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Be sure to enter the NES/Pioneer Valley Arms February Giveaway ***Smith & Wesson SD9VE 9MM***
suggestions for a 9mm carbine?
- Thread starter 8x57mm
- Start date
Talked to the owner of one of these a few nights ago at a plate shoot...he loves it.
Keltec SUB2000
Keltec SUB2000
I have a couple of ideas that perhaps some of the others can elaborate on because I have no personal experience with these particular carbines:
Hi-Point...I am unsure of your location or their availability in your area, but over the years I have heard good things about Hi-Point carbines. In the past I have seen them at gun shows and they were certainly priced right.
Ruger Patrol Carbines...Ruger briefly marketed a carbine in 9mm and 40 S&W, primarily targeted towards the LE market. Apparently, there was little interest in the product and it was discontinued. I have been told, but cannot confirm that the carbine was decent enough, but that they simply did not sell enough to keep them in their product line. I know that during the time they were being phased out, they were quite reasonable, and there may be some available on the used market at decent price. This is something you might want to check out.
Marlin Camp Carbine...this was on offering by Marlin and again no longer being made, but reasonably priced. It took S&W 3rd Gen Pistol magazines. This carbine appeared to me as one of those "hate 'em or love 'em" type guns. I have heard both good and bad things about them. Again, if you look in the used market, you might find a deal.
Since I don't know your exact price range, I would suggest that you look at the Beretta CX4, a great looking gun, and a price that falls in the upper mid-range handgun category. These are nice guns with great looks. Again, I don't know your price range, but it might be worth checking out. (what I might call reasonably priced someone else might call expensive and vice versa![[smile]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/001.gif "Smile [smile]")
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Good luck to you.
Mark L.
Hi-Point...I am unsure of your location or their availability in your area, but over the years I have heard good things about Hi-Point carbines. In the past I have seen them at gun shows and they were certainly priced right.
Ruger Patrol Carbines...Ruger briefly marketed a carbine in 9mm and 40 S&W, primarily targeted towards the LE market. Apparently, there was little interest in the product and it was discontinued. I have been told, but cannot confirm that the carbine was decent enough, but that they simply did not sell enough to keep them in their product line. I know that during the time they were being phased out, they were quite reasonable, and there may be some available on the used market at decent price. This is something you might want to check out.
Marlin Camp Carbine...this was on offering by Marlin and again no longer being made, but reasonably priced. It took S&W 3rd Gen Pistol magazines. This carbine appeared to me as one of those "hate 'em or love 'em" type guns. I have heard both good and bad things about them. Again, if you look in the used market, you might find a deal.
Since I don't know your exact price range, I would suggest that you look at the Beretta CX4, a great looking gun, and a price that falls in the upper mid-range handgun category. These are nice guns with great looks. Again, I don't know your price range, but it might be worth checking out. (what I might call reasonably priced someone else might call expensive and vice versa
)Good luck to you.
Mark L.
Accuracy of a pistol caliber carbine is going to be pistol accuracy. Gallon milk jug at 100 yards is typical. Auto pistol calibers are intended to be used at 50 yards or less, so don`t expect tactical rifle performance at longer ranges.
The Ruger PC4 & PC9 carbines are pickup truck rugged and reliable little carbines. They were quite literally designed to knock down doors with a butt stroke. Police sales were not enough to keep the guns in production, leading to their discontinuation. They are still widely available around $250. These carbines take magazines used in the Ruger "P" series pistols.
I had a PC4 for a while and was satisifed with it. It was a fun toy but was replaced with a Kel-Tec.
The Kel-Tec Sub2000 carbine is a great plinker. I have one in .40 caliber, that uses SIG P226 magazines, and have no intention of selling it anytime soon. The Sub2000 folds in half, to 16.25" long for storage or transport. The gun will fit easily into a standard brief case when folded.
![[wink]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/002.gif "Wink [wink]")
There are several models available, in either 9mm or .40S&W. The gun is handy and very reliable.You can get one in your choice of 9mm or .40S&W that will accept either (one of) Glock, S&W, or SIG magazines. Kel-Tec has a good reputation for standing behind their products, so you can buy with confidence. I paid around $300 for mine, new, a couple of years ago.
Availability of a specific variation can be spotty as they are run in batches throughout the year. I had to wait a few months to get the variation that I wanted, The Sub2000 has a loyal following and there are many factory and aftermarket accessories available. There are a couple of internet forums for Kel-Tec owners that would be worth researching for more info.
