buying a boat...

[Hiltonizer]

so, a few years ago I bought a pair of kayaks, one for me and one for the wife... mine a Cobra Fish and Dive for the purposes to getting me to the fish in freshwater... hers is just a basic sit-top so she can read and get sun while I fish....

however, freshwater yak fishing is beginning to bore me... and I haven't landed a REAL fish since I used to surf cast for Stripers with my uncle back when I was in high school... plus a few charter trips to deep sea.

I started to shore cast again this year with no success, several places in the Newburyport area in quest of the Stripers catches of old. I'd rather be on a boat.

So, after a month of cruising craigslist, I found a good deal on an entry level boat... 17' starcraft bow rider with an i/o (2.3l 135hp i4)... I was curious how versatile you experienced boaters would find this. I know I'm not doing any Tuna trips with it, but it'd be nice to hit a few dog fish and cod/pollock/haddock when the Stripers and Blues aren't biting.

Is this big enough to get me out there far enough? how far do I need to go to hook up with Mackeral, Dogfish and Cod on boring days? Not asking for coords, unless you'd be so kind as to PM them to me

Any other info you'd give a noobie on his first boat purchase? I have a 2007 F150 with a 4.6 and 4x4 so trailering isn't a problem.

 

[LT1MCSS]

17' is really small for the ocean IMO. Sure it can get you out there but only on real good weather days. A bow rider in the ocean is also a very bad idea espcially in that small of a boat. You are likely to take water over the bow if you get in any kind of a sea. A few good waves over the bow and it may not come back up. Even heavy boat traffic could be a problem since your liable to take waves from every direction at that point. Being in the ocean you just never know. The water changes almost instantly at times.

Really a good entry level boat for the ocean is a 21-23' cuddy cabin or center console. I would hold out for a boat that size if you can. Let the 17' bow riders stay on the lakes.

I know people that have taken the small boats like that out but they have all had close calls even staying close to shore. IMO its just not worth the gamble.

 

[M1911]

I agree with LT1. That is a lake boat that isn't suitable for the ocean. If you want a small boat for salt water fishing, get a 20-23' cuddy cabin or center console. Also, the mouth of the Merrimack is often very challenging in a small boat -- not the place for a bow rider.

 

[offcamber]

FIRST THING Go take the Coast Guard Auxiliary Boating Class. I agree the 17' bow rider isn't a ocean boat. Keep it in the lakes and rivers.
I'm ex-Coast Guard if that means anything to you...

Good luck and be safe

 

[glostamon]

I belive there is a 20' center console for sale in NES member classifieds,

 

[Wildweasel]

Make sure it has a title. otherwise you are not registering it in mass with out all kinds of trouble.

 

[jenlynn724]

I highly recommend getting unlimited towboat insurance.. I believe it is $139.00 per year for unlimited insurance.. If you ever get into trouble, and need a tow, it won't cost you a thing.. I believe that also covers soft ungroundings.. The other thing that is very important is fuel filters, always carry extra.. We have a 21' boat, and can get out pretty far, but I wouldn't go out in anything much smaller. I catch dogfish constantly in sight of land.. 17' is not big enough too go out to far fishing..

 

[natf]

I agree with the others, a 17' bowrider is a little small and since it's an I/O it'll feel even more cramped than an outboard. It really depends on how old the boat is (older small craft were not required to have positive floatation) and how much experience you have with boating in the area. For fishing you'd also be much better off with a center console than a bowrider, but you may have other considerations.

I'd really look at something a little larger if you need a bowrider, or a different style of boat if you need something around 17'.

-Nat

 

[LT1MCSS]

I highly recommend getting unlimited towboat insurance.. I believe it is $139.00 per year for unlimited insurance.. If you ever get into trouble, and need a tow, it won't cost you a thing.. I believe that also covers soft ungroundings.. The other thing that is very important is fuel filters, always carry extra.. We have a 21' boat, and can get out pretty far, but I wouldn't go out in anything much smaller. I catch dogfish constantly in sight of land.. 17' is not big enough too go out to far fishing..

Also a very good suggestion. Never go out without SeaTow or TowBoatUs it is well worth it if you ever get into a situation where you need a tow. One tow will pay for itself and save a lot of aggravation.

 

[Bob J]

I highly recommend getting unlimited towboat insurance.. I believe it is $139.00 per year for unlimited insurance.. If you ever get into trouble, and need a tow, it won't cost you a thing.. I believe that also covers soft ungroundings.. The other thing that is very important is fuel filters, always carry extra.. We have a 21' boat, and can get out pretty far, but I wouldn't go out in anything much smaller. I catch dogfish constantly in sight of land.. 17' is not big enough too go out to far fishing..

