When did guns become evil?

[davemata]

Be careful. Not all liberals are anti-gun. That seems to be a common thread that runs through this board.

Seconded. I actually disdain the idea that gun usage has become so politicized. Liberty, Constitutional rights, and fresh meat aren't just for the left or the right.

 

[MagGus1820]

Be careful. Not all liberals are anti-gun. That seems to be a common thread that runs through this board.

While it may be true, you can't deny that a gun-toting liberal is few and far between. I know many hardcore liberals and they are scared to death of guns.

 

[lupis42]

While it may be true, you can't deny that a gun-toting liberal is few and far between. I know many hardcore liberals and they are scared to death of guns.

More of the liberals I know are pro-RKBA than anti. They see it as a civil rights issue.

 

[MagGus1820]

More of the liberals I know are pro-RKBA than anti. They see it as a civil rights issue.

Just because you know them doesn't make it the rule and not the exception. Are you going to argue that California and Massachusetts are pro-gun?

 

[lupis42]

Just because you know them doesn't make it the rule and not the exception.

Correct. See your previous post:

I know many hardcore liberals and they are scared to death of guns.

There are many people who are otherwise liberal, but support our second-amendment civil rights. Most of them are probably libertarian at heart, but haven't looked at economic issues clearly. Deliberately antagonizing them does not help them see things clearly.

 

[MagGus1820]

Correct. See your previous post:





There are many people who are otherwise liberal, but support our second-amendment civil rights. Most of them are probably libertarian at heart, but haven't looked at economic issues clearly. Deliberately antagonizing them does not help them see things clearly.

So you are saying that most liberals and places like California/Massachusetts are pro-gun? Weird then that towns like Brookline and Newton are red towns.

 

[lupis42]

So you are saying that most liberals and places like California/Massachusetts are pro-gun? Weird then that towns like Brookline and Newton are red towns.

No. I'm just saying that pro-gun liberals are no rarer than FUDDs, and they are extremely useful when attempting to win allies to RKBA issues. Antagonizing them and claiming they don't exist does not help that goal.

 

[MagGus1820]

No. I'm just saying that pro-gun liberals are no rarer than FUDDs, and they are extremely useful when attempting to win allies to RKBA issues. Antagonizing them and claiming they don't exist does not help that goal.

You will have to show me where I said they don't exist. I simply said they are the exception and not the rule.

 

[lupis42]

You will have to show me where I said they don't exist. I simply said they are the exception and not the rule.

You said they were few and far between.

While it may be true, you can't deny that a gun-toting liberal is few and far between.

I'm saying they aren't as rare as you seem to have assumed.

 

[MagGus1820]

You said they were few and far between.



I'm saying they aren't as rare as you seem to have assumed.

You know what, you're either not reading my posts or don't understand the words I type, so lets just let this one go. FYI Few and far between does not equal non-existent. If they weren't few and far between gun ownership in Brookline or the state of MA would be 40%. Its no where near that.

 

[Cato]

There are really two different questions being mixed together here. First we have the original question asked by the OP of when did guns become evil. The other issue mixed in to the discussion is the history and causes of gun control from the 1930s until the GCA of 1968.

The Kennedy assassinations seem to be the obvious answer to one or maybe even both of the questions. But I do believe that assuming that the primary cause behind these issues was due to the Kennedys being shot is an oversimplification.

Gun control along with numerous proposed bills were discussed in congress from the 1920s to 1968 and continues to the present. The roots of the the GCA of 1968 predates the JFK assassination and the final bill was pretty much complete by 1965. However, the Martin Luther King and Robert Kennedy killings probably helped congress to act on the bill and get it done.

Another thing to consider is the increased violence in the country during the 1960s accompanied by the sales of handguns quadrupling. Some here might recall the urban riots in the mid sixties. Gun violence also increased a lot during this period. During the period of 1964-1968, gun homicide in the United States had increased 89 per cent, while homicide by all other means had increased 22 percent(1). These issues also probably helped congress to pass the bill 1968 with little opposition.

So when did guns become evil? I would say in was also in the 1960s largely due to the almost complete detachment from reality of the 60s generation. Many if not most of this peace and love generation have escaped reality permanently and it was back then that they started to associate guns with the cause of violence and applied almost human characteristics to firearms.

The people from this lost generation are at the age now that they hold many leadership positions in this country in both the public and private sectors. They continue to govern from la-la land and continue to attach human traits such as "evil" to firearms.



1. F.B.I., Uniform Crime Reports.

 

[calsdad]

Yes Gun Control Act of 1968 was the turning point on gun control.

Wrong.

It goes back to well before that.

