AR15's - Who makes the best ones and why?

[flintoid]

Is there a disadvantage to having "too much gas" ? I'd guess too much is better than too little.... and even in "too much", you could have some kind of a gas block regulator.... IIRC there are a few of these on the market, now... some seem oriented towards can users (like the noveske switchblock) and I think JP or some other hi brow company makes one, too.
-Mike

Yes. Try ripping off the rims of your spent cases and leaving the body in the chamber. I've seen an AK do this and I'm positive that an AR-15 can do the same (the AK eventually sheared off rivet heads of the rear trunnion). You could possibly go with a heavier buffer, but I think that's acting too late in the function cycle to affect this- so a gas regulator like you mentioned comes to mind.

You don't really want to put parts through pressures/forces that they weren't designed to handle. I wonder if anyone has had a gas tube rupture on them on a over gassed AR?

 

[Supermoto]

I had wondered about this too. The only time I've ever seen gas port size mentioned by most vendors was for SBR uppers, especially the really short ones.

Is there a disadvantage to having "too much gas" ? I'd guess too much is better than too little.... and even in "too much", you could have some kind of a gas block regulator.... IIRC there are a few of these on the market, now... some seem oriented towards can users (like the noveske switchblock) and I think JP or some other hi brow company makes one, too.

-Mike

An over gassed gun will have extraction and wear issues, the bolt will try to unlock before the case has a chance to constrict, leading the case head separation, extractor jumping the rim, failure to extract. It also makes the gun very harsh to shoot.
I had a Remsport 14.5 barrel with a .099 gas hole, spec is .063. The gun would constantly leave rounds in the chamber, had few separation also. Added a black insert and heavier spring, which helped some. But ejection was very violent, cases were being thrown very far forward and you could feel the BCG carrier slamming back. I added a adjustable gas block and pigtail gas tube, within a few weeks, the gas pressure had eroded through the gas block and was shooting out the side into my had, the gun kept running, I just couldn't hold on to it any more. A week later the Bolt from that gun cracked at the cam pin hole.

Adjustable gas block work very well when the gas port is properly sized and you have made modification to the BCG or buffer to speed cycling and now want to remove the harshness.

 

[Terminator03]

An over gassed gun will have extraction and wear issues, the bolt will try to unlock before the case has a chance to constrict, leading the case head separation, extractor jumping the rim, failure to extract. It also makes the gun very harsh to shoot.
I had a Remsport 14.5 barrel with a .099 gas hole, spec is .063. The gun would constantly leave rounds in the chamber, had few separation also. Added a black insert and heavier spring, which helped some. But ejection was very violent, cases were being thrown very far forward and you could feel the BCG carrier slamming back. I added a adjustable gas block and pigtail gas tube, within a few weeks, the gas pressure had eroded through the gas block and was shooting out the side into my had, the gun kept running, I just couldn't hold on to it any more. A week later the Bolt from that gun cracked at the cam pin hole.

Adjustable gas block work very well when the gas port is properly sized and you have made modification to the BCG or buffer to speed cycling and now want to remove the harshness.

I would have made Remsport fix that if it was out of spec before I spent any money trying to compensate for the oversize hole. Did you talk to Jon at all about the problem?

 

[Supermoto]

Remsport said they drill it to .09 for reliability They sent me a new barrel which I promptly sold

 

[drgrant]

Yes. Try ripping off the rims of your spent cases and leaving the body in the chamber. I've seen an AK do this and I'm positive that an AR-15 can do the same (the AK eventually sheared off rivet heads of the rear trunnion). You could possibly go with a heavier buffer, but I think that's acting too late in the function cycle to affect this- so a gas regulator like you mentioned comes to mind.

An over gassed gun will have extraction and wear issues, the bolt will try to unlock before the case has a chance to constrict, leading the case head separation, extractor jumping the rim, failure to extract. It also makes the gun very harsh to shoot.
I had a Remsport 14.5 barrel with a .099 gas hole, spec is .063. The gun would constantly leave rounds in the chamber, had few separation also. Added a black insert and heavier spring, which helped some. But ejection was very violent, cases were being thrown very far forward and you could feel the BCG carrier slamming back. I added a adjustable gas block and pigtail gas tube, within a few weeks, the gas pressure had eroded through the gas block and was shooting out the side into my had, the gun kept running, I just couldn't hold on to it any more. A week later the Bolt from that gun cracked at the cam pin hole.