Don't forget a good marine radio as well.....

 

[m4bushy]

17' is really small for the ocean IMO. Sure it can get you out there but only on real good weather days. A bow rider in the ocean is also a very bad idea espcially in that small of a boat. You are likely to take water over the bow if you get in any kind of a sea. A few good waves over the bow and it may not come back up. Even heavy boat traffic could be a problem since your liable to take waves from every direction at that point. Being in the ocean you just never know. The water changes almost instantly at times.

Really a good entry level boat for the ocean is a 21-23' cuddy cabin or center console. I would hold out for a boat that size if you can. Let the 17' bow riders stay on the lakes.

I know people that have taken the small boats like that out but they have all had close calls even staying close to shore. IMO its just not worth the gamble.

I don't buy the bowrider isn't seaworthy argument. What's the difference between the open bow on a center console or a bow rider.I also realize some center consoles have self bailing cockpits but some don't. It is freebord that makes a difference. Yes some fish and ski type bowriders are not suited for off shore use but some bow riders have adequate freeboard for near shore fishing.
IMHO a 17' boat with a stearn drive is to cramped to fish out of but to each his own. The OP would be better off with an outboard style boat.

 

[LT1MCSS]

I don't buy the bowrider isn't seaworthy argument. What's the difference between the open bow on a center console or a bow rider.I also realize some center consoles have self bailing cockpits but some don't. It is freebord that makes a difference. Yes some fish and ski type bowriders are not suited for off shore use but some bow riders have adequate freeboard for near shore fishing.
IMHO a 17' boat with a stearn drive is to cramped to fish out of but to each his own. The OP would be better off with an outboard style boat.

In my post I said 17 is to small and was referring to the 17' bow rider he is thinking of purchasing. I think that a 21-23' cuddy or center console is the way to go.

 

[DukeInFlorida]

I'm on my third boat.

My first was an 18' center console, and I was always taking it out to 42+ miles out. BUT...... only on nice days, and those were few and far between. You don't want to be in 5-7 foot chop in a small boat like that. The seas would be enough to make it a chore to get back. Add in the bow waves from some of the bbig boys, and you are asking for trouble. Calm, calm days would be the only time I would go out that far in a small boat.

My last boat was a 22 foot Chris Craft Scorpion, and I would go just about anywhere in that thing.

My current bot is a 26 foor Searay Weekender, and IF I can get the new engine aligned properly to the gimble bearing, it would be great to not only get out to haddock land again, but fun to do an overnight out there.

Any good ocean boat these days needs:

• Good quality compass - a compensated one deals with the metallic parts of your boat, including the magnetic fields from your wiring.
• Good quality marine band radio, and a good quality antenna to go with it. Don't go cheap with either of those, since your life could very well depend on it.
• GPS is just bout the only way to go now with getting to your locations easily. My last boat had a Loran radio/depthfinder, but the Loran system is being shut down as obsolete by the gov't
• Good fire suppression gear - required by the Coasties anyway. Get better than minimum quality.
• Life jackets for everyone. Same as fire gear, get the best you can afford. You don't want to soak in the water for three days (God forbid!) in five dollar foam floater.

Also, read the regulations. The Coast Guard requires more and more equipment the longer the boat gets.

About fishing............

Stripers - great fishing fun!!! In close (typically), so boat size not nearly as much an issue. Lots of techniques, but using herring as bait is the best. Fish the tides, drifting the bait over sandbars. Striper rules change occasionally, so be aware of the size limits. Possession is usually one "keeper" per day, per person. They live at the bottom of the water, and occasionally the mid or top layers.

Mackerel - This is what I started off fishing for, but found that not many wanted to eat them. Typically in close to shore, so even a small boat would be fine. Small rod and reel tackle is best, using small shiny mackerel jigs (no bait). Set up multi-jigs for more excitement. Mid level water area.

Bluefish - Bigger than mackerel, and much more fun. They move in large schools, and you can follow their progress by watching where the clouds of sparkly scales are (baitfish they are eating... they shred them....). Great action with medium tackle, and top lures, although they will also take bait. Top water layer fishing. Can be as much as 2-3 miles off shore. I have chased schools as far as ten miles off shore.

Dogfish - not the game fish that it once was. Technically part of the shark family, shark fishing requires a permit these days.

