Red dot on a carry pistol - worth it to mill a slide or nah?

[Bodhisattva]

Have it milled, or buy an aftermarket slide. Ignore the naysayers. Red dots on pistols are awesome, perfect or crappy vision. It takes time to adjust and train yourself. But it can be done by dry fire and retraining your brain. With a red dot, focus on your target not the dot. Bring the dot into your field of vision. Your target should be clear and the dot fuzzy. The presentation is the toughest part. I talked a lot of shit about dots on pistols when they first came around. I reluctantly adapted out of boredom and something to play with at the range. The dot quickly got rotated onto my carry gun.

I will say it’s harder to zero a dot on a pistol compared to a dot on a rifle.

 

[M1911]

it is a totally bad idea to put a red dot on a carry gun. it is not needed there and will fail you when you`ll need it.
even if you will go with a model that automatically adjusts brightness, it is still an additional element, totally unnecessary for shooting a human size target within 10 yds.
in a case of the danger you will rely on your natural aim first anyway and will have no time to operate the red dot.

for a competition gun - sure, red dot is great to shoot at plates from 20 yds. to put it on a EDC P365 sig - a stupid thing. if you want to gucci it - put a light on it, with laser or without, like a tlr6.

PS. if you are unable to pull it from the holster and make a hole in the 12" paper target at 5 yds without looking at sights or aiming - you need to work on that. it is same as to point a finger at something. a basic skill, but, needs to be worked, as anything else.

Nonsense.

Like everything, red dots have advantages and disadvantages. They have become very reliable. Not all defensive shootings happen with 5 yards. Many defensive shootings happen in low light and red dots are massively easier to shoot in low light than iron sights.

Red dots are expensive. You need to change the battery once a year. You need to train with them.

 

[JRT]

My Holosun SCS is solar (and artificial light) rechargeable. Even stored dark, it consumes less power than it gains from recharging. The claim is: it will, essentially, run indefinitely so long as there is an ambient light source, and will run down without light in an absurdly long time.

I trust you are correct on the battery life. My issue is with the refresh rate.

 

[eboos]

I trust you are correct on the battery life. My issue is with the refresh rate.

When saying refresh rate are you talking about “shake awake”? I have no experience with that. The SCS is always on. Currently the SCS is Glock MOS exclusive. Other cuts may come in the future.

 

[drgrant]

Considering adding a holo sight on my carry pistols and wonder if it's worth the trouble and cost to get the slide milled or to just go the cheaper route and get the rear sight adapter. How many of you find yourselves using the backup tall irons anyway? Figured at self defense distances, even with an electronic dot fail, you could eyeball the middle of the reticle and guesstimate your shots.

Putting a RDS in a dovetail is gay.

If I was going into with the TV set craze I would definitely mill or get a slide that was already set up for it. One advantage of milling is that you can have them set it wherever you want in terms of depth, within reason and have it tapped specifically for the RDS you're going to use instead of having to use those s***** adapter plates...

 

[paul73]

Nonsense.

everything what may break - will break when you will need it most. and a red dot is the least reliable part of any gun.
iron night sights that glow in the dark will not fail and will be visible in any sunlight.

to each his own.

 

[M1911]

everything what may break - will break when you will need it most. and a red dot is the least reliable part of any gun.
iron night sights that glow in the dark will not fail and will be visible in any sunlight.

to each his own.

Every time I holster my gun I first check to see if the red dot is working. The chance that the red dot will break between that morning when it is working and later on the one day that I have a deadly force encounter is vanishingly small. If the dot does go down, then I have backup iron sights to use. I’ve currently got 4 red dots that I’ve put thousands of rounds through. None of them have failed me yet.

I’ve had plenty of tritium iron sights. They are expensive. They only last about 10 years. Then you have to replace them or send your slide off to Trijicon to have the vials replaced. That is relatively inexpensive, but takes at least a couple months. Replacing sites in a dovetail is doable, but it is far more work than replacing the battery in a red dot.

Even with tritium night sights, shooting in low light with a red dot is much, much easier. Compete in a few IDPA matches with a low light stage and you will see.

 

[eboos]

everything what may break - will break when you will need it most. and a red dot is the least reliable part of any gun.
iron night sights that glow in the dark will not fail and will be visible in any sunlight.

to each his own.

Just to throw this out there: many factory RDS equipped pistols have suppressor height sights. My setup co-witnesses with the factory sights.

 

[G4Y4HK]

Lol this guy milled out another channel far forward for back up rear irons. Looks silly no? Is that the only way possible on a SK model? If that's the case I'll prob do it on the full size instead.