Adjustable gas block work very well when the gas port is properly sized and you have made modification to the BCG or buffer to speed cycling and now want to remove the harshness.

Thanks for the responses, guys...

I guess that answers that pretty well. So there is such a thing as too much- even to a point where it will damage a gas block... damn. Then again, kind of makes sense.. . the pressure is still pretty damn high in there, even a tiny increase in the size of the hole might make for a dramatic increase in gas pressure.

-Mike

 

[Terminator03]

Remsport said they drill it to .09 for reliability They sent me a new barrel which I promptly sold

What's funny is that increasing the orifice sizing should increase the volume of gas, but the pressure should actually be less, so it is a bit confusing to me now that I think about it. Good to know that .09 is their standard size, and wasn't just a machining error, I suppose. I was actually considering getting some AR stuff from them, so this is good info to have.

 

[cekim]

What's funny is that increasing the orifice sizing should increase the volume of gas, but the pressure should actually be less, so it is a bit confusing to me now that I think about it. Good to know that .09 is their standard size, and wasn't just a machining error, I suppose. I was actually considering getting some AR stuff from them, so this is good info to have.

Since the hole is much smaller than the rest of the gas system, this is not going to be the case. The volume of the gas system is roughly the same in the big and small hole case (as the volume of the gas hole itself is relatively small compared to the volume of the gas tube, gas block, etc...).

There is an excess of pressure (vast) on the other side of that hole (in the barrel). Bigger hole is going to blow more gas back through the tube.

 

[Supermoto]

Thanks for the responses, guys...

I guess that answers that pretty well. So there is such a thing as too much- even to a point where it will damage a gas block... damn. Then again, kind of makes sense.. . the pressure is still pretty damn high in there, even a tiny increase in the size of the hole might make for a dramatic increase in gas pressure.

-Mike

Here is a good read on how pressure and timing effect the reliability of the AR

http://ar15barrels.com/prod/operation.shtml

 

[Rick1987]

Yep

The link on the spreadsheet. I wish I saw this earlier, looks like they did all their homework.

That's it. Everything you need to know.

 

[JFR2]

Individualist wins Post-of-the-Year!

His post needs to be a sticky!

-JR

 

[GunGrey]

We all know that oly's are hands down the best ARs on the market, even if it fails you can use it as a club........see its now two weapons


Try and do that with a DD, Colt all they can do is shoot.

 

[schnips]

+1 for Individualist! I'm loving this thread so far.

 

[sLpFhaWK]

Gotta go with "the chart" myself. Some just do it better.

Could someone tell me how to understand this chart? I'm guessing Blue X's are a good thing. lol

 

[atmay]

Could someone tell me how to understand this chart? I'm guessing Blue X's are a good thing. lol

Yes. The Blue X's are good things. Whoever posted the link to the chart also posted the link to brief explanations of each item.

 

[sLpFhaWK]

Yes. The Blue X's are good things. Whoever posted the link to the chart also posted the link to brief explanations of each item.

Very good, i saw the 2nd link was to google and didnt click it. nut now i'll do some more reading.

 

[sLpFhaWK]

so im going to remsport on saturday for a custom build. im pretty excited!

 

[Supermoto]

You didn't read this thread, did you?

 

[ChevyGuy91]

You didn't read this thread, did you?

Does anybody really ever?

 

[Individualist]

Guys I fixed the problem with the URL to the post I added. The author, Architect, is the AR guru, and a real helpful guy if you want some additional advice.

 

[WaldoOneFive]

Yes. The Blue X's are good things. Whoever posted the link to the chart also posted the link to brief explanations of each item.

Reading the first few pages of a thread is too much for you isn't it?

 

[atmay]

Reading the first few pages of a thread is too much for you isn't it?

Oh, sorry. You were the "whoever", weren't you? I remembered seeing the post, but not who posted it!


Now how many little blue X's does remsport get, do you suppose?

 

[WaldoOneFive]

Oh, sorry. You were the "whoever", weren't you? I remembered seeing the post, but not who posted it!


Now how many little blue X's does remsport get, do you suppose?

One, on the section that says: "spams every person's thread any time someone asks anything AR related"

 

[atmay]

One, on the section that says: "spams every person's thread any time someone asks anything AR related"

He hasn't posted in here though, has he?


