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Road Rage Shooting in WA- Female rider kills driver

SERE said:
According to her post in https://www.facebook.com/groups/pnwriders/
I am advised to not speak of any details about the case that is not already public knowledge. What I will address is the statement of "both vehicles pulled over" this is 100% false information provided by the news and State Patrol. When the police and news arrived on scene, about 15-20 minutes later the our were already pulled on the shoulder by 2 witnesses to prevent blocking traffic in the HOV lane. At the time of the incident I along with the other vehicle were in the HOV lane stopped when the man got out of his vehicle and approached me. I want to make it 100% clear that I in no way antagonized this man to get out of his vehicle. I was in front of him for a few miles before his initial rage started (because I was leaving a cushion between me and the car in front of me and he did not like that).
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*******
Happens to me every day on RT.2, ma**h***s get enraged because I leave at least 2 car lengths between me and the vehicle in front of me. Ma**h***s tailgate then pass me on the right and cut into my safety zone. I bought a Rav4 in November and 10 days later at 6:45 am traffic locked up in front of me, I slammed on my brakes and stopped 6" from the truck in front of me and then WHAM!. 6 car pileup, one ma**h*** after another slamming into each other. Pileup even made the news, had the new(2014) vehicle for ten days. If I was riding my Beemer I'd be dead.
 
rwl1955 said:
*******
Happens to me every day on RT.2, ma**h***s get enraged because I leave at least 2 car lengths between me and the vehicle in front of me. Ma**h***s tailgate then pass me on the right and cut into my safety zone. I bought a Rav4 in November and 10 days later at 6:45 am traffic locked up in front of me, I slammed on my brakes and stopped 6" from the truck in front of me and then WHAM!. 6 car pileup, one ma**h*** after another slamming into each other. Pileup even made the news, had the new(2014) vehicle for ten days. If I was riding my Beemer I'd be dead.
Click to expand...

Having dodged this a few times I've noticed theres this like "repeating braking syndrome" kind of effect. Now whenever I see f***y conditions like that I try to pick the slowest lane possible and just stay in that- because if things go to hell in a handbasket my odds of being able to ditch or slow down etc are much better in the slower line of cars.... and usually when the road is that constipated- the passing lane ain't moving that much faster anyways.

Of course its hard to pick up on "how bad" the conditions are, sometimes. A lot of times you'll get warned because you can see the ripple effect coming, etc.

-Mike
 
rwl1955 said:
*******
Happens to me every day on RT.2, ma**h***s get enraged because I leave at least 2 car lengths between me and the vehicle in front of me. Ma**h***s tailgate then pass me on the right and cut into my safety zone. I bought a Rav4 in November and 10 days later at 6:45 am traffic locked up in front of me, I slammed on my brakes and stopped 6" from the truck in front of me and then WHAM!. 6 car pileup, one ma**h*** after another slamming into each other. Pileup even made the news, had the new(2014) vehicle for ten days. If I was riding my Beemer I'd be dead.
Click to expand...


People don't appreciate that bikes usually have worse stopping distances than most cars. Combined with the total lack of crash safety devices, a large following distance is prudent.
 
Matt-CZ said:
People don't appreciate that bikes usually have worse stopping distances than most cars. Combined with the total lack of crash safety devices, a large following distance is prudent.
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That's BS. It was when a NYS trooper said it to me years ago and it is now. Sport bikes can pull >1G when braking. Not many street cars under a 1/4 million dollars can do that. That said, plenty of bikes are worse than cars, plenty of cars are worse than bikes. But pound for pound, bikes are no worse or better than cars all things being equal. Every time someone engages in this fools errand to "prove" their point of view, they compare cruisers to BMW M6s or an R6 to a Camry. But there is NOTHING about two wheels that by itself makes it less likely to be able to stop. And don't get me started on the "contact patches". If the "contact patch" of a motorcycle tire was not large enough, people would be loosing traction at the front when they used the brakes. That has only happened once to me, in the rain when I hit a line marker. I have multiple times lifted the rear under heavy braking, making clear I had plenty of "contact patch".
 
