School shooting issue.

[bmach]

Just about everyone here is against any type of gun control, so here is my question. Other than arming teachers (Which I favor), what can be done to help prevent this problem?

 

[richc]

IMHO nothing. Hell prisoners get drugs and weapons in tightly controlled prison environments. How the hell will we keep weapons out of schools?

There will never be enough security folks in a school to prevent school shootings. Kids are smart and resourceful. If they want to get a firearm into a school they will.

Do I think armed security in schools can make a difference? Yes I do. As I've said in another thread, armed security officers with a trained dog would, IMHO, be very helpful. But nothing will prevent it from happening.

That's the sad truth.

Just about everyone here is against any type of gun control, so here is my question. Other than arming teachers (Which I favor), what can be done to help prevent this problem?

 

[E.Stoner]

Physically harden the buildings, compartmentalize corridors so that they can be locked down effectively, put metal detectors at the doors and have trained security/cops/vets on detail on the premises.

All of this but also stop publishing in the names and faces of these monsters. They are turning them in to celebrities for other defective people and give them ideas.
It's telling and shameful that in most recent Maryland shooting you don't see the name in the headline's hero's face plastered all over the news.

 

[DitchDigger]

How about the .gov as in law enforcement and the FBI do there job.

 

[HorizontalHunter]

Stop glorifying them in the media.

Bob

 

[Horrible]

We have protected our schools to withstand hurricanes and tornadoes, we need to look at these attacks as just another external threat to harden our schools against.

Have professionals do a real deal security assessment on each school and determine the best action.

Also, the whole arming teachers thing, we shouldn't articulate as that. The antis and those on the left believe in using the govt to force people to do something that they wouldn't otherwise do. We need to articulate this as ALLOWING teachers to exercise their rights and carry a concealed weapon IF THEY CHOOSE TO!

Currently, mostly all schools are "gun-free zones", which only makes certain that potential victims will be unarmed and vulnerable.

 

[Horrible]

IMHO nothing. Hell prisoners get drugs and weapons in tightly controlled prison environments. How the hell will we keep weapons out of schools?

There will never be enough security folks in a school to prevent school shootings. Kids are smart and resourceful. If they want to get a firearm into a school they will.

Do I think armed security in schools can make a difference? Yes I do. As I've said in another thread, armed security officers with a trained dog would, IMHO, be very helpful. But nothing will prevent it from happening.

That's the sad truth.

Hardening the schools as a target and allowing educators to arm themselves, should they choose to do so, would create a doubt in the mind of the shooter. A crazyhead that wants to rack up an easy bodycount will avoid schools that have or could have armed individuals firing back at them and choose another target.

Look at James Holmes (Aurora, CO movie theater shooter). Dude drove past ~ 10 movie theaters and hit one that was not the largest nor the nearest, simply b/c it was a GFZ.

 

[Boris]

Currently, mostly all schools are "gun-free zones", which only makes certain that potential victims will be unarmed and vulnerable.

which is precisely what libtards want.

for additional 100 points, who signed this gun free zone bullshit?

 

[peterk123]

Well, strong family units would solve almost all problems as far as I am concerned, not just gun violence. Getting the media to stop sensationalizing these events, and not giving more than thirty second notice would help immensely. People getting off of social media would help immensely. Toning down video games and violent films would help (voluntarily, not mandating). Hollywood idiots shutting the F&*k up would help. Booting Soros is another biggie.

But since none of that will ever happen, and it will probably get worse, we need physical deterrents. Entrances with vestibules that have locked doors on both sides. Metal detectors. Armed security. Visible IDs for all students and personnel that are permitted to be there. Separate entrances with locked vestibules and detectors for visitors and those without IDs. Cameras in parking lots and perimeters and security to quickly get anyone that does not belong off the property. A strong sense of force. Of course, everyone would complain we are profiling and intimidating people. Then everything will get removed and the process can start all over again.

With that said, while any school violence is horrific, I think it is has been proven time and again that statistically it barely a measurable statistic. If it was that big of a problem I sincerely believe preventative measures would have been put in place a long time ago. Politicians have done the cost benefit analysis and they know that the likelihood of their district getting hit is lower than a lightning strike. Way more payback politically to have one of these incidents happen every five years or so, hopefully in some other district and State. It is sickening, but I honestly believe that is the thought process.

 

[IPSC_DRL]

Obviously there is no panacea for this type of action, only ways to minimize it's occurrence, many of which are prescribed above and in other posts.

Simple people look to simple solutions to complex problems. That is a large part of the confabulation we are experiencing now.

 

[Picton]

Three things will cost nothing and can start now:

1. Situational awareness on the part of students, staff, teachers, and administrators.

2. A flexible mindset designed to exploit opportunities for escape or resistance. This will help not just against shooters in the buildings, but also against other threats for the rest of their lives.

