Savage 303 help

[peterk123]

Men, I need your expert advise. My buddy is going to reload his savage 303. He has a 150 grain jacketed bullets and could only purchase IMR 4166 powder. The data you folks were kind enough to share with me only provided info for a 190 grain bullet for that powder. It was 33 grains. So here is the question. Is he most likely safe starting with 33 grains? I believe lighter bullets usually require more powder than the heavier, all other things being equal.

We are going to have some fun this weekend. I finally can put my chrono to legit use



Thanks Pete

 

[TrashcanDan]

Let him shoot the first 5 or so, but pull the old " hey, i have to go over here real quick, but you go ahead and blast a few off" before he starts.

So i'm no rifle guy, but let me ask this-

If the grain weights are different, would using the same charge for a 190 increase deadspace in the cartridge? And by how much?

Is it close enough to .303 british in design that you could go with that load data? Or is it a different bullet diameter?

I could probably google it, but I don't want the feds to see reloading data searches AND porn on the same computer. Besides, thats what smartphones are for.

 

[peterk123]

Let him shoot the first 5 or so, but pull the old " hey, i have to go over here real quick, but you go ahead and blast a few off" before he starts.

So i'm no rifle guy, but let me ask this-

If the grain weights are different, would using the same charge for a 190 increase deadspace in the cartridge? And by how much?

Is it close enough to .303 british in design that you could go with that load data? Or is it a different bullet diameter?

I could probably google it, but I don't want the feds to see reloading data searches AND porn on the same computer. Besides, thats what smartphones are for.

We would be using 150 grain. So there would be more volume available in the shell, leading me to believe that at 33 grains the pressure would be lower. So, I am hoping pressure is a non issue. I can't imagine that the bullet would not get pushed through the barrel. But there are a lot of folks on here with a lot more experience at this than me.

 

[mac1911]

We would be using 150 grain. So there would be more volume available in the shell, leading me to believe that at 33 grains the pressure would be lower. So, I am hoping pressure is a non issue. I can't imagine that the bullet would not get pushed through the barrel. But there are a lot of folks on here with a lot more experience at this than me.

can you give me case length, bullet length and COAL?
the pressure may not be a issue but that powder might not get a good complete burn.
Find a better powder suited to your needs maybe?
iIRC 4166 is close to varget?

 

[Mountain]

303 Savage has nothing to do with 303 British- absolutely do not mix up the two. 303 Savage is closer to 30-30 and uses a .308 bullet, NOT a .311.

Oldest reloading manual I have is a 1970 Lyman. Doesn't have 303 Savage, just 300 Savage. (edit- not designed to be black powder) The 303 was originally developed to be a black powder cartridge. Your bud could try the volume method for Trail Boss. Oh, found something .303 Savage | Handloader Magazine:

I guess same as you already had seen for the 190 grain bullets? Here's another:

 

[38ExtraSpecial]

@1919FAN
Probably has some old manuals with some info. Maybe a dozen or so.

 

[Deleted member 67409]

I agree that .303 British and .303 Savage are unrelated. However, .303 Savage was not originally intended as a black powder round. The .303 British was.

.303 Savage - Wikipedia

 

[Mountain]

I agree that .303 British and .303 Savage are unrelated. However, .303 Savage was not originally intended as a black powder round. The .303 British was.

.303 Savage - Wikipedia

Whoops, you are correct. No harm in using Trail Boss, however.

 

[EddieCoyle]

Is he most likely safe starting with 33 grains?

Yes.

The guy asks for the time and you all tell him how to build a watch.

 

[peterk123]

Thank you guys.

 

[EddieCoyle]

Whoops, you are correct. No harm in using Trail Boss, however.

Have you had a lot of luck using Trail Boss with jacketed rifle bullets?

 

[Mountain]

Have you had a lot of luck using Trail Boss with jacketed rifle bullets?

Just for wimpy plinking loads. Makes more sense to use it for cast plinking loads but as far as I know there are no limitations to it for jacketed. If I were in a free state it might be fun to cook up some loads to run through a can.

 

[mac1911]

Have you had a lot of luck using Trail Boss with jacketed rifle bullets?

I used up a good amount of M2 ball pulls using trailboss and hand cycling them through my garand. If they where 1300fps that was top end. Fun milk jug loads

 

[TrashcanDan]

Yes.

The guy asks for the time and you all tell him how to build a watch.

Clock

 

[mac1911]

303 Savage has nothing to do with 303 British- absolutely do not mix up the two. 303 Savage is closer to 30-30 and uses a .308 bullet, NOT a .311.

Oldest reloading manual I have is a 1970 Lyman. Doesn't have 303 Savage, just 300 Savage. (edit- not designed to be black powder) The 303 was originally developed to be a black powder cartridge. Your bud could try the volume method for Trail Boss. Oh, found something .303 Savage | Handloader Magazine:

I guess same as you already had seen for the 190 grain bullets? Here's another:

yet some load manuals will not agree
take hodgdon on line data. List .311 bullet?

 

[Mountain]

yet some load manuals will not agree
take hodgdon on line data. List .311 bullet?

I did read that the earliest 303 Savages might have had a .311? Not an error I'd like to make. No problema going smaller but .311 in a .308 isn't something I'd risk.

 

[peterk123]

Well our outing was a success. The chrono was a world of help. I have had the thing since last fall but I never had the chance to use it until today. Four shots with reloads using 33 gr of 4166. FPS: 1974, 2015, 2007 and 2016. Acceptable and below the speeds for the same weight bullet posted above. Again, thank you for the comments.

Can someone talk to me about standard deviations? I assume the lower the better, but that is all I know.

I also shot my 308, 41 grains of 4895. I had an average speed of 2,425 and a SD of 15.64. Is that good?

This chrono thing is adding a whole new element of fun to shooting and reloading.

Pete

 

[Deleted member 67409]

Well our outing was a success. The chrono was a world of help. I have had the thing since last fall but I never had the chance to use it until today. Four shots with reloads using 33 gr of 4166. FPS: 1974, 2015, 2007 and 2016. Acceptable and below the speeds for the same weight bullet posted above. Again, thank you for the comments.

Can someone talk to me about standard deviations? I assume the lower the better, but that is all I know.

I also shot my 308, 41 grains of 4895. I had an average speed of 2,425 and a SD of 15.64. Is that good?

This chrono thing is adding a whole new element of fun to shooting and reloading.

Pete

Two things about standard deviation:

(1) Yes, the smaller the number result in standard deviation, the more consistent the ammo is. Consistent ammo is quality ammo. Lapua, for example, gets around 8-9 standard deviation.
(2) 15-16 is industry standard for ammo quality. Here's some videos on 7.62x39 ammo quality to help understand what standard deviation means in the context of ammo quality:

 

[mac1911]

I did read that the earliest 303 Savages might have had a .311? Not an error I'd like to make. No problema going smaller but .311 in a .308 isn't something I'd risk.

Seems some load data did not get the memo. I will look in my Lee 1st edition, oldest I have on hand and see what it says. My hornady 7th does not have 303 savage , 300 yes but no 303?