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The thing is, 40 yards is a long way to shoot with a CCW type gun. I was shooting at 50 with a G17 with some goodies on it. I shot my G43x today for the first time. 40 yards with that gun would definitely be a challenge, shooting it 'fast' would be more than I could handle at that range. I wouldn't bet on myself getting solid hits at second par times between shots.I should try more speed point and shoot with the red dot I have on a .22 and see if at typical 7 yard range it makes a difference (I doubt it) but at 40 yards it absolutely will make a difference in terms of speed and acquisition.
I'm going to ask to borrow the range guys' 43 with a red dot. I've just always felt they were like lasers, you see so much jitter, unless you are comfortable with the jitter, it'd be a distraction. That said, I know a bunch of high level shooters that are transitioning to dots, there must be something to it. I know they work on rifles, maybe just need to bite the bullet and ride the learning curve.Don’t have to go out to 40 yards. Try ten yard head shots with irons and then red dot.
I'm going to go with 'meh' on the weight. At least the couple of times I've handled a pistol with a dot on it, which I admit isn't a lot of trigger time.anyone want to address the added weight vs the recoil spring and reliable cycling of the gun without some tuning?
2.7 from a 'real' holster, or low ready?This.
This stage on steel challenge is the fastest stage, no one looks at their sights. The 4 rectangle targets are about a torso size.
When you are that close, you draw and shoot. If you can't do it, you are not practicing enough.
I have shoot that stage in 2.7 seconds with a revolver and never aimed except for the stop plate.
A red dot is nice to have it, but I would train to not rely on it.
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Holy shit i dont often read all the comments on a 3 page thread but goddamn did this one deliver. Strong candidate for top 10 out yourself threads of 2022 so far.
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The future is now. Quality RDS are superior to iron sights in Every. Single. Way.
So I assume you o ly use revolvers, since you're more likely to get a failure with a semi auto.everything what may break - will break when you will need it most. and a red dot is the least reliable part of any gun.
iron night sights that glow in the dark will not fail and will be visible in any sunlight.
to each his own.
40 yards is a long distance for a 3 inch barrel with iron sights, yes, but the dot doesn't care about sight radius. You may have to still use kentucky windage and hold off the target to hit it at that distance, but you'll have an easier time doing it with a dot optic, which means faster.The thing is, 40 yards is a long way to shoot with a CCW type gun. I was shooting at 50 with a G17 with some goodies on it. I shot my G43x today for the first time. 40 yards with that gun would definitely be a challenge, shooting it 'fast' would be more than I could handle at that range. I wouldn't bet on myself getting solid hits at second par times between shots.
I'm going to ask to borrow the range guys' 43 with a red dot. I've just always felt they were like lasers, you see so much jitter, unless you are comfortable with the jitter, it'd be a distraction. That said, I know a bunch of high level shooters that are transitioning to dots, there must be something to it. I know they work on rifles, maybe just need to bite the bullet and ride the learning curve.
Unless your gun is junk that shouldn’t be a problem.anyone want to address the added weight vs the recoil spring and reliable cycling of the gun without some tuning?
That is only a consideration with 22lr pistols that cycle the slide. Or maybe if you’re shooting powder puff loads for a competition.anyone want to address the added weight vs the recoil spring and reliable cycling of the gun without some tuning?
Haven’t had an issue.anyone want to address the added weight vs the recoil spring and reliable cycling of the gun without some tuning?
1) not if you have old eyes like mine.On a carry pistol, under most expected circumstances, a big, easy to see front sight is all that shoild be needed..
You will see wobble with your red dot. You get used to it in the same way you get used to using iron sites at various distances. At 5 yards, you know you don’t need an perfect iron site picture to hit the target — a flash of the front site on the center of the target and you are good. For head shots at 50’, you know you have to settle the sights and focus hard on the front sight.The thing is, 40 yards is a long way to shoot with a CCW type gun. I was shooting at 50 with a G17 with some goodies on it. I shot my G43x today for the first time. 40 yards with that gun would definitely be a challenge, shooting it 'fast' would be more than I could handle at that range. I wouldn't bet on myself getting solid hits at second par times between shots.
I'm going to ask to borrow the range guys' 43 with a red dot. I've just always felt they were like lasers, you see so much jitter, unless you are comfortable with the jitter, it'd be a distraction. That said, I know a bunch of high level shooters that are transitioning to dots, there must be something to it. I know they work on rifles, maybe just need to bite the bullet and ride the learning curve.
Holster. OWB.2.7 from a 'real' holster, or low ready?
I have a somewhat similar steel setup at the range I shoot at. Smaller targets, but still fun to try. Range is closed on Weds, so I got time to set up my excuses.
3) Target focus with a dot instead of front sight focus will increase situational awareness and give you better information before squeezing the trigger.1) not if you have old eyes like mine.
2) not all defensive encounters happen within 15 yards.