On a serious note, though, it would be interesting to get that information from John to see how his technical specs compare to the other companies.

 

[JFR2]

it would be interesting to get that information from John to see how his technical specs compare to the other companies.

This.
I almost feel like taking that list and a pen to Ludlow. I'm looking to build an AR soon and I'd like to buy from a local shop. I know affection for John/Remsport runs hot and cold for some folks.

-JR

 

[Individualist]

Hey crazymjb. I read that Spikes has a nice Nickel Boron coated BCG. Supposed to be pretty smooth and indestructible. Know anything about it?

 

[xring]

I'm far from an expert but I trained on a Colt so I bought a Colt. I shoot an A-2, H-BAR, Sporter with a 20 inch bbl. Everything is stock except a small picatinny rail with a light mounted on the fore end. I've shot every conceivable hand load out of it without a single dissapointment.
One day I'll add a 16" flat top upper.
Had it for 18 years and never had a single problem.

 

[sLpFhaWK]

i actually read the thread yes. i seen the chart too but people have had good experiences with them and i like the idea of a local shop who hands out a warranty with every rifle they build. im not a rich man so i cant afford a $3,000 rifle from an expensive company even if its made from the best parts. its going to be a range gun thats it. im not going to compete with it or anything serious like that. i have my budget and hopefully i can get exactly what i want within that budget. it doesnt need to be stamped colt to be reliable. if i buy it and its a POS then you live and learn, and ive always learned the hard way.

people get so caught up with brand names that they forget the same people who make parts for colt and bcm etc also make parts that arent stamped with that logo and are made the same exact way and are just as reliable for 25% cheaper sometimes more. who do u think makes those walgreens AA batteries? prolly duracell (i dont really know just guessing) but you see my point.

as always thanks for the input but some of you people really need to relax.

 

[drgrant]

i actually read the thread yes. i seen the chart too but people have had good experiences with them and i like the idea of a local shop who hands out a warranty with every rifle they build. im not a rich man so i cant afford a $3,000 rifle from an expensive company even if its made from the best parts.

You don't have to spend anywhere near 3K for a superb rifle.

its going to be a range gun thats it. im not going to compete with it or anything serious like that.

Then why not just pick up an M&P and be done with it? Usually their rifles are halfway decent. I won't pass judgement about remsport, although what Supermoto said about his old one in this thread doesn't exactly want to make me run out and buy one anytime soon, well, that and the incessant near-spamming.

people get so caught up with brand names that they forget the same people who make parts for colt and bcm etc also make parts that arent stamped with that logo and are made the same exact way and are just as reliable for 25% cheaper sometimes more. who do u think makes those walgreens AA batteries? prolly duracell (i dont really know just guessing) but you see my point.

Poor analogy. So you're going to tell us that all the barrels and bolt carriers on the market are the same? (among other things).....

i have my budget and hopefully i can get exactly what i want within that budget. it doesnt need to be stamped colt to be reliable. if i buy it and its a POS then you live and learn, and ive always learned the hard way.

Learning the hard way by buying the wrong gun, sucks. Having albatrosses in the safe, sucks. Been there, done that, got the t-shirt... you end up wasting more money in the long run once you factor in aggravation, time wasted testing, etc. Buy once, cry only once.

-Mike

 

[jaymce]

The chart is great but not the end all be all. It is a good aid in deciding what rifle to buy. The chart is a good place to look for an out of the box rifle and know what you are buying. There are plenty of custom builders that are not on the chart. Chances are if you are looking for a high end custom AR the chart will do you little good. Also the chart will act as a good check list. If you buy a second teir AR with out a staked BCG the you can tear it down and stake or at least check that area.

Quality does not always cost that much more either.

For example here is an M&P 15 from Buds for 834$ (http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/55424)

To set up the same rifle from LMT you are looking @ 995 (330$ lower + 485$ Upper + 130$ BCG and throw in another 50$ for forearm etc). 150$ may be worth that piece of mind.

The end result is the best rifle is the one that will do what you need it to do, when you need it to do it, at the price that fits your budget.

 

[sLpFhaWK]

Again Ty guys for your input. I'm going on Saturday just to check things out and if things look good then I'll follow through and if not I'll go another route. One persons bad experience doesn't ruin something for me so we will see.