 

[drgrant]

When saying refresh rate are you talking about “shake awake”? I have no experience with that. The SCS is always on. Currently the SCS is Glock MOS exclusive. Other cuts may come in the future.View attachment 661536

Someone finally made a sight that will actually fit a specific gun? One of the big things that turn me off about TV sets with those stupid f****** plates...... having sights that will bolt into Factory threads is a huge win... I honestly don't understand why they didn't just make some kind of a standard out of the gate but I think the RDS manufacturers were too busy banging their E-penises against one another... so the market suffered as a result with lots of garbage.

 

[PappyM3]

everything what may break - will break when you will need it most. and a red dot is the least reliable part of any gun.
iron night sights that glow in the dark will not fail and will be visible in any sunlight.

to each his own.

Gotta be honest. You’re sounding like a fudd talking about Aimpoints on rifles in the early 2000s.

 

[JRT]

When saying refresh rate are you talking about “shake awake”? I have no experience with that. The SCS is always on. Currently the SCS is Glock MOS exclusive. Other cuts may come in the future.View attachment 661536

Refresh rate is how often the dot is regenerated on the display. So if you are looking through an RMR you see a crisp dot moving around the optic if you make a circular motion. With a lower refresh rate you see almost a continuous circle or a dot with a long tail. Holosun gets the long battery life on a lot of things I'm sure, one is by having a lower refresh rate. The dot is illuminating less often, you don't see it at all when the dot is static.

This may be nitpicking, I just don't like it. I noticed it first on the Shield.

 

[M1911]

The argument put forward by some people is that putting the rear sight in front of the red dot makes it less prominent so that it won’t attract your eye when you should be looking for the dot instead. I don’t have any slides milled this way so I don’t have any opinion about whether that is correct or not. I wouldn’t be adverse to trying it, but my red dot guns are either Glock MOS or aftermarket slides already milled for the RMR or RMS footprint, and all have the dovetail behind the red dot.

 

[eboos]

Someone finally made a sight that will actually fit a specific gun? One of the big things that turn me off about TV sets with those stupid f****** plates...... having sights that will bolt into Factory threads is a huge win... I honestly don't understand why they didn't just make some kind of a standard out of the gate but I think the RDS manufacturers were too busy banging their E-penises against one another... so the market suffered as a result with lots of garbage.

As soon as I learned about it I was sold. Considered a Sig 320 XC Romeo, but I already have Glock holsters, and didn’t want to switch to an entirely new platform.

 

[MarkT]

My vision is getting worse so I put a red dot on everything. So worth it for me. Also night vision back up irons on defensive pistols are a must IMHO.

 

[paul73]

Gotta be honest. You’re sounding like a fudd talking about Aimpoints on rifles in the early 2000s.

it`s ok and fine with me if i do. i do not have red dots on rifles neither. an etched prism or a scope - something that will work with no power if battery dies or gets wet.

ever tried to shoot a red dot in the rain? or pistol whip somebody hard, with that glassy thingy? or get dropped on a concrete hard with the gun on your side?
like i said already - anyone is free to do what they want to do, it is a free world.

 

[eboos]

The argument put forward by some people is that putting the rear sight in front of the red dot makes it less prominent so that it won’t attract your eye when you should be looking for the dot instead. .

I got the impression that for aftermarket cuts it is a matter of available real estate on the slide. The factory rear sight location would not allow a RDS cut forward of it on many guns.

 

[eboos]

it`s ok and fine with me if i do. i do not have red dots on rifles neither. an etched prism or a scope - something that will work with no power if battery dies or gets wet.

ever tried to shoot a red dot in the rain? or pistol whip somebody hard, with that glassy thingy? or get dropped on a concrete hard with the gun on your side?
like i said already - anyone is free to do what they want to do, it is a free world.

Personally, I never had the occasion to pistol whip someone. Must be missing the finer things in life.

 

[PappyM3]

it`s ok and fine with me if i do. i do not have red dots on rifles neither. an etched prism or a scope - something that will work with no power if battery dies or gets wet.

ever tried to shoot a red dot in the rain? or pistol whip somebody hard, with that glassy thingy? or get dropped on a concrete hard with the gun on your side?
like i said already - anyone is free to do what they want to do, it is a free world.

Yeah, I’ve shot red dots in the rain. Never pistol whipped anybody though. Does muzzle tapping them in the face with a rifle count?

