USGI mags. tossed away?

[Dench]

More importantly, the mags are most likely post-ban.

and even more importantly, the mags are marked "FOR LAW ENFORCEMENT OR MILITARY USE ONLY".

 

[Biggsy]

I was in the Mass Army Guard for 6 years, I never saw anything like that. I did get my ass smoked for losing a blank adaptor once.

 

[Dench]

I was in the Mass Army Guard for 6 years, I never saw anything like that. I did get my ass smoked for losing a blank adaptor once.

for a BFA? wow.
what would be the penalty for dragging a 30+ foot tree into your FOB that was jammed into your m113's suspension and then leaving it there for a few days before you had KBR get it out?

 

[Timberwolf]

When the M16 was first issued the mags were preloaded and were meant to be thrown away. Then they started to issued stripper clips and guides so that they could be reloaded.

 

[terraformer]

I can certainly understand variation from branch to branch, but this practice would be completely unthinkable in the USMC. One of my issued mags had a large dent in the side and would jam with every shot fired. I took it to the armory to get it swapped out and was told to disassemble it and try and tap out the dent. It got to the point that I was trying to find mags online from places that would ship to Hawaii (where I was stationed). Eventually the mag deteriorated so much that the spring actually burst out the right side of the magazine during an annual qual. I got an alibi for that course of fire and a brand new (to me) magazine. During my enlistment I saw only 3 new mags still sealed in the plastic.

They say the marine corp is the least funded (per capita) of the forces but this is too much. All that for a $20 mag???

Looking back on the OP, he clearly stated the Guard. The only people I know who are in the guard are there after stints in the Air Force. This is RI and MA. Apparently the Air guard, in these two states at least, is f'd up beyond belief (major nepotism and people getting promotions who don't deserve them, etc). Not sure if that could be part of the difference between what those who were federal with the OPs story.

 

[KMM696]

My cousin has a friend who's son is in the National Guard. He claims that after they use their weapons on the range they just throw away the empty mags.from the M16's.

I'm not going to say that your cousin's friend's son's story isn't true, but my niece's roommate's hairdresser suggested that they may have confused magazine and stripper clip.



Although, after 19 years in the Air Guard, it wouldn't surprise me at all that they tossed them. If our supply had received an entire set of new replacement mags, I'm sure they would have told the last people to draw the old mags to toss them, rather than have to deal with throwing them away themselves.

We sent probably 2000 unused 20 round mags to DRMO when we converted our M16A1s to A2s a couple years back. The only parts of the rifle they kept were the lower, buffer tubes and buffers. Most of those rifles we uncased were last seen by workers at Colt - never issued, never even had the preservative cleaned off.

 

[Mike1911]

I'm not going to say that your cousin's friend's son's story isn't true, but my niece's roommate's hairdresser suggested that they may have confused magazine and stripper clip.



Although, after 19 years in the Air Guard, it wouldn't surprise me at all that they tossed them. If our supply had received an entire set of new replacement mags, I'm sure they would have told the last people to draw the old mags to toss them, rather than have to deal with throwing them away themselves.

We sent probably 2000 unused 20 round mags to DRMO when we converted our M16A1s to A2s a couple years back. The only parts of the rifle they kept were the lower, buffer tubes and buffers. Most of those rifles we uncased were last seen by workers at Colt - never issued, never even had the preservative cleaned off.

He's going to find out exactly what the deal is. It could be a mistake. When I find out after he finds out I'll post it.

 

[offcamber]

served 6 years as a Marine infantryman and 9 years with the USCG. We have never tossed magazines after range days. Brass yes.

My time in Coast Guard....we never threw away the mags or the brass....I am not sure what the Gunners Mates did with all of it after we were done but I know they didn't toss it....the mags we defiantly reused. We had boxs of 50cal shells and links waiting to be recycled.

This was about 10 years ago so things may have changed...

 

[FreedomVet]

Throw away Mag's ?

Even if they were too messed-up to be fixed, we wouldn't just toss them away. Have to turn them in to the armorer so he could turn them in to the supply guy.

 

[altmf]

Join the Marine Corps and train at Parris Island. You will see some of the oldest equipment available in the Corps. Although when I was leaving there were suddenly a lot of shiny brand-spanking new m16's marching past me.
From sand-filled canteens from the 60-70's?? to rusty alice clips to magazines with little to no paint on them with dents and rust galore. The only thing new were the cammies and boots. I am surprised that they issue (sell) you brand damn new cammies, 5 friggin sets.