3. Allowing staff to arm themselves defensively.

Optics, such as metal detectors, are a waste. They can ALWAYS be circumvented, and are therefore useless: if an alternate entry point exists (and, in a school, it always does), a shooter will use it. Hardening schools, visible IDs, etc... also cost-ineffective and, in my experience, not useful as a one-size-fits-all prescription. My school is small enough that IDs are pointless; at fewer than 1000 people all told, everyone knows who the strangers are.

I was heartened by the STUDENT response to the Stoneman push for “transparent backpacks only.” They overwhelmingly said it was stupid and would stop nothing, and they’re right about that. It’s optics, and thus useless.

 

[NH_Realtor]

Separate the sexes. Boys in one school, girls in another. IMO a large part of this is a social issue which is caused by how effing terrible kids are to each other. Generally they are so terrible to each other because they are either trying to impress their friends, or more likely, the opposite sex.

Parenting will help too, but I truly believe kids of a H.S. age don't need the added pressure of social constructs they don't understand when they're in a learning environment. Let them learn in school and do their social shit outside of school, that way the parents are responsible for policing their social presence.

 

[richc]

When I look at methods of securing schools I tend not to dwell on those suggestions that won't ever pass muster. Arming teachers on a wide spread basis won't, IMHO, become mainstream.

Nor will turning schools into prison like environments. You think Dover, Wellesley and Weston parents will go for all the suggestions in this thread? It won't happen.

By and large school shooters are not right in the head. They have problems, and as we've seen big problems in some cases that have been identified early and often (not in all cases though...). I truly don't think this type of shooter gives a crap about living or dying.

Assume there are armed guards in the schools. Will there be enough to put one in each classroom? I doubt it. Could a clever kid smuggle a Glock and bunch of mags into a classroom somehow? Sure, just like shit gets into prisons.

It might be more difficult for sure. But kids are damn smart, and when you combine that with a psychopathic personality disorder, well, nothing is going to stop that type of individual every time.

BTW I do agree with your notion about softer targets being selected. But at the end of the day the Aurora shooter was a complete nut job who was smart enough to pick a softer target, but was prepared to do what it took to kill.

Hardening the schools as a target and allowing educators to arm themselves, should they choose to do so, would create a doubt in the mind of the shooter. A crazyhead that wants to rack up an easy bodycount will avoid schools that have or could have armed individuals firing back at them and choose another target.

Look at James Holmes (Aurora, CO movie theater shooter). Dude drove past ~ 10 movie theaters and hit one that was not the largest nor the nearest, simply b/c it was a GFZ.

 

[robjax]

you cannot legislate crime away. You punish the criminal and refrain from infringing on the rights of law abiding citizens.

If you do not want to arm teachers that's fine. But eliminate gun free zones and let the teachers who want to exercise their constitutional freedoms to do so. In some cases the teacher may choose to carry and prepare him/herself for the seemingly inevitable.

Otherwise have an armed cop in the schools ready to take down a would be shooter.

 

[amm5061]

Let parents discipline their children again. I have empirical evidence that a good trip behind the woodshed with a leather belt solves behavioral issues quite nicely.

 

[greencobra]

how about starting with locking the door and not letting anyone in unless they have prearranged business and have an appointment. especially not letting people in with duffle bags and several pieces of hand luggage. that's a little suspicious, no? details can be hashed out later, like parents picking up sick children, etc. in the meantime, get some procedure in place.

 

[mousegunguy]

There’s been lots of talk about arming teachers. I’ve heard next to no talk about arming teachers with less than lethal weapons like tasers, mace or bean bag guns.

 

[Dennis in MA]

Honestly, families need to go Red Foreman on their kids. Boots to asses. Enough coddling. Enough "well, what can you do?" This crap happened 40 years ago, but not nearly to the extent it does today.

 

[swatgig]

what can be done to help prevent this problem?

This is only a "problem" because the media makes it a problem. There have been school shootings since the 1700s according to one article I read.

What I find interesting is all the AR-15 talk. It seems people forget that the Virginia Tech shooter used a Glock and a .22 handgun (Don't recall the make). Columbine was a shotgun and a handgun.

If you want to stop the copycats, you have to gag the press so nobody knows to copy the crime.

 

[basscatfrank]

Stop glorifying them in the media.

Bob

Years ago, many major sporting events were disrupted by spectators who ran on to the field. How did the major league sports and the networks that televised them combat this? They stopped putting the camera on these idiots and the rate of these incidents dropped dramatically.

 

[bill o]

Honestly, families need to go Red Foreman on their kids. Boots to asses. Enough coddling. Enough "well, what can you do?" This crap happened 40 years ago, but not nearly to the extent it does today.

