylinder for my GP100 and sold me moon clips, loading tool and unloading tool.
Not cheap - but in line with comparable. I'm quite satisfied with their products and their services.

EDITED to add - go look at TK Custom's page - there's a wealth of information there as well as products.
 
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i have a ruger redhawk 45 colt/45 acp so obviously the .45 acp uses moon clips. ruger led me to believe that the clips were proprietary so i invested in a shitload, and ruger moon clips were not cheap. found out later from the ruger boards i could have used any full moon clip from say...midway or another internet vendor. but the common theme is 98% all work, some better than others. it was a trial and error thing to find the ones that worked best for a specific gun.

the 45 acp in a ruger clip "wobbles" so when i'm loading, and not under stress, i sometimes need to "fiddle" and "finesse" the rounds down into the chamber. they just don't drop right in like as, say, a speed loader. some do. and this is probably due to the brass thickness, not all brass is made alike. but no where in the manual does ruger recommend one brand over another. or even mention the subject.

and yes, the cylinder is slightly cut for the clips to function. it's a surprisingly delicate cut, not hogged out. i should have taken a photo, too lazy.

i never got a tool to load/unload. i just pop them in and off with ease by finger pressure. honestly, taking the first empty off the clip is the hard one, limited space to take hold of it. once it's off the rest are easy. in winter you can't manipulate the process with gloves on.

just some of my observations which i'm sure have nothing in common with your project.
 
The brass specific moon clip is true for 38/357 brass. 45 isn't nearly as brass sensitive. I'm not sure about 9mm or 38 super. @10mmdave could answer that. revolver supply offers stamped moonclips that are more affordable that the wire EDM TK custom/hearthco. I run the 0.025" resolver supply with Federal and Remmington brass in my 627.
 
The brass specific moon clip is true for 38/357 brass. 45 isn't nearly as brass sensitive. I'm not sure about 9mm or 38 super. @10mmdave could answer that. revolver supply offers stamped moonclips that are more affordable that the wire EDM TK custom/hearthco. I run the 0.025" resolver supply with Federal and Remmington brass in my 627.

Am I being blind?

I'm looking at revolversupply ( Premium Moon Clips | The Revolver Supply Company ) and I don't see any six shot .38/.357 moon clips. I figure I must be missing something because I'd think six shot .38/.357 would be the absolute most common.
 
1) They're specific to a model of revolver.
Yes.
a) They're semi-specific to the brand of brass, because of different brass has different dimensions.
Yes, see chart below
i) The cylinder needs to be cut for (or come from the factory set up for) moon clips.
Correct. Most come cut so don't sweat it
A) get tools for loading and unloading the clips!
So that depends.
You'll definitely want a de-mooner. Makes short work of it.
For loading- .45 acp and 10mm (.40 mag) and .40 (10mm spl) push in fairly easy. Any rimless is fairly easy.
Rimmed cartridges, you'll want a loader.
1) I assume they're like speed loaders, where the inter-chamber spacing has to match. A speed loader will work for a few models, but not all. Same with moon clips.
Yes, but they're made application-specific, so its a matter of finding a vendor that sells what you're looking for
a) The head thickness of different brass should be the same (or it wouldn't work ever) but the relief cut behind the head differs between brands, so the size of the moon clip cut-out (the moon?) and the thickness of the clip has to match. There are "normal" brass, and "weirdo" brass, so if I stick with a "normal" brass and use clips that fit, I should be fine. Just avoid the brass that doesn't fit.
Should be, but not the case with rimmed cartridges.
See, SAMMI spec gives dimensions for everything but the groove for rimmed casings. All a.c.p. cases adhere to SAMMI spec so those are a non issue.
i) I plan to do this myself. It'll be super scary. But I'm getting a used cylinder to practice on (or have a spare) Yes, I have a mill, and a rotary table, and a DRO, and a good vice, and V-blocks, and indicators. I don't have the specifications. But The Internet will help there. Plus a bunch of careful measuring.

Short and fat is where its at.
I can drop loaded moons for my 625 and they dam near fall in on their own.
For my 627 its a little more work. 8 long cases at once, so i'll give it a spin before closing the cylinder.
What have I completely neglected to consider?