I may be wrong but as far as I know: The army provides all hygiene gear and equipment used in basic training for free. Is this true?

In the Marine Corps, recruits pay for all uniforms, laundry soap, deodorant, even their $70 new balance go-fasters.

 

[FreedomVet]

Basic Issue

altmf.....When I was in Basic Training many moons ago, yes the Army gave us a "Basic Issue" of uniforms including the Cammies, Class A's and footgear which we would take when we PCS'd. All else which we used throughout Basic had to be cleaned and returned to the CIF (Central Issue Facility) before clearing the Post. When reporting to the new Duty Station, you'd be re-issued whatever else you would need all over again.

 

[ochmude]

altmf.....When I was in Basic Training many moons ago, yes the Army gave us a "Basic Issue" of uniforms including the Cammies, Class A's and footgear which we would take when we PCS'd. All else which we used throughout Basic had to be cleaned and returned to the CIF (Central Issue Facility) before clearing the Post. When reporting to the new Duty Station, you'd be re-issued whatever else you would need all over again.

It still works that way in the Marines. All clothing/uniform items are issued to you in bootcamp (and deducted from your pay). Field gear is issued by CIF at each post you are assigned to. You turn it back in when you PCS/EAS. Every unit has it's own CIF basic issue list based on it's particular mission.

 

[Mattyb]

I noticed some mags being thrown away at Edson Range on Camp Pendleton. Maybe they belonged to some recruits who misplaced them. i picked them up and they came home with me in 1996 when I had orders to Okinawa. They're somewhere in my mothers house. I believe I have 2-3 Colt mags. If i find them, I'll be sure to put them up on "Karma" thread. I have no use for them since I dispise all AR type rifles

 

[OLAK]

Mattyb, if you find the magazines I'll gladly take them off your hands, I can always use extra mags.
OLAK

 

[Mattyb]

I'll go searching this weekend. Contact Derek and go "Green" and you'll have an opportunity like everyone else.

 

[Biggsy]

for a BFA? wow.
what would be the penalty for dragging a 30+ foot tree into your FOB that was jammed into your m113's suspension and then leaving it there for a few days before you had KBR get it out?

I think that maybe would have been forgiven based on pure ballsiness

 

[mark056]

I may be wrong but as far as I know: The army provides all hygiene gear and equipment used in basic training for free. Is this true?

Nope, we got a pay advance then were promptly marched down to the PX where we purchased our required hygiene gear under the watchful eye of our drill sergeants.

Mark L.

 

[Finalygotabeltfed]

My cousin has a friend who's son is in the National Guard. He claims that after they use their weapons on the range they just throw away the empty mags.from the M16's.

Anyone know if there's any truth to this? I find that it's kind of hard to believe.

Thank in advance

I find it more than hard to believe.

Magazines are not and never have been considered disposable items. Even when casualties are removed from the battlefield, their ammo stays and is redistributed among those who remain.

Military 5.56 ammo doesn't come packed in magazines, it comes on stripper clips which are then loaded into magazines.....the ones that each soldier has to hold onto to reload after use.

If he or others in his unit are tossing their mags, they are going to be up shits creek without a paddle if they think they can continue the practice in combat.

 

[ochmude]

Again, this is specific to the Marine Corps, so YMMV, but I also recall that during the annual qualification course of fire magazine retention was taught and required for the rapid fire. At the 200 and 300 yard lines you would fire a magazine of five rounds then reload and fire another magazine of five rounds. If you did not at least attempt to retain the magazine you would be penalized. We were even taught in bootcamp to unbutton the top button of our blouse to just toss the magazine in there. That suggests to me that the mags were not considered to be an expendable item.

 

[terraformer]

Again, this is specific to the Marine Corps, so YMMV, but I also recall that during the annual qualification course of fire magazine retention was taught and required for the rapid fire. At the 200 and 300 yard lines you would fire a magazine of five rounds then reload and fire another magazine of five rounds. If you did not at least attempt to retain the magazine you would be penalized. We were even taught in bootcamp to unbutton the top button of our blouse to just toss the magazine in there. That suggests to me that the mags were not considered to be an expendable item.

When Marines deploy in the field, is all of the ammo you carry in mags or does some go in stripper clips or boxes?

