What do/should you do?

[chinalfr]

I caught a bum trying to steal a $1 light off my MTB bike this morning. He was caught in his act and I confronted him. After the incident, this lead me to rethink what I should react if the situation go a different way.

Should I confront the looser? What happen if the bum scare, turn dark and attack me? Am I doing the right thing? Looking for you opinion.

1. Should I confronted him?
2. Should I wear my CCW sash and badge while confronted the bum?
3. Should I call 911?
4. Should I yell "help'?
5. Should I take Biden advice, take my shotgun and fire a warning shot?

BTW, this incident happen in a free state while I'm on vacation. It's legal to open carry or CCW without any BS paperwork.

 

[Davidk]

Keep in mind when making decisions to act or not:
1. that all altercations, no matter how simple, can escalate
2. there there is at least one gun at the scene (yours), perhaps more.
3. that even if the "bum" does not have a weapon, it does not mean that he can not employ force, including lethal force. Remember "hockey dad?"

Ask yourself: is the desired result of your action worth the possibility of a fight? Only you can decide.

Personally, I contrast the benefit of acting against the potential, worst-case scenario:
- Is it worth a lethal fight to stop a bum stealing a $1 lighter? Not for me.
- Is it worth a lethal fight to protect myself or my family? Absolutely.

Is not fighting macho? Nope. Will I go home safe? Yup. What is important to you?

The more you know about fighting and its aftermath (remember Zimmerman?), the more you will want to avoid a fight.

 

[cyberlogicx]

Say that he had a knife and pepper spray the shit out of him, then panic and call 911 screaming and crying for help.

 

[mikem317]

Most of these type of criminals don't want any attention. I would imagine that a "HEY! STOP!" would have made him stop, turn tail and run.

What was the outcome? Did he actually make off with it?

 

[Jason Flare]

If people are let off easily they are more likely to offend again. People shy away from actions that can lead to discomfort.

 

[chinalfr]

Keep in mind when making decisions to act or not:
1. that all altercations, no matter how simple, can escalate
2. there there is at least one gun at the scene (yours), perhaps more.
3. that even if the "bum" does not have a weapon, it does not mean that he can not employ force, including lethal force. Remember "hockey dad?"

Ask yourself: is the desired result of your action worth the possibility of a fight? Only you can decide.

Personally, I contrast the benefit of acting against the potential, worst-case scenario:
- Is it worth a lethal fight to stop a bum stealing a $1 lighter? Not for me.
- Is it worth a lethal fight to protect myself or my family? Absolutely.

Is not fighting macho? Nope. Will I go home safe? Yup. What is important to you?

The more you know about fighting and its aftermath (remember Zimmerman?), the more you will want to avoid a fight.

This is more like a aftermath thinking. I confronted the bum, but what if this escalated in a different direction? I was alone and family is not next to me.

This is what the bum trying to steal.

 

[MisterHappy]

Say that he had a knife and pepper spray the shit out of him, then panic and call 911 screaming and crying for help.

Who had the stuff? the bum, or the OP?

If it was the OP, I'd say that spraying a person that "tried" to steal (from the wording, it's unclear to me whether he got the light off) would be frowned upon by John Law.

If it was the bum, is getting sprayed, and knifed, and shooting the bum, over a light worth it?

Not talking about the morality of theft, but of practicalities. First, as an out-of-stater, you're already behind the eight ball; second, a "Free state" may still find defense of near-worthless property with (potentially) lethal force to be inappropriate.


For the next time: Yell, "Hey, bum! Get away from my bike."

1) he runs away - no problem
2) he continues to steal the light, then runs away - no real problem
3) he's hopped up on [insert drug of choice here] and comes for you - problem, regardless of outcome.

I'd guess that since he was a bum, as opposed to a gang-banger, possibilities 1 and 2 are most likely.

 

[Harpua]

Just blow your whistle next time.

 

[Davidk]

This is more like a aftermath thinking. I confronted the bum, but what if this escalated in a different direction? I was alone and family is not next to me.

No, this is precisely the thought process that you need to comprehend BEFORE you get into a confrontation. You need to decide what is worth getting into a fight to you before a situation presents itself. Afterthought is meaningless.

Your family might not have been with you at the time, but if things go astray, you may never be with your family again.

 

[Davidk]

Most of these type of criminals don't want any attention. I would imagine that a "HEY! STOP!" would have made him stop, turn tail and run.

More often than not, this is true, but that's the chance you take.

 

[StevieP]

Ugh - is that one of those blinky taillights the cyclists are using now?

Let him HAVE it! I think they're pharking obnoxious.

 

[Mass-diver]

Oc is perfect for situations like this.....I hate thieves!

 

[mike01824]

Did you have slugs or buckshot in the KSG? Or were you carrying the 500? If so, how hot were the loads?

But seriously, hindsight is 20/20 and you came out OK so I wouldn't get caught up in the details. You went with your initial reactions and everything ended fine.

 

[codenamepaul]

If you advocate allowing someone to make off with any of your property-regardless of the monetary value-you are doing nothing more than contributing to the behavior. That makes you part of the problem. Thank you for your help in the continuing degradation of our society.

Nefarious persons should be confronted at every opportunity. It is the only way to ensure that their behavior remains a risky proposition.

 

[71montess]

Just confront him am tell him to gtfooh and don't come back.

 

[chinalfr]

Just blow your whistle next time.