If you're "on the clock" like a timer-
Not saying it'll work miracles for you, but what I did was-
Ream the cylinder throats. 1 bit (at the factory) might carve out 3 or 4 cylinders if not more. Cylinder throats on my 627 were 8 different diameters (measured in .0001 increments)
Grabbed a reamer and mandrels from Brownells and set all throats to .3575.
Ran a chamfer bit over all the chambers and blended them into the extractor.
Also grabbed a hone and some flitz and polished the chambers. It helped with the .38 spl cases. Probably didn't need it on the 625 but I did it anyway.


Have fun with it my friend. Chicks dig a guy who thumb-whips their 6 (or8) gun.








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Am I being blind?

I'm looking at revolversupply ( Premium Moon Clips | The Revolver Supply Company ) and I don't see any six shot .38/.357 moon clips. I figure I must be missing something because I'd think six shot .38/.357 would be the absolute most common.

Some come cut, some don't.
6 shot .357- People are either loading one at a time or through a speed loader or jet loader.
There are places out there that will cut a 686 or a ruger whatever they have.

Clark Custom used to, haven't looked in a while.
I'm pretty sure TK custom does.
There was another but the name eludes me.

TK will cut the cylinder to their moon spec.

I have revolver supply and tk custom moons for 3 wheelguns.
Black nitride, stainless, various thicknesses, blah blah blah. They all seem to be within spec of each other meaning I din't notice any difference in specs for for the 627 or the 625 or the 610.
Granted the cylinders are different diameters but Company A made the same size as Company B for that specific application.

Do not flint-out and buy the nylon moonclips. They're garbage.
 
milktree, you would assume the 6 shot 38/357 moon clipped but it's the least one out there that I have seen.
You don't mention what gun you are trying to moon clip ?? What is it ?
 
milktree, you would assume the 6 shot 38/357 moon clipped but it's the least one out there that I have seen.
You don't mention what gun you are trying to moon clip ?? What is it ?

Ruger Security-Six

The answer to, “why bother?” is, “because it would be a fun project, and I like using that gun for the 25-steel events at Mass Rifle.”

But mostly because it’s a fun project.
 
Ruger Security-Six

The answer to, “why bother?” is, “because it would be a fun project, and I like using that gun for the 25-steel events at Mass Rifle.”

But mostly because it’s a fun project.
And that's all you need :) It's your gun, do what you want to it !!
I think the only place you'll find clips for this project is TK Custom (and if the work scares you off they'll do it for you)
I moon clipped a 6 shot L Frame using the bought clips dimensions and a 3/4" end mill in my milling machine,
not hard to do at all.

Moon clips are the fastest way to reload a revolver, and that's not just my opinion, if you've been up against some 8 shot
revo's at the 25 pc steel matches at MRA you've seen how fast they can be.

You will need to settle on the brass that fits the clips, I found Federal worked best for my TK clips for my 6 shot 686, Starline
was very loose, RP was better but not as good as Fed.
Revolver Supply will have a moon clip loading tool I believe or you could call TK and try and do a bundle like this as you will
want a de-mooner tool also.

If you do the mod like S&W you will still be able to use the revo without moon clips, but you do it whatever way you want.

Good luck, if you are ever looking for a way to hold those moon clips on your belt for a speedier re-load let me know,
I might have just what you need ;)
 

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Do not flint-out and buy the nylon moonclips. They're garbage.

I bought them, but not because I was feeling flinty. I bought them because they're easier to use...

Mine have been fine, though to be fair I don't put them through a huge amount of use.
 
I'm looking at revolversupply ( Premium Moon Clips | The Revolver Supply Company ) and I don't see any six shot .38/.357 moon clips. I figure I must be missing something because I'd think six shot .38/.357 would be the absolute most common.
Hardly anyone uses moon clips for .38/.357. Moon clips are most commonly used for rimless cartridges like .45 acp and 9mm. Why bother with moonclips for .38/.357 when you can just use speedloaders instead?
 
Hardly anyone uses moon clips for .38/.357. Moon clips are most commonly used for rimless cartridges like .45 acp and 9mm. Why bother with moonclips for .38/.357 when you can just use speedloaders instead?

