Who here concealed carries a semi-auto w light?

[Cuda444]

As the topic says, I'm looking to upgrade my carry rig, and I'm thinking about adding a permanently attached light. So far I'm leaning towards the Glock 19 with either a TLR-1 or Surefire X300... more than likely in one of the new Comp-tac CTAC holsters for no other reason other than I've been happy with their products in the past.

So my question to all of you is this:

What's your setup? Who makes your CCW holster? Are you happy with it? Issues? Things you wish you did differently? etc

Thanks in advance for the input.

 

[Len-2A Training]

I want to give you some things to think about.

- We learn NOT to point a gun at anything we aren't willing to destroy, right?

- If the light is attached to the gun, by definition we must point it at someone/something to IDENTIFY who/what is there. If it is a "friendly" we just put them at risk and I guarantee that no DA or PD is going to appreciate our reasons for doing so. [NOTE: Police can get away with this due to the nature of their job, but if a civilian points a gun at someone, it damn well better be a response to life/limb or you are toast in the legal system (civil, criminal or both).]

- Therefore, my answer is to always carry a flashlight on my belt to use to light up the situation. The gun would only come out in dire circumstances if there really was a threat. I like the Harries technique personally.

YMMV

As for holsters:

- Brommeland for OWB
- Milt Sparks VMII for IWB
- Milt Sparks Summer Special 2 for easily removed IWB

 

[M1911]

deleted

I'm tired of this argument.

 

[atmay]

For CC, I would also recommend NOT using an attached light. I carry a flashlight all the time, even when I don't have a handgun on me.

Like LenS, I practice the Harries method, as well as a little bit of FBI (which, while outdated, transitions well in and out of Harries, and is good for moving the light around without moving the gun).

That being said, Raven Concealment makes a good holster, and can make holsters for most of the popular pistol-mounted lights. Bad news is they have a 3-4mo wait at the moment.

 

[whatluck]

The advantage of having a separate flashlight is that they make great impact weapons, which you are more likely to need to employ than a firearm.

 

[ZenShooter]

The advice above is good. An attached light means pointing your gun at things you don't necessarily intend to shoot. Not a good plan. For detached flashlights, as a Weaver stance shooter, I like the Harries technique, though I also practice with the modified FBI and Neck Index holds. There's a pretty good overview of the options here: http://www.nrapublications.org/si/HB_handgun.html

 

[drgrant]

The biggest problem with carrying a gun that has a light on it is it is going to make your holster fat as hell.

It'll probably make it look like you are carrying around a VHS cassette tape in your pants.

A lot of lights also increase the OAL of the whole package, so now your gun is longer, just because it has a light on it.

-Mike

 

[Underwhere]

I'll have to disagree with you guys.

If I am carrying concealed, then my gun comes out only when I do intend to destroy something on the muzzle end.

And I'm not sure how many of you guys have actually practiced shooting with a flashlight in one hand vs a gun mounted light.
You will find that your ability to shoot reliably and quickly are diminished by a ton. Not just by a little bit. If you haven't practiced shooting in pitch black with a flashlight then I suggest you try it before you go out on the street thinking you are prepared to do so.

Holding a flashlight in one hand essentially means you are shooting 1 handed...and you all should know how effective that is.
If you try and transition your light and weak hand to go to a modified 2 hand hold, then you'd know that it isn't the best grip and it requires some serious dexterity, often resulting in mag releases, lights turning off etc in practice...not to mention a ton of confusion when expected things do happen.

I wouldn't have any objections to carrying a light on my carry gun. The only issue I'd have is how to conceal it. It gets really bulky.

 

[Cuda444]

I should have known this would almost immediately degrade into a "this is a bad idea because..." thread.

