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Need some guidance from the 1911 experts

1903Collector

1903Collector

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I picked up a new 4.25" SA Emissary couple of weeks ago, I really like this pistol, it checks a lot of boxes for me and I would like to CCW it at some point but the pistol has two annoying issues that don't seem to be getting better. 1st is a FTF, the round gets jammed up about half way into the chamber. From what I have read it's more than likely an extractor issue. I read on another forum that you can pull the extractor and bend is ever so slightly and they may solve the issue? does that sound right.

The other issue is I think, it has a very tight chamber, all factory FMJ chamber without an issue but my reloads and some Sig HP would not let the slide go into battery, I actually had to put the front of the slide on the bench and whack it to release the semi-chambered round. So I have thoroughly cleaned the pistol twice and over two range session fired 350 rounds, I know that's not much but I thought I would see some improvement as things loosened up a bit.

Should I send back to SA or give it some more shakedown time?

Walt
 
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I have manually manipulated the extractor on more than one 1911, however it is not something I would recommend anyone do without sufficient knowledge of the mechanics.

The chamber sounds awfully tight, a trip back to SA might be warranted. It should not take much to allow that gun to function close to 100%

Good luck.
 
First check your reloads in a case gage. Lots of .45 rounds get fat during bullet seating. Second on the ftf try loading with only five rounds in the magazine. If it loads properly then look at the magazine and it’s follower. If factory ammo runs ok , then your reloads might be the issue.
 
Greg Derr said:
First check your reloads in a case gage. Lots of .45 rounds get fat during bullet seating. Second on the ftf try loading with only five rounds in the magazine. If it loads properly then look at the magazine and it’s follower. If factory ammo runs ok , then your reloads might be the issue.
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Sorry, I should have specified. It's a 9mm. Now I'm curious, I started roll sizing my cases but don't have a lot of inventory on those and didn't use any of those in this pistol. I was using all Wilson magazines (10 of them) and the problem existed with every one of them.

A lot of my reloads won't fully seat in my case gauge, it's usually that last 1/8" or so because the head is slightly bulged but it's never been an issue on any other gun probably because the chambers are more generous. I'm gonna try a batch of roll sized cases and see whaat happens.
 
IPSC_DRL said:
I have manually manipulated the extractor on more than one 1911, however it is not something I would recommend anyone do without sufficient knowledge of the mechanics.

The chamber sounds awfully tight, a trip back to SA might be warranted. It should not take much to allow that gun to function close to 100%

Good luck.
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Yea I'm not gonna go retard on the gun for sure but if its just a simple tweak of the extractor fine, otherwise back to SA it will go.
 
My new 10mm Kimber Target had ftf issues when new. Very tight assembly tolerences. I did some gentile 600 emery polishing of the contact slide points, polished the mag follower, and polished the inside edges of the mag feed lips. And only loading 7 rounds in the mags. This helped quite a bit. Still it took a good 700 rounds for my Kimber to fully break in. Action is very smooth now and no more cycling issues.
 
Check feeding, extraction and ejection with only one round loaded in your mag,.. then multiple rounds seeing if the extracted case is getting ejected out of the way of the next round.
 
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andrew1220 said:
What brass headstamp?
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Factory ball was Blazer brass 124gr, this stuff ran fine for the most part with an occasional failure to go into full battery, a little push on the slide and it would fully chamber and lock up.
Factory hollow points were sig. nickel plated, these would not fully chamber, even with single loading them into the chamber the slide would not go fully into battery and would jam up the slide to the point of having to place the edge on the bench and whack the back of the frame to release the slide.
My reloads were a mix of GFL (Fiocci) and Winchester brass, both with 124gr FMJ heads. these were hit or miss chambering, mostly misses with the same issues as above.

The reset of the cycle is fine, extraction and ejection are perfect, no stove pipes and all brass goes into a neat pile at around the 4-5 o'clock position. Its just feeding/chambering thats the issue.

so basically two separate issues it seems, 1st chambering issue and 2nd round getting jammed up as its stripped off the mag and gets wedged between the breach face and the top of the chamber, I'll try and duplicate later and post a picture.
 
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I'd want to ream that chamber slightly to remove the possibility of a burr. Not something I'd do myself personally, as I have friends for this. You can always send it back to the mothership. My 9mm Ronin does not like lead, but coated runs fine. I will have its chamber opened up down the road.
 
good advice here...or most of it. my sound adage is a 1911 style pistol is not the gun you want to start your amateur gunsmith career off with.