They're faster both to load and unload, (you never get a single cartidge stuck on the unload). Plus you can pick up your brass easily - which is important to those who reload.

That's based on almost a decade of shooting pins and plates with a GP100, (both .38Spcl and .357Mag).
 
And that's all you need :) It's your gun, do what you want to it !!
I think the only place you'll find clips for this project is TK Custom (and if the work scares you off they'll do it for you)
I moon clipped a 6 shot L Frame using the bought clips dimensions and a 3/4" end mill in my milling machine,
not hard to do at all.

Moon clips are the fastest way to reload a revolver, and that's not just my opinion, if you've been up against some 8 shot
revo's at the 25 pc steel matches at MRA you've seen how fast they can be.

You will need to settle on the brass that fits the clips, I found Federal worked best for my TK clips for my 6 shot 686, Starline
was very loose, RP was better but not as good as Fed.
Revolver Supply will have a moon clip loading tool I believe or you could call TK and try and do a bundle like this as you will
want a de-mooner tool also.

If you do the mod like S&W you will still be able to use the revo without moon clips, but you do it whatever way you want.

Good luck, if you are ever looking for a way to hold those moon clips on your belt for a speedier re-load let me know,
I might have just what you need ;)

So, what @10mmdave didn't say is that he's "revo-gear"; an accomplished revolver shooter - and purveyor of fine products.

I've got his moon clip holder belt attachment - it's a nice product. Picked it up from him at a match at Mystic Rod & Gun Club in Griswold, CT.
 
Hardly anyone uses moon clips for .38/.357. Moon clips are most commonly used for rimless cartridges like .45 acp and 9mm. Why bother with moonclips for .38/.357 when you can just use speedloaders instead?

On top of that, moon clips weren't really designed as speedloaders, anyway: they were designed to solve the specific problem of chambering ammo designed for semiautos in revolvers designed for rimmed cartridges. So .38spl/.357 was never really the intent of moon clips, meaning there was no reason to mill out the backs of .357 cylinders to accommodate clips.

Few milled cylinders means few companies bothering to produce .38/.357 clips. Clips were always overwhelmingly a way to fire .45ACP through WWI-era revolvers.
 
Hardly anyone uses moon clips for .38/.357. Moon clips are most commonly used for rimless cartridges like .45 acp and 9mm. Why bother with moonclips for .38/.357 when you can just use speedloaders instead?
Dude, 8-shot minor USPSA. There's at least 2 or 3 people that shoot it. There used to be 4 but I stopped shooting it. [rofl][laugh2]
 
Dude, 8-shot minor USPSA. There's at least 2 or 3 people that shoot it. There used to be 4 but I stopped shooting it. [rofl][laugh2]
Did S&W ever fix the issues with that 8-shot 9mm competition revolver? I ssem to recall it had issues with the cases hanging up after they were discharged, particularly with mixed brass.
 
Did S&W ever fix the issues with that 8-shot 9mm competition revolver? I ssem to recall it had issues with the cases hanging up after they were discharged, particularly with mixed brass.
I would have to say yes but a lot of the early problems were alleviated by using once fired brass, Federal seemed to be the best.
A lot of new owners/shooters just grabbed their 9mm reloads of range picked brass and started shooting their 929's and things
went bad fast, as fast as one can run to the inter-web and post their frustration :cool:

This does not mean that S&W does not have A LOT of quality control problems when it comes to their revo's, the stuff coming
out of there is the last 5+ years has been disappointing IMO.
 
Hardly anyone uses moon clips for .38/.357. Moon clips are most commonly used for rimless cartridges like .45 acp and 9mm. Why bother with moonclips for .38/.357 when you can just use speedloaders instead?
That was the old days, there are tons of revo shooters who are using moon clips. (more below)
Dude, 8-shot minor USPSA. There's at least 2 or 3 people that shoot it. There used to be 4 but I stopped shooting it. [rofl][laugh2]
Ya ya ya, don't be a hater you, there are plenty of other games out there besides USPSA

Just remember, real men shoot wheel guns, all others shoot bottom feeders [smile]
 
That was the old days, there are tons of revo shooters who are using moon clips. (more below)

Ya ya ya, don't be a hater you, there are plenty of other games out there besides USPSA

Just remember, real men shoot wheel guns, all others shoot bottom feeders [smile]
Well, I've never shot ICORE, so I don't know what's going on there.
 