terraformer said:
That's BS. It was when a NYS trooper said it to me years ago and it is now. Sport bikes can pull >1G when braking. Not many street cars under a 1/4 million dollars can do that. That said, plenty of bikes are worse than cars, plenty of cars are worse than bikes. But pound for pound, bikes are no worse or better than cars all things being equal. Every time someone engages in this fools errand to "prove" their point of view, they compare cruisers to BMW M6s or an R6 to a Camry. But there is NOTHING about two wheels that by itself makes it less likely to be able to stop. And don't get me started on the "contact patches". If the "contact patch" of a motorcycle tire was not large enough, people would be loosing traction at the front when they used the brakes. That has only happened once to me, in the rain when I hit a line marker. I have multiple times lifted the rear under heavy braking, making clear I had plenty of "contact patch".
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Where'd you get this half baked crap?

My bikes will out-brake my car from 180-100, because bikes have no weight, horrible aero, and i'm an animal and will sit straight up while grabbing all the front brake it will take at 160+mph.

The aero does the braking, assuming the rider is willing to take the full wind blast while holding that front tire on the threshold at extreme speed.

Below 100mph any decent car will easily out-brake ANY modern sport bike, here are some 60-0s. Keep in mind these are shitbox minivans vs the best superbikes...a cruiser or some other turd of a bike is going to take MUCH longer. A Vette will do it in under 100ft, a Harley usually over 150ft.

Minivans:

  • 2015 Kia Sedona: 118 ft
  • 2015 Toyota Sienna: 121 ft
  • 2014 Chrysler T&C: 126 ft
  • 2015 Honda Odyssey: 126 ft
Superbikes:

  • 2011 BMW S1000RR: 129 ft
  • 2011 Ducati 1198: 141 ft
  • 2011 Honda CBR1000RR: 134 ft
  • 2011 Suzuki GSXR-1000: 140 ft
  • 2011 KTM RC8R: 135 ft
  • 2011 Kawasaki ZX10R: 129 ft
  • 2011 Yamaha R1: 137 ft
 
Hoon said:
Where'd you get this half baked crap?

My bikes will out-brake my car from 180-100, because bikes have no weight, horrible aero, and i'm an animal and will sit straight up while grabbing all the front brake it will take at 160+mph.

The aero does the braking, assuming the rider is willing to take the full wind blast while holding that front tire on the threshold at extreme speed.

Below 100mph any decent car will easily out-brake ANY modern sport bike, here are some 60-0s. Keep in mind these are shitbox minivans vs the best superbikes...a cruiser or some other turd of a bike is going to take MUCH longer. A Vette will do it in under 100ft, a Harley usually over 150ft.

Minivans:

  • 2015 Kia Sedona: 118 ft
  • 2015 Toyota Sienna: 121 ft
  • 2014 Chrysler T&C: 126 ft
  • 2015 Honda Odyssey: 126 ft
Superbikes:

  • 2011 BMW S1000RR: 129 ft
  • 2011 Ducati 1198: 141 ft
  • 2011 Honda CBR1000RR: 134 ft
  • 2011 Suzuki GSXR-1000: 140 ft
  • 2011 KTM RC8R: 135 ft
  • 2011 Kawasaki ZX10R: 129 ft
  • 2011 Yamaha R1: 137 ft
Click to expand...

I would not be inclined to ride a motorcycle on Rt 2 at 180 MPH in rush hour traffic.

Your mileage may vary.
 
Drunder40 said:
We don't even know all the facts yet.. If she provoked the incident she could be charged (Atleast that's the law in my state-Not sure about WA).
...
Click to expand...
If keeping space between her and the vehicle in front of her was the "provocation", it was a good kill. Also, if he physically attacked her first....good kill.
 
rwl1955 said:
*******
Happens to me every day on RT.2, ma**h***s get enraged because I leave at least 2 car lengths between me and the vehicle in front of me. Ma**h***s tailgate then pass me on the right and cut into my safety zone. I bought a Rav4 in November and 10 days later at 6:45 am traffic locked up in front of me, I slammed on my brakes and stopped 6" from the truck in front of me and then WHAM!. 6 car pileup, one ma**h*** after another slamming into each other. Pileup even made the news, had the new(2014) vehicle for ten days. If I was riding my Beemer I'd be dead.
Click to expand...