 

[News Shooter]

I have no intention of getting into the argument here. I have no personal knowledge one way or another. All I can say is that I have been told by more than one person they used to scour the range and Devins and pick them up everywhere, along with some other stuff

 

[Mattyb]

If I remember correctly,(it's been 10 years since I got out) the ammo is on stripper clips and they give you a speed loader to go on the mags. Your choice. load individually, or use the loader.

 

[terraformer]

If I remember correctly,(it's been 10 years since I got out) the ammo is on stripper clips and they give you a speed loader to go on the mags. Your choice. load individually, or use the loader.

Yes, but do Marines (being specific here because of the training you all apparently received -- see above) carry any loose or packaged ammo which would facilitate the need to reload the mags one would otherwise discard, say after one engagement while things are in a lull. Carrying more ammo would seem to make a lot of sense for units going into an area where egress is not readily available. Ammo on stripper clips uses less than 1/2 the space of ammo in a mag so one could conceivably carry either more (weight limited), or simply limit the physical space needed for mags to streamline gear carried.

Otherwise there doesn't seem to be a very good reason beyond frugality for having someone open up their shirt and stuffing mags in the pocket it creates while taking fire. In fact, it kinda seems stupid to risk a life for <$100 worth of mags (assuming 210 rds is what an individual soldier carries.)

 

[ochmude]

When Marines deploy in the field, is all of the ammo you carry in mags or does some go in stripper clips or boxes?

The ammo comes from the ASP in green, cloth bandoliers. 5 pouches/bandolier, 3 clips/pouch, 10 rounds/clip. Also, 1 speed loader was in each bandolier. You then either loaded up your mags if you would be leaving the wire, or dumped them in your seabag if you were spending the entire deployment as a fobbit. At Al Asad the base regs required everyone to have 10 rounds on them at all times for security purposes. It was not uncommon to keep 10 rounds on a clip and just carry them in your pocket while on base, to spare yourself from carrying the weight of the entire combat load just to go to the chow hall or check your email. Then when it was time to go out on the road, you'd throw on your gear with the full load in all your magazines.

 

[ochmude]

Yes, but do Marines (being specific here because of the training you all apparently received -- see above) carry any loose or packaged ammo which would facilitate the need to reload the mags one would otherwise discard, say after one engagement while things are in a lull. Carrying more ammo would seem to make a lot of sense for units going into an area where egress is not readily available. Ammo on stripper clips uses less than 1/2 the space of ammo in a mag so one could conceivably carry either more (weight limited), or simply limit the physical space needed for mags to streamline gear carried.

Otherwise there doesn't seem to be a very good reason beyond frugality for having someone open up their shirt and stuffing mags in the pocket it creates while taking fire. In fact, it kinda seems stupid to risk a life for <$100 worth of mags (assuming 210 rds is what an individual soldier carries.)

Okay, I see what you're asking now. We very rarely carried extra ammo on clips due to the nature of our mission (convoy security). 1 mag in the weapon, 6 on the flak, and ammo cans for the crew served in the turret...that's pretty much it. I can't speak for units with a different type of mission or units in Afghanistan (where shit really and truly hits the fan quite often), but we never worried about how much ammo we had, as firefights were extremely rare at this stage of the war. One of my sergeants who was involved in the initial phases of the war suggested filling an old MRE box with extra ammo that everyone in the vehicle could grab for if needed, but that idea was shot down as anything loose in the vehicle would turn into a projectile in the even of an IED strike. Oh, and the thing about stuffing mags in your blouse, that was just for annual marksmanship qualification, which EVERYONE recognized as being irrelevant to the type of shooting we'd do in combat. I just mentioned that to say that, in a controlled environment such as a rifle range on a CONUS base, mags were expected to be retained, not disgarded. In the real world, no one would crack open their flak to save a $8 mag that probably didn't work that well in the first place, lol. Hopefully that answered your question, as I was really trying to stay on topic.

 

[terraformer]

In the real world, no one would crack open their flak to save a $8 mag that probably didn't work that well in the first place, lol. Hopefully that answered your question, as I was really trying to stay on topic.

Ahh... I read what you wrote too literally. Thanks.

 

[smitty]

Throw away mags in the MC, only if they are bad.

In 16 years as a US Marine now, we are told that the only time it is okay to drop a mag and leave it where it lay is under fire (when to "do so" reach down and retreive the mag would cost you your life). Marines are taught mag retention on all of our range evolutions.

smitty