Well, I've never shot ICORE, so I don't know what's going on there.
ICORE, IDPA, Steel Challenge, Rimfire Challenge (though this one is 22 RF so speed loaders) Knock Down Steel, Plate Shoots etc.

Beating guys with bottom feeders is always a good day [smile]
 
ICORE, IDPA, Steel Challenge, Rimfire Challenge (though this one is 22 RF so speed loaders) Knock Down Steel, Plate Shoots etc.

Beating guys with bottom feeders is always a good day [smile]
I used to shoot revolvers in IDPA. The .38/.357 folks were using speedloaders at the time. Dunno what they are using these days.
 
Probably still using speedloaders if its i.d.p.a..
I think there was a time penalty for using moons
Current rules, Equipment Division:

A.5.1 Revolvers will be categorized into one of the two following sub-categories:
A.5.1.1 Stock Revolver or
A.5.1.2 Enhanced Revolver
A.5.2 Stock Revolver handguns permitted for use must be:
A.5.2.1 Any revolver that uses .38 Special or larger cartridges with a rimmed case and is not loaded with moon clips.
A.5.2.2 The unloaded firearm must weigh 43.00 oz. or less.
A.5.3 Enhanced Revolver handguns permitted for use must be:
A.5.3.1 Any revolver that uses .357 magnum or larger cartridges with rimmed or rimless cases.
A.5.3.2 The unloaded firearm must weigh 50.00 oz. or less.
A.5.3.3 May be loaded via speed loader or full moon clip.
A
.5.4 Stock and Enhanced Revolver requirements:
A.5.4.1 The use of trimmed (shortened) ammunition is not allowed.
A.5.5 Ammunition used must match the cartridge listed on the firearm with the following exceptions:
A.5.5.1 .38 Special in .357 Magnum.
A.5.5.2 .44 Special in .44 Magnum.
A.5.5.3 .45 Auto Rim or .45 GAP in .45 ACP.
A.5.5.4 .45 ACP or .45 GAP in .45 Colt.
A.5.5.5 .40 S&W in 10mm.
A.5.5.6 Barrel length must be 4 ¼” or less.
A.5.5.7 Revolvers must be loaded to the division capacity of 6 rounds in the cylinder. Higher capacity 7 and 8 round revolvers are permitted, but may only load 6 rounds.
A.5.6 Stock and Enhanced Revolver Permitted Modifications (Inclusive list):

A.5.6.1 Sights may be changed to another notch and post type. The frame and barrel may be machined to accept different style sights.
A.5.6.2 Action work to enhance trigger pull as long as safety is maintained (smoothing the trigger face, removing the hammer spur, use of over travel stop, conversion to DA only and addition of ball detent are considered action work and are permitted).
A.5.6.3 Grips may be changed to another style or material that is similar to factory configuration.
A.5.6.4 Grip tape, skateboard tape, etc. may be used.
A.5.6.5 Cylinder latches may be changed to another factory offering from the firearm manufacturer.
A.5.6.6 Chamfer the rear of the chambers.
A.5.6.7 Shortening of factory barrels.
A.5.6.8 Re-barreling to another factory offering for that model.
A.5.6.9 Firearms converted to accept moon clips may be used in Stock Revolver provided moon clips are not used.
A.5.6.10 Custom finishes.
A.5.7 Enhanced Revolver Additional Permitted Modifications (Inclusive list):
A.5.7.1 Cylinder latches may be modified or replaced, but may not protrude past the frame in any direction and may not be thicker than 3/8" as measured from the side plate of the frame.
A.5.7.2 Conversion to accept moon clips.
A.5.8 Stock and Enhanced Revolver Excluded Modifications (Non-Inclusive list):
A.5.8.1 Oversize or heavy barrels.
A.5.8.2 The maximum grip dimensions allowed are: 5.00” maximum height, measured from the bottom of the hammer opening in the frame to the bottom of the grip, 2 3/8” maximum depth, 1 5/8” maximum width.
 
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