Allow me to clarify:

I carry a flashlight on me most of the time (more often than I carry a handgun anyway) and I understand the notion of pointing a gun at someone because the light is attached blah blah blah. And the notion of identifying your target and whats beyond... I get it. All of it. I've weighed these options. I've also been through a good amount of pretty extensive training in the use of force, use of light both attached and hand held, night shooting, etc. I'm beyond familiar with the Harries and FBI and Ayoob, AND Surefire etc etc. In my opinion they all suck. They don't work for me. They diminish my ability to put fast and accurate rounds on target; and I've trained and tried all of these extensively. The last thing I want to be doing when the fan is spraying the stinky stuff, is be fumbling for my gun AND the flashlight in my pocket. I'm not saying I'm some elite operator, but this isn't my first rodeo, either. So, while I do agree that the advice above is sound advice, and I do appreciate the input, I'm interested in what people are using.

Here is my rationale for having my CCW w/ a permanently attached light:
While I own more than one handgun, I like the idea of having one I use and abuse to carry AND for home defense AND for training. That said, I'd rather train with the light on it, carry with the light on it, and god forbid some assbag comes into my house or accosts me on the street, shoot with the light on it. I have no interest in taking the "nightstand gun" and putting it away for the day, taking out my "day time" CCW and strapping it on, then repeating the opposite when I get home. I'm thinking more "One gun to do all of my defense duties" And with all of that said, while I carry a flashlight in my pocket almost daily, when the shat hits the proverbial fan, Murphy says "that light in your pocket is going to fail" then what? This is about redundancy, continuity of training, and damn it, I just want to try it.

If the general consensus is that no one here carries a CCW with a mounted light, then so be it, I'll be the odd ball out and be happy about it

 

[Underwhere]

Just out of curiosity, how many of you guys actually practice shooting in no-light with a flashlight in their other hand?

 

[Terminator03]

The biggest problem with carrying a gun that has a light on it is it is going to make your holster fat as hell.

It'll probably make it look like you are carrying around a VHS cassette tape in your pants.

A lot of lights also increase the OAL of the whole package, so now your gun is longer, just because it has a light on it.

-Mike

this reminds me of that thread from a couple of weeks back where the op was talking about how his gun made him look fat while dressing to impress the ladies.

 

[Cuda444]

Just out of curiosity, how many of you guys actually practice shooting in no-light with a flashlight in their other hand?

**Raises hand** It sucks. Haha.

 

[ChevyGuy91]

Sometimes, in the colder season when I am wearing a heavy coat, I will carry my 1911 with TLR-1 in a Peters Custom Spada OWB holster. But there is no way I would even try that in the summer time.

 

[atmay]

Just out of curiosity, how many of you guys actually practice shooting in no-light with a flashlight in their other hand?

I practice shooting with a flashlight every chance I get. Dry fire, during the day, and at night. I also shoot one-handed (w/o the light) regularly.



I should also mention, as far as my own SOP; the flashlight is ALWAYS in hand if I'm outside after dark. I practice drawing with the flashlight in hand, as well as already presented.

 

[M1911]

Just out of curiosity, how many of you guys actually practice shooting in no-light with a flashlight in their other hand?

I do on occasion. I agree with you -- it sucks compared to a weapon-mounted light.

 

[ZenShooter]

Just out of curiosity, how many of you guys actually practice shooting in no-light with a flashlight in their other hand?

I'll raise my hand too. It's not fun. Actually, I practice lots and lots of one-hand shooting with each hand, so at least for the night stuff I'm really just focused on getting the flashlight pointed where I want it. The rest is muscle memory.

Of course this is all theory. I've never had to go into pitch black with a gun in one hand and a flashlight in the other. Hope I never do.

 

[wolf223]

Just out of curiosity, how many of you guys actually practice shooting in no-light with a flashlight in their other hand?

it's kinda wierd.

also with Night Vision too

as for the tac-light on a ccw... i don't think it's practical per se... but do find it can be useful in low-light / confined space situations... for "EDC" - not my cup of tea.

i carry a gun and spare mag - keep it simple stupid. flashlight? sure, in the car, go bag, a couple around the house...

 

[william_munny]

i carry a gun and spare mag - keep it simple stupid. flashlight? sure, in the car, go bag, a couple around the house...

Nice, I'm not the only one who leaves his light in the car.

