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Noob seeks "Best Bang For Short $$$" in AR Optics

sf3pox1 said:
My Bad. I missed where you provided that info earlier. [hmmm]

In that case: Get the Vortex Red Dot.
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No harm, no foul. [grin] Believe me, my budget is calibrated down to the last penny on this. There is doable and there is not doable... and I just want to get to using my new 'toy' as soon as possible. [wink]

CLMN
 
CLMN said:
Gun = Bushmaster M4A3 (flattop)

Go/No-Go Budget = $200 +/- (excluding mounting hardware)

What is most popular and/or makes the most sense on my very limited budget?

What brands and types of sighting devices should I be considering?

I am old, farsighted and use glasses to read if that matters.

Thanks!!!

CLMN
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Bushnell definitely will give you a lot of quality for your cash. They are a division of Bausch and Lomb. I use a Bushnell fixed 4X scope on my Ruger KM77MKII .308 rifle. It offers a bright and clear field of view and ample magnification. Variables tend to be rather fiddly and not as rugged as fixed powers. Check out Cabela's for the Bushnell line.
 
I don't think anyone's pissed off...If they are, then they forget what it was like to be a newbie - full of enthusiasm and questions. You're not sucking up too much bandwidth CLMN and I know the value of a buck, (recently unemployed myself - though I work at Dicks Sporting Goods part time).

Speaking of DSG, I'm not sure if anyone has mentioned this, but we carry Tru-Glo red dot sights. The cheapest is a straight up 30mm red dot for $39.99, a red/green 30mm for $59.99 and a 2x magnified red dot for $89.99... All I can say is, they work and hold up. I have mounted dozens of them - from .22 rifles, to 12ga turkey and deer guns, to .50 caliber Thompson Center muzzle loaders. In the nearly two years I have been there, one has come back - and it was a freebie included with a shotgun package. I was thinking about plunking the 2x on my NES AR just for S&G....

So, (A): get your arse down to DSG and pick one up. If you don't like it, they have a 90-day return policy. (B): If you have a local Dicks Sporting Goods, see if they are hiring - even part time. The pay is decent and you get a 25% discount [wink] (C): Keep asking questions and ignore the impatient ones - it's how we learn. (D): Spend $19.00 and become a GREEN member - you can attend a members shoot and be surrounded - not only with options, but with a deep knowledge base....[cheers]
 
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MassMark said:
I don't think anyone's pissed off...If they are, then they forget what it was like to be a newbie - full of enthusiasm and questions. You're not sucking up too much bandwidth CLMN and I know the value of a buck, (recently unemployed myself - though I work at Dicks Sporting Goods part time).

Speaking of DSG, I'm not sure if anyone has mentioned this, but we carry Tru-Glo red dot sights. The cheapest is a straight up 30mm red dot for $39.99, a red/green 30mm for $59.99 and a 2x magnified red dot for $89.99... All I can say is, they work and hold up. I have mounted dozens of them - from .22 rifles, to 12ga turkey and deer guns, to .50 caliber Thompson Center muzzle loaders. In the nearly two years I have been there, one has come back - and it was a freebie included with a shotgun package. I was thinking about plunking the 2x on my NES AR just for S&G....

So, (A): get your arse down to DSG and pick one up. If you don't like it, they have a 90-day return policy. (B): If you have a local Dicks Sporting Goods, see if they are hiring - even part time. The pay is decent and you get a 25% discount [wink] (C): Keep asking questions and ignore the impatient ones - it's how we learn. (D): Spend $19.00 and become a GREEN member - you can attend a members shoot and be surrounded - not only with options, but with a deep knowledge base....[cheers]
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In the last few weeks I've spent a lot of money at my local Dick's Sporting Goods... mostly on ammo and a Stack-On 14-gun cabinet to accommodate my new long guns (I hate using cable locks) until I can afford a real safe. I did see a Truglo red dot there... but there was no description or price tag on it and it was kinda separated from the others... so I assumed it was used or part of some package deal. DSG does not show it on-line... so I couldn't determine the price or specs. Last couple of times I was there, nobody was working the gun counter or anywhere close. It's a quiet store.

No one wants a 59-yo handicapped guy working in any big box store (let alone a sports store!). I would be a liability and excessive health cost to them. Arthritis in my hip joints doesn't help either. Like everyone says, I need to find another desk job once the economy rebounds... that is, *if* it ever rebounds.

CLMN
 
The website does not always show store stock and vise-versa....Until recently, the web store was run by an entirely different company, (subcontracted), but I understand that is not the case. We carry Tru Glo for sure and now have "Web Special Ordering"... I'm 99% sure WSO is available in all stores now, but even if it isn't, we have them in Pittsfield and they will transfer one in for you at no charge - they just call. With WSO, you pay in advance and they ship to your door...
 