While the pistol caliber carbines are well suited for plinking and most "survival" scenarios, I would strongly recommend a lever action carbine in .357 Mag or .44 Mag if you seriously intend to hunt with the gun. They will have an accurate range of 100 yards or slightly more and much better accuracy and power at this range.
Jack
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I came across this page and thought of the thread....Here's a bunch of 9mm carbines to look over
http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/8mmto10m_cjed.htm
http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/8mmto10m_cjed.htm
Current production fixed stock Uzi from Vector (fixed stock plus they will remove the bayo lug under the HG = MA compliant), they are $659 if you order direct through them...
http://vectorarms.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=3&products_id=17
http://vectorarms.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=3&products_id=17
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Some thoughts following the lines of previous posters and adding my comments on a few I've owned.
Ruger PC-9 - neat little carbine. Kept shaking the scope mounts loose, so I finally removed the scope and it basically isn't brought out much. At the 1st NES Shoot I brought it and Derek shot it, he liked it. We were on a 50 yd range. Handy that it takes pre-ban Ruger mags that are cheap and readily available.
Highpoint - I've never liked the looks of them, but JonJ bought one, gussied it up and really likes it. Perhaps he'll add something here shortly.
Kel-Tec Sub 2000 - I bought one that used the Glock mags (9mm). It was so lightweight and the front sight is absolutely horrendous (adjustability issues - check a Kel-Tec forum) that I sold it to another NES member a number of years ago after shooting maybe 100 rds or so. [Someone offered a machined front sight for it, but it was ~$100 for it and I just couldn't see spending that sort of money on this cheap, plastic gun. YMMV] I saw a used one at Four Seasons this past week.
Ruger PC-9 - neat little carbine. Kept shaking the scope mounts loose, so I finally removed the scope and it basically isn't brought out much. At the 1st NES Shoot I brought it and Derek shot it, he liked it. We were on a 50 yd range. Handy that it takes pre-ban Ruger mags that are cheap and readily available.
Highpoint - I've never liked the looks of them, but JonJ bought one, gussied it up and really likes it. Perhaps he'll add something here shortly.
Kel-Tec Sub 2000 - I bought one that used the Glock mags (9mm). It was so lightweight and the front sight is absolutely horrendous (adjustability issues - check a Kel-Tec forum) that I sold it to another NES member a number of years ago after shooting maybe 100 rds or so. [Someone offered a machined front sight for it, but it was ~$100 for it and I just couldn't see spending that sort of money on this cheap, plastic gun. YMMV] I saw a used one at Four Seasons this past week.
garyz
NES Member
uzi
i asked the same question a while back
i was given all the same answers.
i ended up w/ a preban imi model b uzi, and couldn't be happier
great gun, real fun to shoot, and lots of oos and ahhs at the range.
you can get a preban for about $1300.00 give or take
or you can get a post ban w/ fixed stock for about $800 or so.
go w/ the uzi, you won't be sorry
garyz
i asked the same question a while back
i was given all the same answers.
i ended up w/ a preban imi model b uzi, and couldn't be happier
great gun, real fun to shoot, and lots of oos and ahhs at the range.
you can get a preban for about $1300.00 give or take
or you can get a post ban w/ fixed stock for about $800 or so.
go w/ the uzi, you won't be sorry
garyz
strangenh
NES Member
The Kel-Tec carbines are great and reasonably accurate and reliable. They fold down small, and the Glock 17 compatible magwell models are a hoot with 33rd Glock mags. If you want max accuracy, you'll have to move over to the Beretta CX4 or the Ruger PC9. The PC9 and CX4 are reliable enough that Manchester Firing Line rents them - and their range guns take some real abuse. The Beretta is turning out to be bizarrely reliable, with one Louisiana dept. reporting in over 300K rounds on some of their range units, with only minor parts replacements. I find the CX4s dead-on accurate, too, but they run about double the cost of a new SU2000.
Another recommendation for the Marlin Camp 9 - it uses S&W mags, which are common, and the gun will probably be the cheapest of those suggested.
IF all you want is a plinking gun w/HD applications, it's a good choice.
If you want something more interesting, albeit noticeably more expensive to shoot, I'd go for an M1 carbine. History, a flatter trajectory and it looks looks cooler.
