The Sig Romeo4T is a good compromise. Parts made in China, but QCed and assembled in U.S. Solar backup and circle dot because the parts are made by Holosun. But, pricier than the 515 Holosun equivalent.
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Optic for ar?
- Thread starter Brannigan03
- Start date
Dunno, I just do not think it is worth $440 when that is available at $240
AT3™ 3xP Scope - 3x Prism Scope with Illuminated BDC Reticle
Grab a 3x Prism Scope with Illuminated BDC Reticle for your AR-15 from AT3 Tactical. Free Shipping on Orders Over $99!
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They can also be found for very low under MSRP. I paid $240 for mine. Have a decent astigmatism and it is crystal clear with glasses. Makes me want to go for holosun over trijicon for my pistol optic.
meanwhile - there is a sort of new kid in town - i decided to get it to look it up.
View: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B095PQ4L45
some ppl say glass quality is better than viper pst 1, but slightly worse than pst2. IF it is even remotely close to pst2 - i will keep it, as i almost never use the illumination feature anyway.
just curious to see how it will look like.
PS. and found a correct 20moa mount on amazon for it, finally
View: https://www.amazon.com/Burris-410345-AR-Peprx-Mount-Picatinny/dp/B00HNSJC6K
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I put the pst2 1-6 on my larue 14.5, so far I like it, but I have some other adjustments I want to make to my rifle set up now and may re zero again with different ammo. Glass is as expected based off my pst2 5-25, I havent looked through anything from vortex cheaper than that yet to compare to though.
Following this theme, I think Ill need an 18" AR with the 3-15 next
i will hopefully deal with new Venom i got next week. size wise it is same as the 3-15 - it is 15" long. weight wise - in between of 3-15 and 5-25 pst2. a crazy good 3-18 razor is much heavier.
56mm lens gives noticeably more light in compared to the pst2 5-25x50. turrets are comparable at the first impression, but, i will need it checked at the range to understand better.
all in all, if they would make a 3-15x venom, that would be my ideal choice, but, there is no such scope, so, this one will do, for now. i understand on some sales it was possible to get 3-15x pst2 for $599, but, i do not see it nowhere at such price. therefore a $499 venom actually fits just fine.
like i posted above, it will go on the 20moa burris mount, 34mm, so in some potential future scenarios, if i will get extra cash i can put there a 3-18 razor. but, i kinda doubt that.
as of having 3x or 5x at the wide end - for that 20" rifle it goes onto it will not be a huge issue. 16" will get 1-10x arrowhead and 1-6x pst2 will be kept in reserve for now.
I am tempted to grab a venom now too. Maybe Ill try to get a friend to buy one so I can try it firsti will hopefully deal with new Venom i got next week. size wise it is same as the 3-15 - it is 15" long. weight wise - in between of 3-15 and 5-25 pst2. a crazy good 3-18 razor is much heavier.
56mm lens gives noticeably more light in compared to the pst2 5-25x50. turrets are comparable at the first impression, but, i will need it checked at the range to understand better.
all in all, if they would make a 3-15x venom, that would be my ideal choice, but, there is no such scope, so, this one will do, for now. i understand on some sales it was possible to get 3-15x pst2 for $599, but, i do not see it nowhere at such price. therefore a $499 venom actually fits just fine.
like i posted above, it will go on the 20moa burris mount, 34mm, so in some potential future scenarios, if i will get extra cash i can put there a 3-18 razor. but, i kinda doubt that.
as of having 3x or 5x at the wide end - for that 20" rifle it goes onto it will not be a huge issue. 16" will get 1-10x arrowhead and 1-6x pst2 will be kept in reserve for now.
i do not know how much the lack of the illuminated reticle will affect usability of this scope for far away dark targets. i guess the idea was to increase the lens size to improve its overall brightness enough to compensate the effect of the black reticle on the dark background, but, it is yet to be seen. still, a $499 5-25x scope. when i got a pst2 it was a $1000.
DarthRevan
NES Member
it is made in china, yes. proudly labeled right on the belly. like i said, i`ll need to look through it at 300yds. preliminary, looking at the roof at 150yds somewhat it looks ok.
ps. getting a TenMile 3-18x indeed would save a ton of time. but no one here is looking for an easy solution.
Tallahassee
NES Member
This thread went a little bit out of hand if you can wait wait for the Fourth of July sale there should be plenty of red dots that are under $200 mark.
I guess the real question is what do you want the purpose of the AR to be close range or Long range or both? Sounds like you probably want a low cost read that with a magnifier which would probably fit your What you’re looking for.