MassMark said:
The website does not always show store stock and vise-versa....Until recently, the web store was run by an entirely different company, (subcontracted), but I understand that is not the case. We carry Tru Glo for sure and now have "Web Special Ordering"... I'm 99% sure WSO is available in all stores now, but even if it isn't, we have them in Pittsfield and they will transfer one in for you at no charge - they just call. With WSO, you pay in advance and they ship to your door...
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I'm not understanding what you mean by "Web Special Pricing" and how that would help me out in this situation (or in the future). There are no Truglo scopes shown on the DSB on-line site. In any case, I'll call the store and see what they have to say about it. They only had the one Truglo red dot on display with no description or price. I don't even know for sure which one it was.

CLMN
 
CLMN said:
I'm not understanding what you mean by "Web Special Pricing" and how that would help me out in this situation (or in the future). There are no Truglo scopes shown on the DSB on-line site. In any case, I'll call the store and see what they have to say about it. They only had the one Truglo red dot on display with no description or price. I don't even know for sure which one it was.

CLMN
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Nope - it's "Web Special Ordering" - not pricing. You go into Dicks Sporting Goods, ask if they have any Tru-Glo red dot sights, (whichever one is in your price range). If yes, then you're all set - buy the one you can afford. If no, then they have a web connection to all available stock in all Dicks Sporting Goods locations and the web store. They find the sight, place the order, give you a UPC. You go to the cash register, pay for your item and decide whether you want to pick it up in store, or have it delivered to your door....Easy breezy...
 
MassMark said:
Nope - it's "Web Special Ordering" - not pricing. You go into Dicks Sporting Goods, ask if they have any Tru-Glo red dot sights, (whichever one is in your price range). If yes, then you're all set - buy the one you can afford. If no, then they have a web connection to all available stock in all Dicks Sporting Goods locations and the web store. They find the sight, place the order, give you a UPC. You go to the cash register, pay for your item and decide whether you want to pick it up in store, or have it delivered to your door....Easy breezy...
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Ahhhhhhh... okay! Now I get it. [smile] Thanks for the tip... and sorry about the misquote! [grin]

CLMN
 
And the winner is...

The Bushnell Tactical Elite 1x32 Red/Green T-Dot Riflescope for $135 Delivered:

41qev3WwlcL._SL500_AA280_.jpg

http://www.amazon.com/Bushnell-Tact...e=UTF8&s=sporting-goods&qid=1257186224&sr=8-1

I also ordered a Bushnell Laser Boresighter and Riser Mount. Total for order including delivery: $171.67 from Amazon.

I would have ordered the far less expensive Barska 1x30 IR M-16 Electro Sight in lieu of the Bushnell (just to save money)... but I really liked the quality feel and green option on the Bushnell.

The Vortex Strikefire was awfully damn interesting but the mount design bothered me. The 2X doubler also did nothing for me. Still, I may come to regret not going that route.

I tried the BSA 42mm tube and it was fine. Same with the Truglo. But in the end, the Bushnell was the clear winner for my particular "old man's" eyeballs.

I can also report that I am well along the road toward choosing my next (distance) scope. I now know just what I want. I've just got to figure out how to pay for it. [grin]

Many, many thanks to all who contributed to this lengthy thread. I valued every opinion voiced and appreciated your patience. Thank you all for your help!

CLMN
 
Keep us posted on how well it works.
BTW, +1 for EC's comment on the SuperSniper, great scope for the money.

CLMN said:
The Bushnell Tactical Elite 1x32 Red/Green T-Dot Riflescope for $135 Delivered:
http://www.amazon.com/Bushnell-Tact...e=UTF8&s=sporting-goods&qid=1257186224&sr=8-1

I also ordered a Bushnell Laser Boresighter and Riser Mount. Total for order including delivery: $171.67 from Amazon.

I would have ordered the far less expensive Barska 1x30 IR M-16 Electro Sight in lieu of the Bushnell (just to save money)... but I really liked the quality feel and green option on the Bushnell.

The Vortex Strikefire was awfully damn interesting but the mount design bothered me. The 2X doubler also did nothing for me. Still, I may come to regret not going that route.

I tried the BSA 42mm tube and it was fine. Same with the Truglo. But in the end, the Bushnell was the clear winner for my particular "old man's" eyeballs.

I can also report that I am well along the road toward choosing my next (distance) scope. I now know just what I want. I've just got to figure out how to pay for it. [grin]

Many, many thanks to all who contributed to this lengthy thread. I valued every opinion voiced and appreciated your patience. Thank you all for your help!

