NH Firearms Safety Coalition?

[MaverickNH]

Anybody know about NH Firearms Safety Coalition? Are they like Eddie Eagle?

I see a brief article on them on the Go-NH newsletter, and so assume they are OK. There is no online forum like NES that I know of in NH that is active in discussion of NH 2ndA issues.

It's a little messy here in NH with two different gun-rights organizations (Go-NH and NH Firearms Coalition) that have "significant tensions", to put it mildly, and split membership from NH gunshops and businesses.

".. divided we fall" as they say - it's unfortunate that we can't get along in the NH pro-gun community. Big ego issues...

 

[Len-2A Training]

Actually there are 3 orgs in NH.

If you read the history of the split-ups, reasons why and some actions taken by the BOD of GO-NH after the split-up, you can understand the tensions.

BTW, we had something very similar many years ago between GOAL and the Sportsmen's Council (not certain that I have the name right). Lots of bad blood for many years . . . only recently are they working together for a common purpose.

 

[MaverickNH]

I missed that 3rd organization completely - is it NHFSC you are speaking of?

Some individuals with otherwise very positive pro-gun activities have left a wake of severe disruption in numerous pro-gun organizations, gun clubs and business relationships. This far, the clash among strong egos involved hasn't been capitalized on by the very weak anti-gun movement in NH, but people stand on different sides of the room when present at legislative sessions and rarely in the same room one-on-one with pro-gun executives/legistators.

What's at stake to some appears to be a no-compromise approach on how they demand others exercise their 2ndA rights. I was appalled when one organization's leader criticized a citizen for open carry in the press, and when an allied gun club's leader for calling IDPA-style shooting "whacky" in the NH press. This as much puts limits on exercise of 2ndA rights, telling the public that even prominant pro-gun people think open carry and firearms for self-defense are to be questioned and scrutinized as fringe behaviors. As NH becomes more Massified, this will surely reduce the pro-gun lobby efficacy.

The NHFSC appears to be a stealth organization via Google, but then again, Go-NH and NHFC are relatively obscure compared to GOAL. I'll give them a ring and see what they are about - I'm mostly looking for additional information to add to the Eddie Eagle program for my kids. I had sent copies of the EE video to local school and YMCA leaders and never got an acknowlegment or reply to emails/voicemails, so I assume these bastions of liberal mentality prefer to whine about gun safety rather than take any action to educate kids on gun safety.

NH Ceasefire, looks more dormant than ever - thier website hasn't been updated in 3yr and appears to have been hacked by a German vandal. But no doubt the Brady Bunch will be willing to dump more time/money in NH as SoNH become more like NoMA. The Free State project has it's work cut out for them, just to balance the migration from MA to NH. Most transplants I've talked with think the "Live Free or Die" motto is just about saving on the 5% MA sales tax.

The growing joke is for people north of Concord to tell us folk in the southern 1/5th we ought to move to New Hampshire. Of course, most of the work up north is serving tourists from South of the Border...

What to do but soldier on, but I'd rather be an mercenary 2ndA supporter than have to pick which NH group to set up camp with, as distancing myself from the other would be the inevitable result. I write a check to both now - but remain curious about the 3rd.

 

[Len-2A Training]

OK, I take it that you haven't looked in our State Orgs Forum?

There are forums here for Pro-Gun NH and GO-NH.

Both their websites have info on them.

When I was at the Concord gun show, I picked up literature from a 3rd org but didn't get to chat with them.

I'm not an unbiased party, as I've been friends with Sam Cohen since we were both activists with GOAL a lot of years ago. I've heard (from him and others involved) and read about what went on at GO-NH and Sam's subsequent founding of Pro-Gun NH. My Wife and I are now both Charter Members of Pro-Gun NH . . . someday if she ever retires we hope to escape North.

 

[MaverickNH]

Well, I haven't scrolled down since that new forum was added - thanks for the pointer.