School shootings are no more common today compared with 40 years ago.

 

[Len-2A Training]

IMHO nothing. Hell prisoners get drugs and weapons in tightly controlled prison environments. How the hell will we keep weapons out of schools?

There will never be enough security folks in a school to prevent school shootings. Kids are smart and resourceful. If they want to get a firearm into a school they will.

Do I think armed security in schools can make a difference? Yes I do. As I've said in another thread, armed security officers with a trained dog would, IMHO, be very helpful. But nothing will prevent it from happening.

That's the sad truth.

I disagree. The solution however isn't really more security in the schools, but preventing kids from being a threat.

Stop glorifying them in the media.

Bob

One VERY important step that would halt a lot of the copy-cats. Never happen however due to our idiotic LSM.

Hardening the schools as a target and allowing educators to arm themselves, should they choose to do so, would create a doubt in the mind of the shooter. A crazyhead that wants to rack up an easy bodycount will avoid schools that have or could have armed individuals firing back at them and choose another target.

There are reasonable things that could be done to harden the school, mostly in building design areas. But most building designs are done for aesthetics and to get awards, not with safety in mind.

This is only a "problem" because the media makes it a problem. There have been school shootings since the 1700s according to one article I read.

If you want to stop the copycats, you have to gag the press so nobody knows to copy the crime.

Yup and will never happen.

 

[Len-2A Training]

Knowing what I know about our SRO and his interfacing with students, I'm convinced that an SRO in the middle and high schools who interacts with the kids so that they don't feel ignored, isolated, bullied would go a very long way to prevent those kids from wanting to get revenge by shooting up students/teachers/schools.

 

[richc]

Len, the young man in Maryland was an honor student. He had no record. By all accounts he was a good kid.

How would anyone predict and prevent this kid from shooting? Do you start an investigation into any kid who broke up with his girlfriend?

I disagree. The solution however isn't really more security in the schools, but preventing kids from being a threat.

 

[boiler_eng]

Honestly, families need to go Red Foreman on their kids. Boots to asses. Enough coddling. Enough "well, what can you do?" This crap happened 40 years ago, but not nearly to the extent it does today.

I remember one time I was in trouble and my mother told me to run around the block and if I took too short she would know I didn't actually go all the way around and if I took too long she would know I wasn't running. Then when I got back she said she hadn't figured out my punishment yet so to go around again. The third time around I realized this might be the punishment.

 

[Len-2A Training]

Len, the young man in Maryland was an honor student. He had no record. By all accounts he was a good kid.

How would anyone predict and prevent this kid from shooting? Do you start an investigation into any kid who broke up with his girlfriend?

Rich, students eagerly seek out our SRO and share their lives with him. He helps coach them with their problems. A lot of what he does seems to be "guidance counselor" type work. That's what I'm referring to. If something slides sideways people need someone to talk to that will listen to them and perhaps give them some life experience advice. Those kids won't be a problem, so this is the sort of preventative measures I endorse. BTW, my info on SRO-student interface came from some of the former students sharing this info even years after leaving high school. Perhaps we have a unique officer, I don't know but I'd like to see him cloned.

 

[chrbla2000]

How about making schools campus style in each town where Police and Fire are attached?

 

[kalash]

What issue? School shootings are becoming more and more rare, just as they are becoming more and more sensationalized by the media. Schools are safer today than they were yesterday.


View: https://www.npr.org/2018/03/15/593831564/the-disconnect-between-perceived-danger-in-u-s-schools-and-reality?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=npr&utm_term=nprnews&utm_content=20180316


People ignore this fact just like they ignore the fact that violent crime has been dropping steadily year-after-year since the early 90s. This country is becoming safer but the media keeps blowing favorable stats out of proportion.

 

[igrace7092]

Kids are being raised by the internet. Start there.

 

[Dennis in MA]

Knowing what I know about our SRO and his interfacing with students, I'm convinced that an SRO in the middle and high schools who interacts with the kids so that they don't feel ignored, isolated, bullied would go a very long way to prevent those kids from wanting to get revenge by shooting up students/teachers/schools.

What is sad is that:

A) there aren't more teachers, earlier, that realize they speak into these kids' lives and should be doing this.

B) there isn't more education for STUDENTS to lift up each-other. Start early.

C) there isn't dope-slap training for parents to wake the F up and help their kids when A and B aren't happening. Because IT'S YOUR F'ING KID, MORON!!!!

I continue to be shocked at how many parents think Little Johnny or Suzie is just an angel and they are really the terror of their class. Especially little girls. What B-words they can be. I watched it so often. And mom and dad thought that the little angel was just SO precious. If I found out my kid acted like that, the dent in their heads would be so large as to require a huge hairstyle the remainder of their life to hide it.