I do need one of this. Seems to be more effective than yelling "Help".

Sent from my Tinfoil hat

 

[frenchman]

Let him off? Not likely. Back home, we have a saying: " qui vole un oeuf, vole un boeuf", which means "one who steals an egg will steal a cattle ". Let him get away with your light once, and he will be back for the entire bike. Plus, I have a serious problem with people messing with my shit. I wouldn't let it come to a fight, a light is not worth a bruise or worse, but I'd certainly not just let t him take off with my stuff, regardless of the price of the item.
this said, I don't know if serious, but if so, we need to talk about that badge crap. Seriously.

 

[fencer]

Where you wearing spandex shorts etc at the time of the incident?

 

[Supermoto]

no one will miss a bum

 

[chinalfr]

Where you wearing spandex shorts etc at the time of the incident?

Wearing spandex might change some outcome as you can't CCW with spandex. No, I was wearing my NES hat with hiking attire. I was CCW with 2 killy cell phone where I was snapping pictures like a tourist.

Sent from my Tinfoil hat

Did you have slugs or buckshot in the KSG? Or were you carrying the 500? If so, how hot were the loads?

If I took Biden advice, I'll have the KSG loaded with buckshot. But I left both firearm in the safe.

 

[Palladin]

two in his head

 

[Twigg]

Ugh - is that one of those blinky taillights the cyclists are using now?

Let him HAVE it! I think they're pharking obnoxious.

...aaaaaand we're off...

 

[BigTimber]

I got off work one night to find a guy sitting in my car. When I walked up to the door and said what the f are you doing I got a take it easy bro, he got a size 11 in the face. I hope he learned the error of his way. Thieves get what they deserve. On another night a guy knocked a old lady to the ground while taking her purse. He ran right past me and 3 other guys working at the same place. The 2 guys I was with gave chase. After grabbing another guy to cover my spot I caught up to them where they caught the guy, needless to say he was having the worst night of his life I'd guess and was more than happy to be stuffed in the back of a BPD car when they showed.

 

[Rider]

This is a good reason why you should take a Rory Miller seminar or read his books.

Understanding when to use force and how to scale force given a situation are critical to surviving the aftermath of an encounter - both physically and legally.

@BigTimber - I'm not saying what you did was wrong(re:helping the old lady), but in many cases your employer would end up liable for you going after a bad guy, and you could end up getting fired and sued as well. This is, at least in part, why so many companies forbid weapons on site and/or advise you to comply or flee rather than get involved in altercations with robbers.

 

[BigTimber]

This is a good reason why you should take a Rory Miller seminar or read his books.

Understanding when to use force and how to scale force given a situation are critical to surviving the aftermath of an encounter - both physically and legally.

@BigTimber - I'm not saying what you did was wrong(re:helping the old lady), but in many cases your employer would end up liable for you going after a bad guy, and you could end up getting fired and sued as well. This is, at least in part, why so many companies forbid weapons on site and/or advise you to comply or flee rather than get involved in altercations with robbers.

They did not approve but this was a long time ago before I cared or had a family to think about, we were just a bunch of knucklehead doorman working at a bar in town. Today I say call the cops and let them do their job. However the old lady thing would still probably test my better judgement, some thing's you just can't let slide.

 

[binkleton]

If you advocate allowing someone to make off with any of your property-regardless of the monetary value-you are doing nothing more than contributing to the behavior. That makes you part of the problem. Thank you for your help in the continuing degradation of our society.

Nefarious persons should be confronted at every opportunity. It is the only way to ensure that their behavior remains a risky proposition.

This.
If something isn't done, what will change? That bum may decide it's OK to take whatever he wants. How would you feel if the next time he tried to steal something it was your Wife/GF/daughter that may be hurt in the confrontation?

 

[frenchman]

Yeah. Peter Parker let a guy get away once, and that same guy killed his uncle. With great power...

 

[Rider]

This.
If something isn't done, what will change? That bum may decide it's OK to take whatever he wants. How would you feel if the next time he tried to steal something it was your Wife/GF/daughter that may be hurt in the confrontation?

I don't disagree. However, you have to respond to a situation with appropriate force or else you face the consequences. Unfortunately, we don't live in a world where a (hu) man can just kill someone who assaults him or his family, and you can't cut the hand off of a thief. There will be serious consequences for you.

A big part of the reason our society has gone to hell is exactly because criminals know that they will not be punished, or that the punishment will be acceptable given the rewards. This is just as true of petty thieves as it is financial fraudsters.

Edit: another good example: Syria. The world, since WW I, has considered chemical warfare to be the most heinous abuse, and it has been globally banned for a century. Obama is going to try to make political capital for himself by letting the Republicans deny him the permission to strike, but the lesson for Assad, and other scumbags of e world, is that indeed, you can mass murder civilians with impunity and no one will do anything to you.

Meanwhile, Obama thinks disarming me is the top domestic priority.

 

[chinalfr]

Ugh - is that one of those blinky taillights the cyclists are using now?

Let him HAVE it! I think they're pharking obnoxious.

I like the blinky. Nobody mess with my blinky.

two in his head

I know about double tap. Not sure about triple tap would get extra assurance for the kill shot.

Sent from my Tinfoil hat

 

[josh2600]

Catch him and cut his right hand off with a hatchet. Cauterize it for him with a blowtorch or iron afterwards though, no need to be unnecessarily cruel or anything.