I would bet most defensive encounters are less than 7 yards (in a convenience store, getting mugged or car jacked, intruder in your home). At that distance, on a man sized object, carrying a carry-size gun (<4” barrel; if you’re rockin‘ a 5” 1911 on a daily basis my hat’s off to you), in a high stress situation that most do not have adequate training or practice for, elevated heart rate, tunnel vision, auditory exclusion, and the fact that most shooters way over-estimate their abilities (oh yeah? Well I can shoot the balls of an ant at 50 yards with my 9mm gack), having to make split second decisions about how, when, and if, to engage, planning a route to cover or concealment, trying to create space between you and the attacker to give you time to draw your gun, worrying about bystanders, disengaging safeties if you have one, covering the target with the front of the gun is about the most you’ll likely get no matter how many “save the day“ 50 yard shot fantasies one might have.1) not if you have old eyes like mine.
2) not all defensive encounters happen within 15 yards.
I would bet most defensive encounters are less than 7 yards (in a convenience store, getting mugged or car jacked, intruder in your home). At that distance, on a man sized object, carrying a carry-size gun (<4” barrel; if you’re rockin‘ a 5” 1911 on a daily basis my hat’s off to you), in a high stress situation that most do not have adequate training or practice for, elevated heart rate, tunnel vision, auditory exclusion, and the fact that most shooters way over-estimate their abilities (oh yeah? Well I can shoot the balls of an ant at 50 yards with my 9mm gack), having to make split second decisions about how, when, and if, to engage, planning a route to cover or concealment, trying to create space between you and the attacker to give you time to draw your gun, worrying about bystanders, disengaging safeties if you have one, covering the target with the front of the gun is about the most you’ll likely get no matter how many “save the day“ 50 yard shot fantasies one might have.
Dots don’t just sprinkle magical unicorn jizz on your shooting. You still need to have proper and at very least decent shooting mechanics. Dots are the way to go, been pushing them for years.
As for disengagimg safeties, I was trained to lower the safety on the draw and I practiced it to where it became an automatic. If you have to think about lowering the safety then you haven’t trained enough. But I carry a Glock these days.
Amen to that. I have no problem aiming with iron sights / red dots -- trigger control was much harder for me to learn and do properly.Dots don’t just sprinkle magical unicorn jizz on your shooting. You still need to have proper and at very least decent shooting mechanics. Dots are the way to go, been pushing them for years.
This.
This stage on steel challenge is the fastest stage, no one looks at their sights. The 4 rectangle targets are about a torso size.
When you are that close, you draw and shoot. If you can't do it, you are not practicing enough.
I have shoot that stage in 2.7 seconds with a revolver and never aimed except for the stop plate.
A red dot is nice to have it, but I would train to not rely on it.
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11.48 for one run or for 5?That's FAST. My current best on that stage is 11.48 with a red dot. I'm point-shooting the first four and aiming for the stop plate.
I have done 2.7 a handful of times. I am usually at 3.3-3.5.That's FAST. My current best on that stage is 11.48 with a red dot. I'm point-shooting the first four and aiming for the stop plate.
I've seen your scores, no way it took you 11.48 seconds.That's FAST. My current best on that stage is 11.48 with a red dot. I'm point-shooting the first four and aiming for the stop plate.
There is truth here.Honestly 95% of the reason I dont have an RDS on my larger carry guns …. is I know that if I go down that road its going to cost me a shitload of money because I'd probably end up converting a lot of guns.
None of that makes red dots a bad idea.I would bet most defensive encounters are less than 7 yards (in a convenience store, getting mugged or car jacked, intruder in your home). At that distance, on a man sized object, carrying a carry-size gun (<4” barrel; if you’re rockin‘ a 5” 1911 on a daily basis my hat’s off to you), in a high stress situation that most do not have adequate training or practice for, elevated heart rate, tunnel vision, auditory exclusion, and the fact that most shooters way over-estimate their abilities (oh yeah? Well I can shoot the balls of an ant at 50 yards with my 9mm gack), having to make split second decisions about how, when, and if, to engage, planning a route to cover or concealment, trying to create space between you and the attacker to give you time to draw your gun, worrying about bystanders, disengaging safeties if you have one, covering the target with the front of the gun is about the most you’ll likely get no matter how many “save the day“ 50 yard shot fantasies one might have.
Just one more thing to snag as the gun leaves holster. I assume daily carry you’ve got a snug IWB or OWB on the strong side under some layer of clothing and are not carrying Han Solo style..Holy shit i dont often read all the comments on a 3 page thread but goddamn did this one deliver. Strong candidate for top 10 out yourself threads of 2022 so far.
View attachment 661591
The future is now. Quality RDS are superior to iron sights in Every. Single. Way.
I’ve never had any issue with it snagging. Complete non issue.Just one more thing to snag as the gun leaves holster. I assume daily carry you’ve got a snug IWB or OWB on the strong side under some layer of clothing and are not carrying Han Solo style..