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I zeroed my new 5-25x venom today. Non illuminated reticle is a definite minus, but, it is perfectly usable. I had pst2 side by side and other than lack of illumination- it was very close.
One thing that is annoying- the zero stop is done in a weird way there - you have to take turret off and put a special ring in there and turn it clockwise until it stops, put back the turret- but after that it still turns 5 clicks down until it stops. Really weird new mechanics. Guide was not clear you have to keep that ring in it, or I missed it, may be. Pst2 turrets design is more sensible - it stops at 0, not at 5 clicks past 0.
But, a $1000 vs &499 - venom 5-25x wins there hands down. It is a Chinese build, but, the glass is pretty good.
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I haven't had a chance to see one yet, but thats good input on the zero stop. Ive gotten used to the pst2 and like it, theres some places that get the price low enough to be worth it over the 500. I do still think ill try a venom for a chealer build soon
It seems like for AR optics its most important to decide whether you want an LPVO with Variable magnification, or you want a fixed magnification optic, or you want a red dot/ no magnification optic.
Also it looks like popular routes for medium to long range will be to use an LPVO or use a red dot with magnifier.
Also it looks like popular routes for medium to long range will be to use an LPVO or use a red dot with magnifier.
It obviously depends upon the type of a rifle and the intended use case.
Those new kinds of 1-10x LPVOs are extremely versatile, and, frankly, are quite awesome.
Red dot on long rifle I think can only be a supplement, not a primary - if one wants no magnification a 1x prism with a BDC reticle is more useful.
A short barrel AR pistol or SBR that not going to be shot beyond 50yds is often set with a red dot, but it is not a rifle.
A 20” LaRue I just setup is a 12lbs heavy thing, I like it on 5-25x with a pinty red dot on a side very much. A 16” light one will be set with 1-10x only, I do not want any extra weight on her.
Thats a good point, tie the optic to the style of rifle. Those larger optics get heavy. Also i agree, a proper rifle with an LPVO, and then an offset red dot holosun 503 or rmr ,seems to be the best of both worlds.
I use the holosun 510c and its an absolute blast. I can purchase a holosun magnifier for it for around $175-225 if I want to keep the setup and make it for further distances. https://holosun.com/index/product/detail/id/181.html
Not perfect, and arguably beginning to be out of fashion, but I think it would work very well for close range to 300-400 yards.
DarthRevan
NES Member
If you’re contemplating a magnifier… you’d be better off saving for a better lpvo
I went w a vortex strike eagle 1-6x and 45 offset pop up sights. But saw a sale for vortex crossfire gen 2 and planning on using that as the offset and maybe keeping the front sight as co- witness
Wait for the 4th of July sale if ur gonna do red dot or lpvo .
Wait for the 4th of July sale if ur gonna do red dot or lpvo .
with that glass it would really help you big time to get to a some brick and mortar shop and compare them side by side. a lot of more modern glass of a lower line can be comparable with an older glass of upper lines, so, it is tricky. i would look at diamondback instead, but, better compare and decide for yourself.
keep in mind that any chinese manufactured models are a russian roulette quality wise - you may luck out, or you may not.
reading amazon reviews it is quite obvious they do have plenty of bad samples getting out. the venom 5-25x one i got seems to be ok, though.
venom is a good sample of vortex trickery - it really is a pst2 scope with light taken out and some slightly inferior turrets dropped in - and overall the glass is good enough to be comparable with pst2 twice the price. i do not know if they did it with crossfire 2 or not also, who knows.
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I see the magnifier/red dot combo being better in one CONOP that is common in LE applications. Keep a light and fast red dot on the patrol carbine for the vast majority of situations where it is sufficient. And with a QD mount, just throw the magnifier on in those rare times you need the extra glass. Though, I’m not LE and I know they already have a whole bunch of crap on their belt and vest. I suppose they could just keep it in their car most of the time.
i do understand that magnifiers exist for a reason, but, that reason of pairing it on a dot escapes me. you essentially do a 3x on the 3moa dot. it is not a BDC reticle, just a dot.
what distance you need that 3x for and what is it going to accomplish? the 3x prism with a BDC reticle, or a 1x prism with a magnifier - sure.
what good will a magnifier do with a red dot?
Target ID / threat assessment / seeing an arm or a leg sticking out from cover that you may not see otherwise.
Dot size though, on a rifle I wouldn’t go past a 2 MOA dot.
Primary Arms does have a small magnifier coming out with a ranging reticle built in though, that seems pretty handy. No BDC obviously, but let’s you know if you need to hold the dot on the guy’s face or on his head like a hat.