To tip my hand, I always like SC and his perspective, and felt bad when Go-NH sufferred it's 2nd major rift in a short period of time.

To name names, my concern is with NH Firearms Coalition - a group with leaders who have done good things but trashed many people and organizations in the process. One can Google the leaders and find a stream of disputes and lawsuits trailing their passage through, and damage to, several organizations. Thier modus is as much to support the 2ndA as it is to expect active members to disdain many other good people and organizations that serve the cause in ways not to their liking. I have personally observed thier powerplays and intimidation tactics and find such heavy-handed lack of tolerance of other gunowners very distasteful, to say the least. It seems they more preserve a series of petty vendettas than otherwise.

I'll look forward to your migration north - you will more than offset a handful of the run-of-the-mill anti-gun milksops crossing the border.

 

[MaverickNH]

I dropped a quick note to Pro-Gun NH and got a reply from SamC.

They are indeed a unique organization. One joins up for life for $5 to defray the cost of mailing a lapel pin. Members can't attend any meetings.

I guess it can't hurt to "join" - I can always send emails with my opinions on issues.

With Go-NH a shambles and NHFC as described above, I'm left with less than ideal choices.

 

[ScottS]

I dropped a quick note to Pro-Gun NH and got a reply from SamC.

They are indeed a unique organization. One joins up for life for $5 to defray the cost of mailing a lapel pin. Members can't attend any meetings.

I guess it can't hurt to "join" - I can always send emails with my opinions on issues.

With Go-NH a shambles and NHFC as described above, I'm left with less than ideal choices.

GO-NH "in shambles?" Hardly. I think they're much better off than when I first joined 5 years ago. There certain seems to be a lot less petty bickering. They even let members attend their meetings(!) As it was explained to me by a BoD member, a lot of the tension that led to the much-ballyhoo'd "split" a couple of years back had to do with differences in philosophy among board members, specifically whether or not an organization who's stated purpose is to lobby legislators should have directors who are legislators. That's a tough question, IMO, and I can see arguments on both sides.

I'm personally acquainted with some of the leadership team of NH Firearms Coalition, and know them to be avid shooters, passionate gun owners, and personally committed to gun owners' rights.

It's always good to have strong voices in support of gun owners, and there are some good folks at PGNH (although, unless something has changed, the President/Director doesn't even live in NH), but they burned a lot of bridges with me over SB44. When the most vile piece of anti-gun legislation in recent years was initially co-sponsored by a member of the Pro-Gun NH Council of Advisors, you have to ask yourself if we're all pulling on the same oar.

 

[MaverickNH]

GO-NH "in shambles?" Hardly. I think they're much better off than when I first joined 5 years ago. There certain seems to be a lot less petty bickering. They even let members attend their meetings(!) As it was explained to me by a BoD member, a lot of the tension that led to the much-ballyhoo'd "split" a couple of years back had to do with differences in philosophy among board members, specifically whether or not an organization who's stated purpose is to lobby legislators should have directors who are legislators. That's a tough question, IMO, and I can see arguments on both sides.

A shambles from the perspective of a unified state activist stance. Perhaps, as you note, the individuals are better off now separated, but a cause divided is diminished.

I'm personally acquainted with some of the leadership team of NH Firearms Coalition, and know them to be avid shooters, passionate gun owners, and personally committed to gun owners' rights.

No disagreement from me on their committment to the ends, just aversion to the means. Again, with these guys, it's my way or the highway. I was only of several dozen people that didn't exercise my 2ndA rights in a manner they supported and got swept aside with malicious intent. I'm glad they are working for the 2ndA cause, but regret the treatment doled out to those that wouldn't drink the whole glass of Kool-Aid.

It's always good to have strong voices in support of gun owners, and there are some good folks at PGNH (although, unless something has changed, the President/Director doesn't even live in NH), but they burned a lot of bridges with me over SB44. When the most vile piece of anti-gun legislation in recent years was initially co-sponsored by a member of the Pro-Gun NH Council of Advisors, you have to ask yourself if we're all pulling on the same oar.

