Rifle transfer has to go FFL to FFL ??

[JRT]

I sold a couple of rifles in to guy in Massachusetts and his FFL would not let me ship direct, he insisted his software could only process an FFL to FFL transfer. It wasn't worth the extra effort to me, I just sold it to somebody else.

 

[calsdad]

I’m not saying you’re wrong. But the ones I’m talking about their “display purposes only” constitutes a federal gun crime.

I have a registered Uzi bolt so in my situation it doesn’t really matter...But you don’t have to look deep into the dark web to find things that just are a bad idea for most people

I used to have a better understanding of the arcane gun laws - which part of the Federal laws say it's a crime to stick a thing that *looks like* a barrel on the end of your rifle - even though it's shorter than 16" ? As long as the barrel makes the rifle non-functional - does that still break the law?

My understanding of those Uzi short barrels - is that they're not a real barrel. They might not even be drilled all the way thru. That's why I said "for display only"

 

[MGnoob]

I used to have a better understanding of the arcane gun laws - which part of the Federal laws say it's a crime to stick a thing that *looks like* a barrel on the end of your rifle - even though it's shorter than 16" ? As long as the barrel makes the rifle non-functional - does that still break the law?

My understanding of those Uzi short barrels - is that they're not a real barrel. They might not even be drilled all the way thru. That's why I said "for display only"

I used to have a better understanding as well…now they can “re-interpret anything” None of it really means anything. When I was getting at is if you’re not careful there’s a lot of things floating around out there that even though it says for the “display purposes” You end up with something on your front steps that’s illegal. Thankfully most of this stuff is going through an FFL. It it is illegal and showed up at your ffl at least it’s not your problem.

 

[CATI]

Semi related. In what case would be purchasing a MA Uzi be cheaper over a local one outside of MA

 

[bullseye]

Semi related. In what case would be purchasing a MA Uzi be cheaper over a local one outside of MA

Folks in NC do weird stuff!!

There are some FFL's down here that do not allow incoming from a private individual. Most, damn near all, do. Usually, if you get one of these Fudds, its probably near a city.Its usually 25-30 for a shipment using USPS. I've sent firearms to many an FFL for buyers in other states!!

You can ship a firearm to a person in another state only if you ship it to an FFL holder in the destination state. That is, if you wish to transfer a firearm to a nonlicensee who resides in another state, you must ship the gun to an FFL holder in your recipient’s state. The FFL holder will release the firearm to the person once they’ve completed the ATF Form 4473 and NICS background check. Even if you are shipping a gun for repair, if your gunsmith is out-of-state, they must either hold an FFL themselves or receive your gun through someone who does.

How to Mail Guns (Legally and Without Going to Jail)

If you've ever wondered about mailing firearms across state lines, we've got you covered. Each state has different rules and regulations you need to know.

www.pewpewtactical.com

 

[AHM]

My understanding of those Uzi short barrels - is that they're not a real barrel. They might not even be drilled all the way thru. That's why I said "for display only"

What you need to be wary of is some assclown who includes a real illegal short barrel
with some legally meaningless disclaimer scrawled on the bill of sale.

Just like the assclown gun shops selling "solvent traps"
and assclown gun show vendors selling "preban" (i.e. not preban) large magazines
to the unwary.

 

[mousegunfan]

At some point stop banging your head into the wall, offer to split the extra $40 for an FFL and ship the thing.

 

[calsdad]

What you need to be wary of is some assclown who includes a real illegal short barrel
with some legally meaningless disclaimer scrawled on the bill of sale.

Just like the assclown gun shops selling "solvent traps"
and assclown gun show vendors selling "preban" (i.e. not preban) large magazines
to the unwary.

True. I haven't seen the solvent trap thing , but there's a bunch of stuff floating around out there for 80% oil filters or something like that. I was watching a guy who mods diesel trucks on Youtube back a year or two ago, and he actually got a visit from the ATF and the local law enforcement because he bought a bunch of oil filters online. He said it was really effed up.

I got involved in the mag issue a number of years back - when I bought a number of 10 round Glock mags. The selling them specifically advertised 10 round mags - where everybody else was advertising 15 rounders. So I ordered like 10 of them. A week or so later I get the box - and there's ten 15 round mags in the box. I was like WTF dude. I called the guy - and he offered up some excuse about how "I figured you would want the 15's instead". Then I had to tell him that the mags were ILLEGAL in MA - and he had just sent me 10 felony counts in a box. He still didn't believe me - and gave me some BS story about he went to gun shows in MA - and a MA state trooper had told him 15 rounders were legal.

I had to dig up the damn law and send it to him to show him he was wrong - and to get him to swap the mags out. All in all it was a total PITA.

 

[calsdad]

At some point stop banging your head into the wall, offer to split the extra $40 for an FFL and ship the thing.

It's getting shipped tomorrow - the buyer found an FFL that will accept a direct shipment - I talked to them - made sure they were cool with it and it's all settled.

