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Revolver or semi for carry?
- Thread starter gasaman
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In God We Trust
NES Member
Same here most of the time if I am putting around town. If I am going anywhere questionable I carry a nine with 18 rounds
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I agonized for a long time over revolver vs semi... Revolvers are super sexy, but I read one story that really closed the issue for me.
I wish I could find the link to the story, but here's the gist of it: Small female cop is undercover or off duty or something, carrying a 5-shot snubnose. She finds herself in an alley with a large male suspect blocking the only exit. The guy starts coming towards her, pulls a knife, whatever. She pulls out her revolver - bangbangbangbangbang CLICK. 4 of the 5 shots hit him center of mass, but the guy is still coming towards her / attacking her. At the time, she couldn't tell whether she had hit the guy or not.
Nightmare scenario for sure and very unlikely to happen to the average person, but it made me think.
There is no such thing as "stopping power" in a handgun, not even in a 44magnum (a 500s&w maybe...). Handguns only do damage via their permanent wound channel - this means you MUST hit something important to cause a physical stop of an attacker. And even if you hit something important, the attack may not cease immediately if the attacker is determined or on drugs - it can take 2-4 minutes to lose consciousness after severing an artery. The zone to hit that will immediately stop an attack 100% of the time is very small, and probably difficult to hit under that kind of stress.
In the story with the police officer, the suspect passed out from blood loss pretty quickly, but I bet the officer shat her pants when her gun started going "click" and the bad guy showed no signs of even being hit.
After mentally putting myself in her shoes, I decided that I wanted to make sure I had enough rounds in the magazine to keep shooting until the threat was neutralized. I have heard that many people who actually have had to use a snub-nose to save their life immediately ditched it in favor of something with more rounds afterwards.
Every person and every situation is different. If you watch videos of shootings on youtube, sometimes people jump 5 feet in the air and fall down after being shot, and sometimes you can't even tell they got hit until you see the blood stain on their shirt 2 minutes later. I just never want to find myself out of ammo with an attacker still standing up, and if he's high on something it's not unlikely that you could fire 5 shots before the bad guy even realizes he's been shot. Also keep in mind that your accuracy is likely going to be a lot worse than it is at the range when you're shooting at paper...
I wish I could find the link to the story, but here's the gist of it: Small female cop is undercover or off duty or something, carrying a 5-shot snubnose. She finds herself in an alley with a large male suspect blocking the only exit. The guy starts coming towards her, pulls a knife, whatever. She pulls out her revolver - bangbangbangbangbang CLICK. 4 of the 5 shots hit him center of mass, but the guy is still coming towards her / attacking her. At the time, she couldn't tell whether she had hit the guy or not.
Nightmare scenario for sure and very unlikely to happen to the average person, but it made me think.
There is no such thing as "stopping power" in a handgun, not even in a 44magnum (a 500s&w maybe...). Handguns only do damage via their permanent wound channel - this means you MUST hit something important to cause a physical stop of an attacker. And even if you hit something important, the attack may not cease immediately if the attacker is determined or on drugs - it can take 2-4 minutes to lose consciousness after severing an artery. The zone to hit that will immediately stop an attack 100% of the time is very small, and probably difficult to hit under that kind of stress.
In the story with the police officer, the suspect passed out from blood loss pretty quickly, but I bet the officer shat her pants when her gun started going "click" and the bad guy showed no signs of even being hit.
After mentally putting myself in her shoes, I decided that I wanted to make sure I had enough rounds in the magazine to keep shooting until the threat was neutralized. I have heard that many people who actually have had to use a snub-nose to save their life immediately ditched it in favor of something with more rounds afterwards.
Every person and every situation is different. If you watch videos of shootings on youtube, sometimes people jump 5 feet in the air and fall down after being shot, and sometimes you can't even tell they got hit until you see the blood stain on their shirt 2 minutes later. I just never want to find myself out of ammo with an attacker still standing up, and if he's high on something it's not unlikely that you could fire 5 shots before the bad guy even realizes he's been shot. Also keep in mind that your accuracy is likely going to be a lot worse than it is at the range when you're shooting at paper...
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Not to knock your story, because I appreciate anecdotal evidence, but in this situation the revolver did the job it was required to do.