That was indeed messy. Just as NRA and GOA have had their tensions, and got it togeter for the common cause over Parker, but remain separated over the so-called Veteran's Disarmement Bill, hopefully they can manage two steps forward and only one step back.

I have no problem standing up in a room full of hostile gun-grabbers, but it really does take the wind out of my sails when those on "my side" won't even piss in the same bathroom at the state house. If the Dems get control top-to-bottom in '08, crap like this could set us back decades.

Who do 3 different Pro-2ndA organization represent in a small population state like NH? How do you divide 0.4% of the US population 3 ways and have any impact?

Time to suck it up and shake hands - have guest seats in each each directorship for part of each meeting - they can each have their own "secret" sessions if necessary. This is the time to do it - not, God forbid, should TSHTF in Nov08.

 

[Len-2A Training]

Let's try putting this in perspective . . .

- NH legislators are PT (work 2-3 months/yr), are paid peanuts and thus are all business people who "live in the real world" (totally unlike MA or US legislators). Since the laws they pass impact them too (again unlike MA or US legislators), they seem to be more cautious about passing "feel good legislation". For that reason, IMNSHO, I don't think it's a bad thing to allow them to sit on the BOD of any NH pro-gun org.

- I asked Sam Cohen about the Pro-Gun NH issue on the legislation that Scott mentioned. At least to me, his explanation (IIRC) seemed to be that they supported one idea, but when the "sausage machine" got through with it, it no longer represented their views and they no longer supported the bill. Sounded reasonable to me, but I suggest Scott contacts Sam Cohen directly and discuss it. I asked Sam to join us on NES, but he isn't a computer forum guy, so I don't expect that we'll ever see him here.

 

[ScottS]

Let's try putting this in perspective . . .

- NH legislators are PT (work 2-3 months/yr), are paid peanuts and thus are all business people who "live in the real world" (totally unlike MA or US legislators). Since the laws they pass impact them too (again unlike MA or US legislators), they seem to be more cautious about passing "feel good legislation". For that reason, IMNSHO, I don't think it's a bad thing to allow them to sit on the BOD of any NH pro-gun org.

As I said, I can see both sides of this argument. You make a valid point, but I can also see conflict of interest issues when legislators serve as directors (not just members) of a lobbying organization whose stated purpose is lobbying those very legislators. I know I'd be pretty uncomfortable with my legislator being a Director of the Brady Bunch. Is that guy listening to his constituents? I'm not sure where I come down on this.

- I asked Sam Cohen about the Pro-Gun NH issue on the legislation that Scott mentioned. At least to me, his explanation (IIRC) seemed to be that they supported one idea, but when the "sausage machine" got through with it, it no longer represented their views and they no longer supported the bill. Sounded reasonable to me, but I suggest Scott contacts Sam Cohen directly and discuss it. I asked Sam to join us on NES, but he isn't a computer forum guy, so I don't expect that we'll ever see him here.

Representative John Tholl (R, Coos), member of the Pro-Gun New Hampshire Council of Advisors, knowingly co-sponsored legislation that would have removed the sanction from police chiefs who wrongly (as ajudicated by a court of law) denied a Pistol and Revolver License. This, in and of itself, and before any mutation, is an anti-gun piece of legislation, IMO. Why would you want to remove the liability aspect of the current law? Someone much smarter than I am said, "If you have no recourse, you have no right."

Oh, and why does the President and Director of Pro-Gun NH live in AZ? I'm not sure this even matters, but it rubs me the wrong way.

 

[kevin9]

 

[MaverickNH]

Got the latest NHFC newsletter (Spring 2008) - they couldn't help but slam ProGunNH in the last paragraph of their newsletter.

I guess the pro, the pro-pro- and the pro-pro-pro-gun associations in NH (I can't say which is which) are still are feuding. And the anti-gunners continue to put anti-gun legislation up with seemingly seamless cooperation.

'Tis a pity.