ETA: It's funny, because this came up at work today.

Coworker: Do you have a flashlight?
Me: Yeah, it's in my car, one sec...
Coworker: I have one in my car! What kind of IT guy doesn't have a flashlight?
Me: I do, it's downstairs...
Coworker: What if you were working on servers, and you needed a light to see something?
Me: I suppose I would go outside and get it out of my car...

 

[Cuda444]

it's kinda wierd.

also with Night Vision too

as for the tac-light on a ccw... i don't think it's practical per se... but do find it can be useful in low-light / confined space situations... for "EDC" - not my cup of tea.

i carry a gun and spare mag - keep it simple stupid. flashlight? sure, in the car, go bag, a couple around the house...

Generally, I agree 100% Keep it simple, keep other useful tools near by. Like I said, I'm interested to hear the pros and cons from those who run that type of set up, and ultimately, I will probably end up trying it myself, if for nothing other than grins.

 

[Underwhere]

I practice shooting with a flashlight every chance I get. Dry fire, during the day, and at night.

It's difficult to find a place where you can practice live fire in no-light situations...but I think you'll find it completely different than dry firing.

I do on occasion. I agree with you -- it sucks compared to a weapon-mounted light.

Ever try and change mags holding a flashlight in one hand and a gun in the other? It's pretty funny to try.
I'm sure I have some videos of me and others cursing in pitch black doing so.

I'll raise my hand too. It's not fun. Actually, I practice lots and lots of one-hand shooting with each hand, so at least for the night stuff I'm really just focused on getting the flashlight pointed where I want it. The rest is muscle memory.

Of course this is all theory. I've never had to go into pitch black with a gun in one hand and a flashlight in the other. Hope I never do.

It's interesting because most people I know will take their flashlight and point it where they look...and guess what? Their gun naturally points where they look too. Having your flashlight and eyes pointed one way, and holding your gun in a different direction really doesn't do you a whole lot of good...and what about safe direction then? If you can't look where your gun is pointed because you're following your flashlight is that safe?

In my experience, getting your flashlight pointed where you want it is a very low priority. It is one of the things I see many shooters struggle with and waste a ton of time with. Even a flashlight pointed at the floor in most cases will give you enough light to acquire your target and shoot it.

When I shoot in low light, all I concentrate on is to get the flashlight on and pointed in some direction forward. I don't care if it's on the floor or the ceiling. I want my first shot to be quick...with a flashlight you are a beacon in the dark.

 

[M1911]

Ever try and change mags holding a flashlight in one hand and a gun in the other? It's pretty funny to try.
I'm sure I have some videos of me and others cursing in pitch black doing so.

I've recently started shooting my S&W Model 66 in IDPA. Ever try shooting a DA revolver with a flashlight and then reloading with speedloaders? Lots of amusement for the crowd.

I have found that the thinness of my Quark AA2 makes it easier to use than my old Surefire 6P. But I still suck with it.

 

[ChevyGuy91]

Ever try and change mags holding a flashlight in one hand and a gun in the other? It's pretty funny to try. I'm sure I have some videos of me and others cursing in pitch black doing so.

I remember shooting an IDPA match at Harvard trying to reload a 1911 in pitch black with a flash light in my hand. That was a hoot. I went scatter-brain and lost all memory of what I was doing and wound up racking the slide twice and losing 2 rounds. It's not just shooting with a light, its manipulating the gun as well.

 

[Cuda444]

It's difficult to find a place where you can practice live fire in no-light situations...but I think you'll find it completely different than dry firing.


Ever try and change mags holding a flashlight in one hand and a gun in the other? It's pretty funny to try.
I'm sure I have some videos of me and others cursing in pitch black doing so.


It's interesting because most people I know will take their flashlight and point it where they look...and guess what? Their gun naturally points where they look too.

In my experience, getting your flashlight pointed where you want it is a very low priority. It is one of the things I see many shooters struggle with and waste a ton of time with. Even a flashlight pointed at the floor in most cases will give you enough light to acquire your target and shoot it.