CLMN
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chetD said:
awe, I see Amazon still sucks in the shipping dept.
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This email notification just arrived: "This shipment was sent via USPS (estimated delivery date: November 13, 2009)."

Hard to believe. Must be on a slow boat from China. I've never had this much trouble with Amazon before. [frown]

CLMN
 
Did you use the free super saver shipping?

I order stuff from Amazon almost weekly, so I pay the Amazon Prime fee once a year and put two day on everything. Only once have I been delayed (by a day)
 
vellnueve said:
Did you use the free super saver shipping?

I order stuff from Amazon almost weekly, so I pay the Amazon Prime fee once a year and put two day on everything. Only once have I been delayed (by a day)
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Yes, it was free super saver shipping. I'd never had a problem like this before except when I ordered from an affiliated supplier through Amazon. In that situation, I was eventually forced to cancel and reorder from someone else. That delay, posted well after the purchase, was to be several weeks.

It's obvious that Amazon was out of stock on an least one item I ordered. I wish they would just tell you that and not blame it on a shipper. So far, USPS tracking is still showing "no record of this item." [angry]

CLMN
 
vellnueve said:
USPS tracking doesn't usually update until late on the night of shipping or the next day.
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It's now a full 24 hours since that "Shipment has left seller facility and is in transit" notification email arrived and I am still getting: "There is no record of this item" on the USPS website. The status change time on Amazon is given as 08:04:15 AM Thursday and the projected delivery date is still November 13th. Bottom line is that it will get here when it gets here. Too late to change anything now. My bad for using Amazon. I will try my best to learn something from this. [frown]

CLMN
 
CLMN said:
It's now a full 24 hours since that "Shipment has left seller facility and is in transit" notification email arrived and I am still getting: "There is no record of this item" on the USPS website. The status change time on Amazon is given as 08:04:15 AM Thursday and the projected delivery date is still November 13th. Bottom line is that it will get here when it gets here. Too late to change anything now. My bad for using Amazon. I will try my best to learn something from this. [frown]

CLMN
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Don't worry too much about the updates. USPS doesn't seem to update the progress as often as UPS does. Several times I've had USPS shipments arrive before the updates reflect that.

Good luck with the sight. I had looked at those a while back. Post back your experience with it when you get a chance to try it out.
 
matt said:
you realize of course that USPS is a .gov organization, right? [wink]

just wait 'till they dispense healthcare...
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You don't have to warn me. I know of government provided healthcare firsthand and it sucks watermelons. [sad]

CLMN

p.s., USPS website is still saying: "There is no record of this item." -clmn
 
The Bushnell 1x32 red/green dot scope arrived from Amazon on Thursday (yesterday, after taking close to 2 weeks by wagon train)... and went back the same day. I should have paid much closer attention to the comments on Amazon, Cabela and elsewhere regarding (lack of) quality control. Now I know they were true. The alloy casting on the one sent to me was seriously malformed. Besides looking bad, mating surfaces were not sealed correctly and the T-dot appeared off. What a cheap piece of crap.

Where do I go from here? I don't know. First I have to wait for the credit card refund to appear (times are tough here!) and then I will attack it again. I really liked the red/green dot choice (and green better than red for my old eyes) so I will hunt for something of better quality in that same vein.

CLMN
 
CLMN said:
The Bushnell 1x32 red/green dot scope arrived from Amazon on Thursday (yesterday, after taking close to 2 weeks by wagon train)... and went back the same day. I should have paid much closer attention to the comments on Amazon, Cabela and elsewhere regarding (lack of) quality control. Now I know they were true. The alloy casting on the one sent to me was seriously malformed. Besides looking bad, mating surfaces were not sealed correctly and the T-dot appeared off. What a cheap piece of crap.

Where do I go from here? I don't know. First I have to wait for the credit card refund to appear (times are tough here!) and then I will attack it again. I really liked the red/green dot choice (and green better than red for my old eyes) so I will hunt for something of better quality in that same vein.

CLMN
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Honestly not surprised, it looks like an acog ripoff. A lot of the same features for about 1/10 of the cost. You get what you pay for with optics. YMMV.
 
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I'd just order it from Midway, but honestly I think you should think about that BSA again. Functionality is exactly the same and you can bank the extra money for high-powered glass in the future.
 
Vortex service is reported to be excellent - they stand behind their products.
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Vortex is the only scope company I know of that does not have an "electronics limited to xx year(s)" clause in their "lifetime" warranty. Even a $2500 Savorski's lifetime warranty excludes the electronic illumination system.
 

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