Cod - Closer to shore, but bottom fish. The ones in water that is "too warm" get a bit wormy, so avoid those in warm summer days in shore. Out deeper, 20 or so miles, is better most of the year.

Haddock - These live in DEEP water, 30+ miles off shore, 300 or so feet deep. You'll need a bigger boat, and a LOT of anchor line (600 feet or so). I have some killer haddock "honey holes" documented.

 

[M1911]

Stripers - great fishing fun!!! In close (typically), so boat size not nearly as much an issue. Lots of techniques, but using herring as bait is the best. Fish the tides, drifting the bait over sandbars. Striper rules change occasionally, so be aware of the size limits. Possession is usually one "keeper" per day, per person.

In MA, possession limit is 2 per person per day, with a minimum length of 28". Regulations are here: http://www.mass.gov/dfwele/dmf/recreationalfishing/rec_index.htm

 

[m4bushy]

In my post I said 17 is to small and was referring to the 17' bow rider he is thinking of purchasing. I think that a 21-23' cuddy or center console is the way to go.

there are pleanty of boats smaller than 21' that are more than adequate for striper fishing. i upgraded from a 17' Seaswirl striper center console to a 23' Seaswirl Striper CC. The main reason i did this was to chase the Mako's and Blue sharks off shore.
Here in So. Maine once the stripers leave the rivers in early summer they are on the beaches and rock piles just off shore. One of my best spots is dry at low tide. The 23' boat is a pain fishing the surf zone for stripers.

 

[Another_David]

spare battery too

and if you want to get real into it get a commercial fishing license. the discount in fuel will pay for itself

 

[Skeet732]

Been in and owned boats for 40+ years, so My free advice is start with the USCG Aux course, if not for your benefit, then for my safety and a discount on your boat insurance. respectfully, the fact that you are looking at a bow rider tells me you have some learning to do. Start with that course, then visit the boat shows starting with Newport RI in September. Look at everything, ask lots of questions, get some sea time in on boats then you'll be ready to buy. In this case, haste does more than make waste, it could hurt you or worse. Good luck

 

[Hiltonizer]

Thanks for the input all.

I was concerned about the size of the boat myself, but you guys made it very clear it's not adequate for my intended purpose.

As to the bow rider objections, the reason I'd prefer to go with a bow rider is not for fishing purposes, but general leisure use.... The wife wants a nice place to lay and get sun, and the additional seating will be nice just for night cruises with friends. Not to mention, they are significantly cheaper than most other options.

Would a 20' bow rider suffice?

In regards to the classes, I have every intention of taking the NH course in the next 2 weeks.

 

[LT1MCSS]

there are pleanty of boats smaller than 21' that are more than adequate for striper fishing. i upgraded from a 17' Seaswirl striper center console to a 23' Seaswirl Striper CC. The main reason i did this was to chase the Mako's and Blue sharks off shore.
Here in So. Maine once the stripers leave the rivers in early summer they are on the beaches and rock piles just off shore. One of my best spots is dry at low tide. The 23' boat is a pain fishing the surf zone for stripers.

based off off of what the OP said he wanted to do with the boat, i just think it is to small. I'm not saying it can't be done but after one season or half a season he will wish he went just a few feet bigger.

Our first 2 boats were 16 and 18'. They were mostly lake boats but the 18' did see the ocean twice for a quick ride in the harbor. After that we moved onto ocean boats. We started off with a 23' CC and that was a nice size for the ocean, After that we moved onto a 26' aft cabin which was a nice weekend get away boat that had some range to it. After that we moved onto a 36' which we still have and can pretty much do whatever whenever now.

10 years ago we took the 18' bowrider into boston for the tall ships. We made it there and back safely. In july we took the 36' into Boston again for the tall ships. Even that boat was rocking and rolling really good at times. I thought to myself, "I don't know how we did this in an 18 footer lol" My answer to that was ahh we were probably just stupider then

To the OP good luck with your search on the boat and let us know if you end up getting that boat or something else. If your really set on a bow rider then you can prob get away with 20'. Just watch the weather before and after. Get a good marine radio and be aware of whats going on when your out there.


Another recommendation i have if possible is to get a boat with a finished fiberglass floor and a snap in or lay in carpet. You will thank yourself later. Carpets hold dirt, water, fish guts, and are always dirty

 

[glostamon]

About fishing............

Stripers - great fishing fun!!! In close (typically), so boat size not nearly as much an issue.

I disagree, In close typically you will catch the occational(rouge)"Big one". Shore based fisherman & those who fish "In-Tight" will contend with juvenille "schoolies",which yes are fun.
"Lunkers" like the deep water,& size matters(boat size & Bass girth)!