Maybe the real message of the story is to hold fire until you're sure you're able to accurately impact center mass? If she missed, she would have been in big trouble. As it is, the revolver worked well even if it was scary close to deal with the bad guy. Or maybe the message is to carry a revolver of a larger caliber? Five .44's will likely work faster than five .38's.
fencer
NES Member
In warmer months I carry a Kahr PM9 with 2 spare mags - 21 rounds total of Hornady Critical Defense.
Cold weather carry is usually a Sig 229 - .40 cal with 37 total rounds. Some times a 1911 with 25 rounds
Cold weather carry is usually a Sig 229 - .40 cal with 37 total rounds. Some times a 1911 with 25 rounds
That's what my j frame is.
Both. sig 1911 and S&W 642. 1911 IWB with 9 rounds + 10 round mag. 642 pocket carry with just the 5 shots of .38. Usually have both depending on what i'm doing that day, sometimes just one (the 1911) and sometimes the 642 gets replaced by an NAA mini revolver in .22 mag, sometimes that comes along either way. Two is one, one is none.
She did her job and the revolver did its job... But man I would not want to be in her shoes after her gun ran empty and he was still attacking her. That's not what happens in the movies!
Also consider that the average person may not be as proficient or prepared as she was - 4 out of 5 shots center of mass under life or death stress... Anybody could do it at the range, but none of us will know how we'll react in that situation until we experience it. I hope my aim is as good as hers, and I hope my shots hit something important, but it seems to make sense to put the odds in your favor as much as possible.
I took away a number of lessons from the story:
1) Use your brain and don't get yourself into a spot with no escape route in the first place (she may have been forced into it somehow due to being a cop)
2) You had better practice religiously AND have nerves of steel if you're going to carry a gun with such tiny capacity
3) You had better practice religiously and have nerves of steel anyways
Larger caliber = larger holes = better chance of hitting something useful. Seems reasonable to me, but only if you can shoot it well.
I guess the big thing is that the story just changed my mindset... Just because you shot somebody doesn't mean they are going to immediately keel over. If they really want to kill you, it's likely that they've got a good 2 or 3 minutes left to do so unless you hit something critical. More bullets = more chances to hit something critical. Seems straightforward to me.
Just imo. I almost hate to talk about it on here because I'm sure it's been done to death a billion times, but reading that story really opened up my eyes a bit and completely changed the way I view handguns.
Semi for me, 10+1.
I use to carry an extra mag, but don't any more.
I use to carry an extra mag, but don't any more.
Usually one of these two:
1911 with 2 extra mags, total of 24 rounds of .45 ACP.
Or Kahr PM9 in my pocket, with a total of 14 rounds of 9mm.
Rarely:
Or a S&W Model 66 with two extra speedloaders for a total of 18 rounds of .357.
Just got two new holsters for this, so I've carried it a couple times.
Glock 23 with two extra mags, 31 rounds of .40 S&W
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I shot a .44 magnum snubby but I prefer the semi it gave me.
I recommend carrying a gun that holds as much ammunition as possible, minimizing the need to reload. While carrying an extra magazine is very important, it should be looked at as a cure for a malfunctioning magazine, not for reloading. The reason I say this is because it will be far easier to pull the trigger repeatedly during one of the scariest moments of your life than it will to realize your gun is empty, you are still being attacked and manipulate your gun to reload.
If it could be concealed I recommend a Glock with a 33 round magazine in the mag well.
I recommend carrying a gun that holds as much ammunition as possible, minimizing the need to reload. While carrying an extra magazine is very important, it should be looked at as a cure for a malfunctioning magazine, not for reloading. The reason I say this is because it will be far easier to pull the trigger repeatedly during one of the scariest moments of your life than it will to realize your gun is empty, you are still being attacked and manipulate your gun to reload.
If it could be concealed I recommend a Glock with a 33 round magazine in the mag well.
Independence Arms
Instructor
Glock 19, pretty much year round. 15+1, and a spare 15 on the belt.
If not that, a 642 in the pocket.
If not that, a 642 in the pocket.
D
Deleted member 22390
glock 27 with a glock 23 mag, with winchester elite hollow points, spare glock 27 mag in the truck. And a can of sabre red from time to time.
S&W M&P .40 and 2 10 rnd mags on my person, plus 2 10 rnd mags and a box of 50 rnds in my pack that goes where ever I go.
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