I think this was a case of an FFL (two FFLs actually) portraying their policy - as the law. The buyer didn't believe me at first - until he went on an FFL hunt to find a better FFL.

 

[Frizzle Fry]

Semi related. In what case would be purchasing a MA Uzi be cheaper over a local one outside of MA

Uzi prices have gone nucking futs since about a year and a half ago. All Action Arms chicom or Israeli A and B uzis are preban. If you want the real thing it is gonna be MA compliant. Or a Nuzi.

Same way old Colts are about the same price to collectors in free states, except at least you can still get a new Colt that isnt preban...

 

[calsdad]

Uzi prices have gone nucking futs since about a year and a half ago. All Action Arms chicom or Israeli A and B uzis are preban. If you want the real thing it is gonna be MA compliant. Or a Nuzi.

Same way old Colts are about the same price to collectors in free states, except at least you can still get a new Colt that isnt preban...

That's part of the reason why I'm selling mine. I've never had a chance to shoot the thing - and the prices are cray cray. I have other things I want to spend the money on - and in the end , as I said before: I can't carry all the things on my back over the mountains to freedom when SHTF time hits out here in commie land.

 

[drgrant]

What you need to be wary of is some assclown who includes a real illegal short barrel
with some legally meaningless disclaimer scrawled on the bill of sale.

Just like the assclown gun shops selling "solvent traps"
and assclown gun show vendors selling "preban" (i.e. not preban) large magazines
to the unwary.

Constructive posession is vastly overblown. It's something to be aware of, sure, but i wouldn't be into pant shitting hysteria unless the seller was stupid enough to attach it to the gun.

 

[jpm]

The screwed up thing is that I already talked to the FFL that the buyer wanted to use - and the 1st guy I talked to told me that I needed to provide them with my license info in order to make the transfer. I said "no problem, I have a MA Class A firearms license - I can provide both that and my driver's license info to you when I ship the firearm". The guy at the FFL said " send me an email with your basic info - and I'll get a copy of the FFL out to you so you can ship it".

When he said he needed your license info, he wasn't talking about a state license, he was talking about a FFL. That's what the law is referring to regarding "licensed" or "unlicensed" individuals and what an out of state dealer means - a Federal Firearms License. They don't GAF about a state issued license, its meaningless to them and the feds.

 

[ColdDayInHell]

I'll just take the K2 off your hands. Thanks.

 

[AHM]

Constructive posession is vastly overblown. It's something to be aware of, sure, but i wouldn't be into pant shitting hysteria unless the seller was stupid enough to attach it to the gun.

Onesey-twosey I can believe it'd fly under the radar.

I'm just saying that I took a different gloss from the disclaimer than @calsdad did.
(But quite possibly the same gloss that @MGnoob did).

I'd never have wigged to it if "for display purposes" wasn't so bogus.

It's not legit;
unlike the "for flight purposes" fins that
you had to slide on to an Estes Saturn V to make it stable.

@Len-2A Training probably feels a disturbance in the force.
He's hated those felony mag gun show idiots with a (well-deserved)
vengeance when they were a current thing.
It's not even that Marsha was watching the doors.
It's that the buyers thought it was all legal,
which increased the risk they'd screw themselves unwittingly.

(Full disclosure: I'm sommat hazy on the precise laws, too.
Then again, I'm not in the market).

 

[drgrant]

Onesey-twosey I can believe it'd fly under the radar.

I'm just saying that I took a different gloss from the disclaimer than @calsdad did.
(But quite possibly the same gloss that @MGnoob did).

I'd never have wigged to it if "for display purposes" wasn't so bogus.

It's not legit;
unlike the "for flight purposes" fins that
you had to slide on to an Estes Saturn V to make it stable.

@Len-2A Training probably feels a disturbance in the force.
He's hated those felony mag gun show idiots with a (well-deserved)
vengeance when they were a current thing.
It's not even that Marsha was watching the doors.
It's that the buyers thought it was all legal,
which increased the risk they'd screw themselves unwittingly.

(Full disclosure: I'm sommat hazy on the precise laws, too.
Then again, I'm not in the market).

Lol most of those gun show guys made no "preban" claims, they just sold mags. Caveat emptor.

 

[Len-2A Training]

Lol most of those gun show guys made no "preban" claims, they just sold mags. Caveat emptor.

Some definitely did mark the cartons "preban" with prices to match.

 

[drgrant]

Some definitely did mark the cartons "preban" with prices to match.

I'm sure some did, Len, but back when I used to work the shows, the 2 or 3 most prolific guys, didn't. There was also a kid who used to sell cerakoted, date stamped prebans, too.

 

[calsdad]

Geezus - the saga continues.

So the buyer found an FFL that would accept a UPS shipment from an individual. I called the place and confirmed that. It's been a few years - so I was hazy on what I had to do the last time I shipped a rifle - but going to the UPS Service Center refreshed my memory: UPS wants a copy of the FFL license for their paperwork - to cover their own ass in case something goes screwy.