Lots of techniques, but using herring as bait is the best. Fish the tides, drifting the bait over sandbars.

Negative "Live" bait works best for all fishin' especially stripers. Trolling a live Mack in 170-250 ft of water is crucial,however pollock & eels will produce results.Hug the three(3) mile state water boundry troll @ 1.3-1.7Knts. Bass will hit up high(less then 3 fathom) additional weight is only necessarry during chop or strong currents let the live makeral do his thing.

Striper rules change occasionally, so be aware of the size limits. Possession is usually one "keeper" per day, per person. They live at the bottom of the water, and occasionally the mid or top layers..

State regs do vary,check your states fisheries website. Ma commercial rod & reel permit allows for thirty(30) bass tues.-Thurs. & 5 fish limit on Sundays.

When chumming & chunk fishin w/ herring the bait only will travel down 3-4 fathom in the thermocline.Chunk fishing will yield great results but you will have to compete with dog fish,be sure to bring plenty of hooks & flourocarbon leader material.

 

[Rockrivr1]

Sounds like you've decided that the 17' bowrider is to small, which I was going to say as well. I had the unfortunate experience of taking a couple of good sized waves over the bow of my Chapparel 17' bowrider on what I thought was a calm day. Almost lost the boat. Never again would I take a chance doing that again. It's a bad feeling when the bow of your boat is under water and not coming out of it very fast. Bailing take on a whole new meaning.

 

[matt]

One other thing to consider is displacement. A heavier boat will generally ride the waves better than a light tin can of the same length.

 

[arlow]

I'm on my third boat.

About fishing............

Stripers - great fishing fun!!! In close (typically), so boat size not nearly as much an issue. Lots of techniques, but using herring as bait is the best.

Do not get caught with herring in any inland waters (rivers, salt ponds etc. ) Herring possession and use as bait is illegal in mass and probably most other states too and will get you a hefty fine. Menhaden/bunker are legal to use. Pogies livelined are excellent bait as well. But the best bait overall IMHO is live eels especially if you are fishing close to shore.

 

[glostamon]

Do not get caught with herring in any inland waters (rivers, salt ponds etc. ) Herring possession and use as bait is illegal in mass and probably most other states too and will get you a hefty fine. Menhaden/bunker are legal to use. Pogies livelined are excellent bait as well. But the best bait overall IMHO is live eels especially if you are fishing close to shore.

Pre-ban or Mass. legal herring?

+good pts.!

 

[DukeInFlorida]

Whatever they actually were, we always bought frozen "flats" of "herring".... Used to refer to them as striper candy. They sure looked like herring.

Do not get caught with herring in any inland waters (rivers, salt ponds etc. ) Herring possession and use as bait is illegal in mass and probably most other states too and will get you a hefty fine. Menhaden/bunker are legal to use. Pogies livelined are excellent bait as well. But the best bait overall IMHO is live eels especially if you are fishing close to shore.

 

[Mass-diver]

These are my Fav boats, even though they now make them up in Maine and not Duxbury

http://www.maritimeboats.com

 

[Hiltonizer]

Hi All,

I just wanted to update everyone, especially since the contribution to this thread were excellent. Reps coming to many of you.

3 weeks ago, I pulled the trigger on a 19' Stingray bow rider, with 140hp 3.0 liter Volvo I/O. With trailer I offered the guy $1800 and he accepted. I had to put new tires on the trailer since the existing ones were rotted to death, another $100, and it was hesitant to start the first trip out, no start at all the second. Took it for a tune up and a new ignition system locally for another $266

It was a NH boat, previously registered, though the trailer was not registered or titled, and has no VIN (washed out sticker, no VIN plate anywhere). So far the trailer is unregistered for those reasons, trailer also has a wiring issue as one tail light and signals are toast.

I went this 'budget' figuring I'm going to damage something with my first boat and trailer... (trailer came unhooked and dented my tailgate once on my 'bad day' where it wouldn't start. I know what my error was now). I will likely upgrade at end of next season.

Took it out again today and it purred like a Kitten... granted me my largest white perch ever (16 in or so), a dozen pan fish, and a nice cat.

I've stuck to a local pond down the road since of the trailer issue.

I opened the bad boy up today post-tune up, and the splash over the bow crossing my own wake despite the trim adjustment was enough to convince me this thing isn't going further than Joppa or Great Bay.

I just wanted to update everyone, and thank you all for your input.

Happy boating all.