The 1930's was when real gun control started to come into effect. The $200 tax on "machine guns" was put into effect in the 30's - that was when $200 was real money. The cost of a Thompson submachine gun in 1928 for instance - was $225.00 - so a $200 tax was in effect a doubling of the price. That is in effect - a ban.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thompson_submachine_gun

In 1928 Federal Laboratories took over distribution of the weapon from Thompson's Auto Ordnance Corporation.[20] The cost at this time was US$225 per weapon, with $5 per 50 round drum and $3 for 20 round magazine.[20]

In 1926 the Cutts Compensator (a recoil brake) was offered as an option for the M1921; Thompsons with the compensator were catalogued as No. 21AC at the original price of $200.00, with the plain M1921 designated No. 21A at a reduced price of $175.00.[21]

Firearm control acts from the 1930's forbade sawed off shotguns , and put federal controls on machine guns and other "dangerous devices":

http://www.answers.com/topic/guns-and-gun-control

In 1911, after an attempt to assassinate the mayor of New York City, the New York legislature passed the Sullivan Law, which required a police permit for both owning and carrying a pistol. Support for the law ranged from the New York Times and idealistic reformers to Tammany Hall political hacks like its author, Tim Sullivan. (He was trying to give police a way to frame his enemies. One political opponent had all his pockets sewn closed after three arrests for carrying guns without a permit.) Few states, however, followed New York's lead. In forty-five of them, unlicensed pistol ownership remains legal except for persons with criminal records or the insane.

Over the next thirty years most states adopted various forms of the National Revolver Act, a law largely drafted by the National Rifle Association. It established a permit system to regulate carrying concealed weapons. In some states, the law allowed the issuing authority to reject applications without a reason. Their guidelines were vague phrases such as "good character, public safety, or need." Elsewhere, license denial must be for clearly defined causes, such as a history of crime, alcoholism, insanity, or drug abuse.

In the late 1930s federal controls were imposed on machine guns, sawed-off guns, and other dangerous devices by the National Firearms acts. The Gun Control Act of 1968 forbade the sale of guns by mail or to out-of-state residents and placed restrictions on ammunition sales. The Firearms Owner's Protection Act of 1987 repealed federal restrictions on ammunition sales and out-of-state sales of rifles and shotguns because they had proven to have no crime reduction value. It also provided for the legal transportation by interstate travelers of "unloaded and inaccessible" guns regardless of local restrictions.

Go pick up some books by Vin Suprynowic or Boston T. Party's "Boston's Gun Bible". They lay it all out pretty clearly.

 

[travis]

I think you guys have started a little late in the time line. Firearms where called evil ( or considered that way ) from the first one. Any tool that creates change is was and probably always will be labeled by some to be evil. When the first firearm was made probably in China a very long long time ago the guy told his wife to come look at this. I would be willing to bet she told him something like "That evil thing is going to get you killed". Just me guess but I bet I am close.

 

[GunGrey]

I think you guys have started a little late in the time line. Firearms where called evil ( or considered that way ) from the first one. Any tool that creates change is was and probably always will be labeled by some to be evil. When the first firearm was made probably in China a very long long time ago the guy told his wife to come look at this. I would be willing to bet she told him something like "That evil thing is going to get you killed". Just me guess but I bet I am close.

So a longbow is evil also

 

[atmay]

About the time that Daddy left to fight the big war
I saw my first pistol in the general store
In the general store, when I was thirteen
Thought it was the finest thing I ever had seen

So l asked if I could have one when I grew up
Mama dropped a dozen eggs, she really blew up
She really blew up and I didn't understand
Mama said the pistol is the devil's right hand
She really blew up and I didn't understand
Mama said the pistol is the devil's right hand
The devil's right hand, the devil's right hand
Mama said the pistol is the devil's right hand

My very first pistol was a cap and ball Colt
Shoot as fast as lightnin' but it loads a mite slow
Loads a mite slow and i soon found out
It can get you into trouble but it can't get you out
So then I went and bought myself a Colt 45
Called a peacemaker but I never knew why
Never knew why, I didn't understand
Cause Mama said the pistol is the devil's right hand
Never knew why, I didn't understand
Cause Mama said the pistol is the devil's right hand
The devil's right hand, the devil's right hand
Mama said the pistol is the devil's right hand

Well I get into a card game in a company town
Caught a miner cheating I shot the dog down
Shot the dog down, watched the dog fall
Never touched his holster, never had a chance to draw
The trial was in the morning and they drug me out of bed
Asked me how I pleaded, not guilty I said
Not guilty I said, you've got the wrong man
Nothing touched the trigger but the devil's right hand
Not guilty I said, you've got the wrong man
Nothing touched the trigger but the devil's right hand
the devil's right hand, the devil's right hand
Nothing touched the trigger but the devil's right hand

 

[travis]

So a longbow is evil also

Yes as is anything new and different. Tv, radio, newspapers everything. It someone made someone else called it evil for one reason or another. Anyone who thinks any inanimate is evil has problems.