And let me guess why it locked up.. someone was changing a flat tire way off the side in the breakdown lane and some simpleton came up on it 1/4 mile away and slammed on their brakes because it was too scary or too confusing.. or simpleton comes over a hill on the interstate and in the distance they see the blue flashing lights of a cop who has someone pulled WAY over on the far side of the road and again slams their brakes
on because well "Blue lights"..

Those are the ones that piss me off to no end. Absolutely no reason to slam on the brakes but they do.. If driving scares them that much then f'ing walk or take public trans.. They will eventually kill or injure someone..
 
Sometimes cage drivers get enraged at bikes simply due to the fact the the bikes can slip ahead of them more easily. For all we know, maybe the rider slithered up and innocuously switched lanes in front of him.

I've never understood the mania here in MA with drivers who lose it when someones somehow gets ahead of them in traffic. As much as I, too, find it annoying when someone creates a quarter-mile buffer and idles along in the left lane, in stop and go logjams it actually makes some sense. Dead guy obviously needed to blast his three car lengths at full tilt before having to slam his brakes on again, and when deprived of this, lost it.
 
Friday said:
Sometimes cage drivers get enraged at bikes simply due to the fact the the bikes can slip ahead of them more easily. For all we know, maybe the rider slithered up and innocuously switched lanes in front of him.

I've never understood the mania here in MA with drivers who lose it when someones somehow gets ahead of them in traffic. As much as I, too, find it annoying when someone creates a quarter-mile buffer and idles along in the left lane, in stop and go logjams it actually makes some sense. Dead guy obviously needed to blast his three car lengths at full tilt before having to slam his brakes on again, and when deprived of this, lost it.
Click to expand...

Road rage is a weird thing. Road ragers are a bit like keyboard warriors. They might be perfectly mild-mannered in face to face situations, but a tiny bit of social buffer and the aggression comes flowing out.
 
Friday said:
Sometimes cage drivers get enraged at bikes simply due to the fact the the bikes can slip ahead of them more easily. For all we know, maybe the rider slithered up and innocuously switched lanes in front of him.

I've never understood the mania here in MA with drivers who lose it when someones somehow gets ahead of them in traffic. As much as I, too, find it annoying when someone creates a quarter-mile buffer and idles along in the left lane, in stop and go logjams it actually makes some sense. Dead guy obviously needed to blast his three car lengths at full tilt before having to slam his brakes on again, and when deprived of this, lost it.
Click to expand...

It's one thing to be "that left lane laggard" when there is clear road ahead of you.

But if all lanes ahead of and behind you are all bumper to bumper (basically every rush hour near a city like Boston) then you're definitely not being "that guy".
 
Hoon said:
Where'd you get this half baked crap?

My bikes will out-brake my car from 180-100, because bikes have no weight, horrible aero, and i'm an animal and will sit straight up while grabbing all the front brake it will take at 160+mph.

The aero does the braking, assuming the rider is willing to take the full wind blast while holding that front tire on the threshold at extreme speed.

Below 100mph any decent car will easily out-brake ANY modern sport bike, here are some 60-0s. Keep in mind these are shitbox minivans vs the best superbikes...a cruiser or some other turd of a bike is going to take MUCH longer. A Vette will do it in under 100ft, a Harley usually over 150ft.

Minivans:

  • 2015 Kia Sedona: 118 ft
  • 2015 Toyota Sienna: 121 ft
  • 2014 Chrysler T&C: 126 ft
  • 2015 Honda Odyssey: 126 ft
Superbikes:

  • 2011 BMW S1000RR: 129 ft
  • 2011 Ducati 1198: 141 ft
  • 2011 Honda CBR1000RR: 134 ft
  • 2011 Suzuki GSXR-1000: 140 ft
  • 2011 KTM RC8R: 135 ft
  • 2011 Kawasaki ZX10R: 129 ft
  • 2011 Yamaha R1: 137 ft
Click to expand...

So you picked all heavier liter bikes. Now grab 60-0 for the 600 cc bikes from 2017. They are at roughly 100 ft. Again, depending on the choices one makes, the story changes. And even in your data set, the bike distances are pretty close to the cars and you got data from 2011 bikes, prior to ABS being common on those bikes (not saying they had it or didn't, don't know from what you quoted). But I do know that ABS was standard on the cars by 2011. Actually, 2004 was the year it was required.
 