LakeTrout said:
If I buy something that doesn't work the way it is designed to, I send it back before I tweak anything and potentially void the warranty.
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yep, someone needed to say it clearly.
 
greencobra said:
good advice here...or most of it. my sound adage is a 1911 style pistol is not the gun you want to start your amateur gunsmith career off with.


yep, someone needed to say it clearly.
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LakeTrout said:
If I buy something that doesn't work the way it is designed to, I send it back before I tweak anything and potentially void the warranty.
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See post #6
 
Knowing how the extractor interacts with the round on a properly tuned gun will help you out (if the extractor is your issue, which quite often it is on production run 1911's). There is a difference between how the 9mm and .45 extractors contact the cases. Pay attention to that while fiddling with your pistol. You can find Youtube video's on this stuff all day. If you're not comfortable trying it, send it back to SA or to a 'smith. It's ain't rocket surgery though. Your biggest risk on this particular task is over-bending the extractor either way. Honestly, I'd toss the factory one and fit in an Ed Brown or WC replacement anyhow. ;)

As to the tight rounds, it definitely sounds like your reloads are too fat. I've had the same issue with some of my 9mm reloads... sometimes as much as 15% of mine don't freely drop in the case gauge and I put those aside for practice sessions (not competition use). Most times it's Magtech brass that's the culprit. I just toss those now.

It's weird that factory Sig rounds would do the same though. I wouldn't be surprised if the chamber had a burr but don't go trying to remedy that yourself with a dremel or some such stupid move.
 
45collector said:
Knowing how the extractor interacts with the round on a properly tuned gun will help you out (if the extractor is your issue, which quite often it is on production run 1911's). There is a difference between how the 9mm and .45 extractors contact the cases. Pay attention to that while fiddling with your pistol. You can find Youtube video's on this stuff all day. If you're not comfortable trying it, send it back to SA or to a 'smith. It's ain't rocket surgery though. Your biggest risk on this particular task is over-bending the extractor either way. Honestly, I'd toss the factory one and fit in an Ed Brown or WC replacement anyhow. ;)

As to the tight rounds, it definitely sounds like your reloads are too fat. I've had the same issue with some of my 9mm reloads... sometimes as much as 15% of mine don't freely drop in the case gauge and I put those aside for practice sessions (not competition use). Most times it's Magtech brass that's the culprit. I just toss those now.

It's weird that factory Sig rounds would do the same though. I wouldn't be surprised if the chamber had a burr but don't go trying to remedy that yourself with a dremel or some such stupid move.
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I'm going to break it down tonight and clean again and go thru is slowly and see if I can figure out what's going on. I WILL get this gun working cuz I really like it! I did order a Wilson extractor last week...ya know...just in case ;) I have a lot of 9's and this is the only one I have ever had an issue with my reloads and the SIG loads had be scratching my head as well but I have another box of the same lot so I can test again.
 
1903Collector said:
I'm going to break it down tonight and clean again and go thru is slowly and see if I can figure out what's going on. I WILL get this gun working cuz I really like it! I did order a Wilson extractor last week...ya know...just in case ;) I have a lot of 9's and this is the only one I have ever had an issue with my reloads and the SIG loads had be scratching my head as well but I have another box of the same lot so I can test again.
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on a cheaper gun you could get a piece of brass, put a rod into the primer channel, put some metal polish on the brass and with barrel out - polish a chamber a bit, rotating that brass by hand.
on this gun - i would not do it, probably. or would. but it is me. :)
 
Ok, so I stripped it down tonight, cleaned it thoroughly and checked for burrs in and around the chamber, didn't see anything that looked off.

Then I grabbed a bunch of my reloads and some factory stuff and started dropping them in the chamber, some would drop right in and some would not so I got out the mic and started measuring the heads. this is what I found.
Reloads:
GFL brass .390" would not fully chamber, about 1/8" sticks out
Blazer brass .388" all rounds would chamber
Speer brass .390" same as GFL brass
Federal brass .389" would not fully chamber, not as bad as Speer or GFL, about the thickness of the rim

Then I tried some factory stuff, I did not measure these,
Blazer all chambered
Sig hollow points all chambered (older lot, not the ones I used above)
Federal AE all chambered

One curious thing I noticed with the rounds that fully chambered, if I pull the round out, rotated it 180 degrees the round would not chamber and get hung up on the barrel hood. This was with the factory ammo which I'm sure is not perfectly round. Is this chamber too tight or out of spec?????

I did pull the extractor and it had a noticeable bend in it, bowed away from me but I wouldn't know what is too much, I put a round in and did the shake test and it didn't fall out for all that means.

Going to call SA in the morning and set up sending it back.
 
One thing to try if you suspect the extractor tension or geometry being off is to see if it will chamber rounds with the extractor removed. However, in this case I think you should send it to the manufacturer as you suggested.
 
MC56 said:
may want to try some loads with different brass. It's ALWAYS the GFL 9mm cases that don't fit my gauge when using mixed brass. I chuck them.
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I may have already mentioned it in this thread but for me it’s always Magtech brass that’s “too fat”. I chuck those.
 
From SA today:
Good morning,

Our techs recut & polished the barrel ramp, reamed the chamber and tuned the extractor. The pistol was tested and is good to go. Processing and shipping Thursday or Friday.



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