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I have a hi-point 995 9mm carbine. It's ugly and cheap. 10 Round mags are $17.00 including shipping. It's a blast to shoot. You can buy one new for $200.00(or less). Shooting whitebox ammo I can keep them inside a 2" circle at 25 yards with the stock sights. It comes with a scope mount and a sling. It's guaranteed for life.
I have one problem, I should have said I used to have one. My wife started nailing the bullseye before she got through the first mag and said, "I like this one. This one's mine..."
You can spend more money and get a finer made, better looking gun, and I'm all for that if you can swing it. However, it won't be more fun than the hi-point.
I have one problem, I should have said I used to have one. My wife started nailing the bullseye before she got through the first mag and said, "I like this one. This one's mine..."
You can spend more money and get a finer made, better looking gun, and I'm all for that if you can swing it. However, it won't be more fun than the hi-point.
Since I can't really define "arm and leg" from your post, I'll have to be another to chime in for the Uzi. A Vector can be had for short money - though Vector has had a few reliability issues lately. On the up side, they are good at clearing up problems you may have. On the other hand, IMI Model B's are out there in good quantities and will out shoot and out last and out class just about any 9mm carbine out there. Shoot one and you will understand. If you're out thi way, drop me a PM and you're more than welcome to pour WWB through mine any old time.
get an uzi or else me and massmark will berate you at a members shoot!!!
seriously though do a search...i had the same question about 2 years ago...got an uzi thanks to massmark's suggestion and never looked back
fun...accurate...reliable and built like a tank...its a weapon that will out last you...an original imi that is
seriously though do a search...i had the same question about 2 years ago...got an uzi thanks to massmark's suggestion and never looked back
fun...accurate...reliable and built like a tank...its a weapon that will out last you...an original imi that is
This is not my gun but I wish it were. I present to you the Olympic arms K9-GL. This one is obviously not Mass ghey due to the suppressor, threaded barrel and telescopic buttstock. And the best part is it accepts standard capacity Glock mags.
I'd agree that an UZI or AR 9mm Carbine is the way to go. You should have no problem finding mags for either of them. I wouldn't go with the Olympic Arms setup since the pre-ban hi-cap Glock mags are ridiculously priced. You can find a NIW pre-ban 32 round Uzi mage for $15 if you look around. Also as an AR you can quickly change the caliber and if you get a pre-ban lower you can have all the evil features you want.
EDIT: You could always be different get a FN PS90 instead. Not really a carbine but more of a PDW. 5.7x28mm is much better in a short barrel than 9mm but unfortunately they're not cheap ($1700+) and good luck finding pre-ban 30 or 50 round mags for them.
EDIT: You could always be different get a FN PS90 instead. Not really a carbine but more of a PDW. 5.7x28mm is much better in a short barrel than 9mm but unfortunately they're not cheap ($1700+) and good luck finding pre-ban 30 or 50 round mags for them.
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I've shot Mark's Uzi and its a very accurate and well made gun that is also compact, plus it accepts high capacity magazines. It is pricey though but you get what you pay for.
As for Ruger models, I have a PC4 that is fun to shoot but is still a limited weapon and is basically a .40S&W M1 Carbine IMO.
Hands down I'd say the Kel Tec Sub 2000 is the best bang for your buck. Very compact, easy to clean and once you get used to shooting it, its everything you could need. The key is getting used to shooting it. Yes the sights aren't the greatest and getting a feel for holding it takes some getting used to. Its not something I'd recomend for someone bigger than average size.
Shooting rapid fire at 50 yards I can hit a row of man sized targets easy and well, plus I can plink steel plates at 25 yards and rarely miss. Once you get a feel for shooting it, the bright colored plastic front sight acts more like a red dot than a blade, at least to me it does.
I'll never sell mine.
As for Ruger models, I have a PC4 that is fun to shoot but is still a limited weapon and is basically a .40S&W M1 Carbine IMO.
Hands down I'd say the Kel Tec Sub 2000 is the best bang for your buck. Very compact, easy to clean and once you get used to shooting it, its everything you could need. The key is getting used to shooting it. Yes the sights aren't the greatest and getting a feel for holding it takes some getting used to. Its not something I'd recomend for someone bigger than average size.
Shooting rapid fire at 50 yards I can hit a row of man sized targets easy and well, plus I can plink steel plates at 25 yards and rarely miss. Once you get a feel for shooting it, the bright colored plastic front sight acts more like a red dot than a blade, at least to me it does.
I'll never sell mine.