I wonder if she exercised conventional wisdom and remained silent at the scene or if she just said the right things.
 
Rob Boudrie said:
I wonder if she exercised conventional wisdom and remained silent at the scene or if she just said the right things.
Click to expand...

Reportedly she dialed 911 but was uneven to speak to the police due to shock. Someone else used her phone to speak to the dispatcher. It was also reported that she sat slumped in the same spot in the HOV lane, with her helmet on, throughout initial response from passerby and first responders. Then, the helmet was not taken off due to possible neck injuries from having her head bashed into the pavement. Classic shock.
 
Friday said:
I'm sad someone died over traffic, but happy that reason prevailed in assessing what happened.
Click to expand...

I'm not- that shitbird that beat her up probably would have done the same to someone else... someone else who may have not have been of the mind to be more
prepared. Anyone that unhinged deserves that kind of punishment. The only "unfortunate" thing here is that the victim had to go through the trauma of being beat up and having to address his glaring lead deficiency.

I'm not white knighting or any of that shit either, I would say the same thing if it was a dude under the same circumstance... although I bet it would take twice as long to acquit him under the same circumstance. That's not her fault that's just f***ery in our society/mindset/etc...

Also if more of these shitbirds got plugged I think it might have a chilling effect- I mean those of us that carry already have it- we don't do shit like that- because we're aware of the very real possibility someone else might be packing, and at best going full retard might result in mutually assured destruction. I realize people get pissed, etc... but most normal people don't cross the line into an unprovoked act of personal violence on someone else just "because of driving".

-Mike
 
terraformer said:
So you picked all heavier liter bikes. Now grab 60-0 for the 600 cc bikes from 2017. They are at roughly 100 ft. Again, depending on the choices one makes, the story changes. And even in your data set, the bike distances are pretty close to the cars and you got data from 2011 bikes, prior to ABS being common on those bikes (not saying they had it or didn't, don't know from what you quoted). But I do know that ABS was standard on the cars by 2011. Actually, 2004 was the year it was required.
Click to expand...
*****
My 2016 BMW has Brembo brakes and ABS and can stop on a dime. That's my problem with ma**h***s riding my ass. The accident happened just before RT.70 in Lunenberg on ramp which is a choke point every day mainly because dump trucks enter RT.2 there and slow the right lane down trying to merge.
Great news the rider won't be charged but I can attest to the fact that some drivers lose their minds when they see a motorcycle passing them or in front of them. The greatest threat to my daily life is on RT.2 in the morning between RT.13 and 495 heading East and it gets worse every month. I had traded in a 2012 Elantra for the RAV4 10 days before getting hit and if I was in the Elantra the Jeep Patriot that hit me would have crushed my trunk and slammed me into the truck in front of me most likely totaling my Hyundai.
 
I'm glad for her. Not happy she has to live with having killed someone. But better this way than the other.

If she didn't do what she did and he got away with it who would he have bashed next? Someone's grandmother for driving too slow?

This guy won't cause anymore road incidents.
 
Last edited:
Holy cow. Listening to her tell the story, it is easy in hindsight to say... " well, if she hadn't done ..." the whole thing could have been avoided". But the truth of the matter is that if they guy had not exited his vehicle and confronted her, nothing would have happened.
The long and the short if it, is that when she head butted the guy with her helmet on, which she felt was her only option as he had a firm hold on her, it hurt him pretty bad and he became enraged. This is human nature and very hard to overcome. When someone smashes you in the face, whether you deserve it or not, you respond with anger and often, a blinding rage. That is when he grabbed her by the helmet and proceeded to smash her head off the jersey barrier and jerk her around like a rag doll.

My biggest take aways from this is, first, never trust the media. They make shit up to sell the story. The kid was never in the military. But that made for a better story. They are friggin vultures who feast on human suffering. They actively ruin peoples lives to further their careers, usually with no consequences.

The psychological and financial effects on her were devastating, even though she was never charged.

But most importantly, calm the f*** down. Take a deep breath, count to five, just change lanes, exit the highway and grab a coffee..whatever. But under no circumstances should you exit your vehicle to confront another driver, no matter how much they pissed you off. I can't help but wonder if the guy thought that when he heard the pop, in the couple of seconds before he died after the bullet tore through his heart.
 

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