As for hard contact on the ground, there are duty capable pistol red dots that have proven themselves on patrol officer’s guns and have handled scuffles on the ground and being smashed into hard surfaces to do one-handed action cycling.

It’s totally cool if someone doesn’t want to use a red dot. They’re not for everyone. Just be intellectually honest about the pros, cons, and preferences. And don’t come out of the gate, swinging with lines like “it is a totally bad idea to put a red dot on a carry gun. it is not needed there and will fail you when you`ll need it.”

The pros do outweigh the cons for me though.

 

[JRT]

Yeah, I’ve shot red dots in the rain. Never pistol whipped anybody though. Does muzzle tapping them in the face with a rifle count?

As for hard contact on the ground, there are duty capable pistol red dots that have proven themselves on patrol officer’s guns and have handled scuffles on the ground and being smashed into hard surfaces to do one-handed action cycling.

It’s totally cool if someone doesn’t want to use a red dot. They’re not for everyone. Just be intellectually honest about the pros, cons, and preferences. And don’t come out of the gate, swinging with lines like “it is a totally bad idea to put a red dot on a carry gun. it is not needed there and will fail you when you`ll need it.”

The pros do outweigh the cons for me though.

View attachment 661565
View attachment 661566
View attachment 661569

I also appreciate the Wilson grip module.

 

[AJK129]

This is one of my favorites

 

[paul73]

The pros do outweigh the cons for me though.

not for me.
and i have an RMR, SRO and DPP on my range guns. and a pinty on ruger. do not have holosuns, though. carry and home defense handguns are all night irons and will remain so.

PS. i do understand and respect your opinion and comments. i still disagree with you, though.

 

[boilermaker]

Get the slide milled or go with an after-market slide. And the comment about it taking longer to acquire the dot, yes, that happens at first, thats why you have practice. I really dig the dot and put them on my pistols now.

 

[Broc]

Inside 10 yards, you almost shouldn't even be looking at your sights.

This.

This stage on steel challenge is the fastest stage, no one looks at their sights. The 4 rectangle targets are about a torso size.

When you are that close, you draw and shoot. If you can't do it, you are not practicing enough.

I have shoot that stage in 2.7 seconds with a revolver and never aimed except for the stop plate.

A red dot is nice to have it, but I would train to not rely on it.

 

[M1911]

it`s ok and fine with me if i do. i do not have red dots on rifles neither. an etched prism or a scope - something that will work with no power if battery dies or gets wet.

ever tried to shoot a red dot in the rain? or pistol whip somebody hard, with that glassy thingy? or get dropped on a concrete hard with the gun on your side?
like i said already - anyone is free to do what they want to do, it is a free world.

Battery dying is easily dealt with, put a reminder in the calendar app on your phone to remind you once a year to replace the battery. Done.

 

[M1911]

Inside 10 yards, you almost shouldn't even be looking at your sights.

If you are taking the 40 yard 'Mall Shooter Shot', I'm not sure I can hold a gun steady enough to not have a red dot distract me while trying to aim. They seem to be the new 'gee whiz' gadget for the tippy top shooters, shooting in competitions. I'm not sure how well they work on a 2 way range.

More than a few police agencies and top tier military units have started to use them. At 15 yards, you will be significantly faster and more accurate with a red dot.

 

[weekendracer]

More than a few police agencies and top tier military units have started to use them. At 15 yards, you will be significantly faster and more accurate with a red dot.

I'm not saying they don't work. I'm saying, 'most' people don't practice with them enough to make it worth while over a solid set of iron sights like the Ameriglo sights I had on my issued Glock.

 

[T-Unit]

Inside 10 yards, you almost shouldn't even be looking at your sights.

If you are taking the 40 yard 'Mall Shooter Shot', I'm not sure I can hold a gun steady enough to not have a red dot distract me while trying to aim. They seem to be the new 'gee whiz' gadget for the tippy top shooters, shooting in competitions. I'm not sure how well they work on a 2 way range.

I should try more speed point and shoot with the red dot I have on a .22 and see if at typical 7 yard range it makes a difference (I doubt it) but at 40 yards it absolutely will make a difference in terms of speed and acquisition.

 

[M1911]

I should try more speed point and shoot with the red dot I have on a .22 and see if at typical 7 yard range it makes a difference (I doubt it) but at 40 yards it absolutely will make a difference in terms of speed and acquisition.

Don’t have to go out to 40 yards. Try ten yard head shots with irons and then red dot.

 

[PATRON]

I have this on my Ruger LC9, and it's also a flash light.