So ....... I'm back to needing a copy of the FFL license - which this latest dealer says they won't give out. The buyer went to the store today and confirmed that.

But that triggered some memories, because the last time I sold stuff and shipped it out of state - I had no problems with this (it was years ago now). The buyer would get and then send me a copy of the FFL so I could provide it to UPS - and I also remembered having stuff shipped to me from out of state ( I got it shipped to Four Seasons) - and FS had no problems giving me a copy of their FFL - so I could provide it to the seller.

WTF - these guys just seem like they're being difficult. And the buyer and the FFL apparently want me to ship the rifle and NOT tell UPS what is in the box. Which I adamantly refuse to do - both for the insurance reasons - and because I suspect there's possibly some level of federal involvement if I outright lie about the contents of a package that contains a firearm.

The guy at UPS was fine - no problems at all with shipping it - he just needed the FFL info.

 

[one-eyed Jack]

Geezus - the saga continues.

So the buyer found an FFL that would accept a UPS shipment from an individual. I called the place and confirmed that. It's been a few years - so I was hazy on what I had to do the last time I shipped a rifle - but going to the UPS Service Center refreshed my memory: UPS wants a copy of the FFL license for their paperwork - to cover their own ass in case something goes screwy.

So ....... I'm back to needing a copy of the FFL license - which this latest dealer says they won't give out. The buyer went to the store today and confirmed that.

But that triggered some memories, because the last time I sold stuff and shipped it out of state - I had no problems with this (it was years ago now). The buyer would get and then send me a copy of the FFL so I could provide it to UPS - and I also remembered having stuff shipped to me from out of state ( I got it shipped to Four Seasons) - and FS had no problems giving me a copy of their FFL - so I could provide it to the seller.

WTF - these guys just seem like they're being difficult. And the buyer and the FFL apparently want me to ship the rifle and NOT tell UPS what is in the box. Which I adamantly refuse to do - both for the insurance reasons - and because I suspect there's possibly some level of federal involvement if I outright lie about the contents of a package that contains a firearm.

The guy at UPS was fine - no problems at all with shipping it - he just needed the FFL info.

Did the UPS guy put the FFL in the box or did he pocket it so that he could go "shopping"? I only mail FFL copies to other licensees after doing the EZ check. Jack.

 

[calsdad]

Did the UPS guy put the FFL in the box or did he pocket it so that he could go "shopping"? I only mail FFL copies to other licensees after doing the EZ check. Jack.

Maybe I'm dense - but what good does having a photocopied copy of a dealers FFL license do you? In the past I've had people send them directly to me - so I could ship out stuff I sold. UPS apparently requires a copy to keep in their records - at least that's what the guy at the Service Center told me. Note - this wasn't a UPS store - it was a UPS service counter at the UPS facility. I don't believe a UPS Store will accept a firearm. I can see why UPS would want it - they want to make sure they're actually shipping to a dealer.

Maybe I should try shipping thru USPS - I know they will ship firearms.

Anyway - just to make this torture end I'm going to see if I can find a dealer open in The Mill tomorrow and just have them do it. The buyer can eat the extra cost if there is any.

 

[drgrant]

Maybe I'm dense - but what good does having a photocopied copy of a dealers FFL license do you? In the past I've had people send them directly to me - so I could ship out stuff I sold. UPS apparently requires a copy to keep in their records - at least that's what the guy at the Service Center told me. Note - this wasn't a UPS store - it was a UPS service counter at the UPS facility. I don't believe a UPS Store will accept a firearm. I can see why UPS would want it - they want to make sure they're actually shipping to a dealer.

Maybe I should try shipping thru USPS - I know they will ship firearms.

Anyway - just to make this torture end I'm going to see if I can find a dealer open in The Mill tomorrow and just have them do it. The buyer can eat the extra cost if there is any.

When you're friendly with a dealer you'll never ship guns as a pleb ever again. Its way easier to pay a tiny bit extra and let someone else deal with the shipping bullshit. Especially people who ship guns 3, 4, 5 times a week.

 

[calsdad]

When you're friendly with a dealer you'll never ship guns as a pleb ever again. Its way easier to pay a tiny bit extra and let someone else deal with the shipping bullshit. Especially people who ship guns 3, 4, 5 times a week.

Never really had a problem before now. Sold stuff on Gunbroker or had people from out of state contact me about stuff I had listed on NES. Buyer would send me the info for the dealer they wanted the rifle sent to (I've never sold a pistol out of state) - and would forward me a copy of their FFL. Go to UPS - tell them what's in the package - present the FFL - and everything was easy peasy. The only hiccup I ran into was when the UPS Service Center had some woman on the counter that didn't even know they shipped firearms. I gave her the web link that said they did - she called somebody higher up and that problem was solved.

If I was shipping a gun once a week - I think I probably would have just gotten the FFL by now and rented space over in Littleton myself.