The only "smooth" way I've come up with you accomplish this is to drop down to one or both knees, tuck the light between your legs or behind your knee (keep in mind, ideally the light is off during all this, but I'm sure under stress this will happen naturally) change mags, re-grip handheld light, turn it on, and re-engage. What could go wrong?

Amazing how that happens, especially under stress, eh?

This statement proves to me that Underwhere has actually gone out and practiced these techniques, seen the results of physically shooting in the dark with a light, and/or taken a low light class

Well said, sir.

 

[Underwhere]

I've recently started shooting my S&W Model 66 in IDPA. Ever try shooting a DA revolver with a flashlight and then reloading with speedloaders? Lots of amusement for the crowd.

I have found that the thinness of my Quark AA2 makes it easier to use than my old Surefire 6P. But I still suck with it.

I have lots of respect for you.
I am terrified to shoot a revo in IDPA. I just bought an 686 SSR for that reason but I have yet to get up the guts to do it.

I remember shooting an IDPA match at Harvard trying to reload a 1911 in pitch black with a flash light in my hand. That was a hoot. I lost all memory of what I was doing and wound up racking the slide twice and losing 2 rounds. It's not just shooting with a light, its manipulating the gun as well.

I think I've done the exact same. It's really easy for people here to think they are useful with a flashlight in one hand and a gun in the other...but until they try it they won't have any idea just how hard it really is.

It is really funny for spectators because they can literally see the exact moment when shooters go "WTF is happening" and their their mind goes blank.

 

[ChevyGuy91]

It is really funny for spectators because they can literally see the exact moment when shooters go "WTF is happening" and their their mind goes blank.

Yeap, and the loud "AWWW SH!T!" helps illustrate that as well.

 

[M1911]

Using the handgrip on my Quark AA2 makes it easier to reload while holding the light, but it slows down acquiring the light because I have to get my fingers between the grip and the light:

 

[M1911]

I have lots of respect for you.
I am terrified to shoot a revo in IDPA. I just bought an 686 SSR for that reason but I have yet to get up the guts to do it.

Give it a try. It's a hoot. I'm slow as molasses, but I'm having fun. I made up some cartridges with no powder or primer so I can practice my reloads (yes, I put some orange paint on the bullets for safety so I don't mix them up with live rounds).

 

[Underwhere]

The only "smooth" way I've come up with you accomplish this is to drop down to one or both knees, tuck the light between your legs or behind your knee (keep in mind, ideally the light is off during all this, but I'm sure under stress this will happen naturally) change mags, re-grip handheld light, turn it on, and re-engage. What could go wrong?

This statement proves to me that Underwhere has actually gone out and practiced these techniques, seen the results of physically shooting in the dark with a light, and/or taken a low light class

Well said, sir.

When I broke my finger and attended a match I did actually try and do the "knee tuck" with my gun so that I could do a one handed reload. I gotta say that it required a TON of dexterity and about a day's worth of mental rehearsal to accomplish it. I wouldn't want to try it in real life under the gun.

As far as going out and practicing it. All IDPA competitors practice it. In my practice I've learned I never want to do it in real life. If I had a choice of a flashlight in hand, or a flashlight on gun I would choose the gun-mounted light 100 times over.

 

[endus]

Interesting comments in here. All these IDPA stories make me want to try it.

I try to practice shooting one handed (both strong and weak hand) every time I go to the range. I ought to start practicing shooting while holding one of my flashlights as well. Shooting in the dark would be a wild scene. I'd like to try that (under controlled circumstances obviously) someday.

 

[Underwhere]

Give it a try. It's a hoot. I'm slow as molasses, but I'm having fun.

I haven't been able to shoot much in the past few months but I told myself I'd make SSP Master before I go to a wheel gun.
Not too many opportunities to do that. Maybe next week at Nationals but I think the last time I shot anything was over a month ago maybe.

If you hear 6 slow bangs, a click and then a Chinaman swearing at the next match, it's a good chance it's me.