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Couple of questions on the new AWB
- Thread starter manac
- Start date
I guess it would have to be if they would consider the clips to be magazines. Even then, they don't have any "features".
dcmdon
NES Member
If its named, its banned. In any incarnation.
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Until they ban detachable magazines, there are always ways around things. Without even getting too creative, you can own a Ruger Ranch Rifle or any version of the M1A/M14 provided it doesn't have a flash hider or bayo lug.
Also, once the creative juices get flowing, there will be AR platform rifles developed that meet the
Actually. this rifle complies with the CT law. The only thing that may pose a problem is the stock, since you could end up with a finger below the action. In that case some kind of trigger extension linkage would work.
As far as getting around the "copy or duplicates" section of the named part that lists the AR15. You simply would need to use some kind of piston system, since that action is substantially different from the AR 15s.
Where there is a will, there is a way.
Don
p.s. Just because this law has gone into effect, does not mean you can not lawfully buy an AR style lower. You can. The lower itself is not an assault weapon because it could be built into a compliant firearm. If you use the lower to build a dedicated .22 AR style rifle, it is not an assault weapon. (note that it says CENTERFIRE rifle). If you use the lower to build a single shot bolt action .50 cal, it is not an AW. If anyone has any specific questions on this, please PM me.
[(A)] (i) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least one of the following:
[(i)] (I) A folding or telescoping stock;
[(ii) A] (II) Any grip of the weapon, including a pistol grip, [that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon] a thumbhole stock, or any other stock, the use of which would allow an individual to grip the weapon, resulting in any finger on the trigger hand in addition to the trigger finger being directly below any portion of the action of the weapon when firing;
[(iii)] (III) A [bayonet mount] forward pistol grip;
[(iv)] (IV) A flash suppressor; or [threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor; and]
[(v)] (V) A grenade launcher or flare launcher; or
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The VZ58 is not named by name, it is in fact considered an AW because it has a detatchable mag and a pistol grip. My question is that if I make that magazine non detatchable and 10 round limit, is it legal? Despite the fact that it has a pistol grip.
Yes.
I would like to stress that compliance with the law does NOT equal safety from being arrested for it anyway. The real problem here is most cops are not even going to know what a VZ58 is, let alone whether its compliant. So they'll arrest you anyway.
Also note that the law clearly states you may not own any combination of parts that may be used to construct an AW. Therefore if you already own a centerfire AR, you CANNOT purchase another lower, period. Because you would then have constructive intent to create a new AW by having the ability to transfer parts from your exiting AR to the new lower.
Basically, I appreciate DCMDON trying to clarify how you can comply, but when it gets down to it you're going to be arrested anyway and forced to prove your innocence. Good luck.
dcmdon
NES Member
Just the pistol grip makes it an AW.
If you want to keep it, you will need to register it.
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I find your post to be unnecessarily alarming.
Nothing ever equals safety from being arrested. Don't try to discourage someone from exercising his rights WITHIN the law by massively exaggerating a very minimal amount of risk.
CT LEOs will for the rest of eternity have to deal with hundreds of thousands of LAWFULLY owned ARs. The 4th Amendment prevents them from going on fishing expeditions. However, even if they do decide to go on an illegal fishing expedition, the registry provided for in the statute will allow them to check the status of any firearm deemed to be an AW and still in the state.
Absolutely worst case is that you will be detained while the s/n is run against the registry.
With that said, I've LEGALLY owned and shot all kinds of firearms, for many years, that might appear to an ignorant LEO to be illegal. I have never had any of them say anything about the legality of the firearms. This includes a situation where I refused to my show ID and my ATF Form 1 while shooting my machinegun and telling that LEO to get off of private property. All while a registered SBR sat on a table unused.
Nothing is going to change. Nobody is going to be harassed. You have 3 choices with respect to this law:
1) register the gun. Go on using it until they decide to confiscate them or a legal challenge succeeds.
2) move or sell the gun out of state
3) engage in civil disobedience at a state law that violates your natural rights. Do this with full understanding that you could end up in jail over this.
I personally will comply. Not only because I have to remain out of jail to parent my 2 children, but because I derive great enjoyment out of tweaking ignorant LEOs. You can only do that if you are 100% in compliance with all laws.
In fact, the only thing better than tweaking an ignorant LEO is watching a well informed LEO set an ignorant one straight. I've seen this happen twice.
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So what you're saying is no one has ever been hassled by the ATF due to the ATF loosing or "misfiling" paperwork?
You yourself have advocated "burying them in paperwork". You think they're not going to mishandle so of it? Do you think just normal human errors will cease to exist?
We both know that's not true. We also both know it will be abused by the authorities to meet their ends. To claim the system will protect you is a naive at best when there is case after case of the ATF doing exactly what you say the system will prevent, over and over again with impunity.
This ignores of course the very reality of losing your job once you're arrested, the ridiculous legal hurdles that will take months to actually clean your record and the lawyer/court fees.
Just look at the Goldberg case. It took him years just to get his guns back even after being cleared.
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i recommend that any CT resident that still needs an ar15 or other rifle needs to jump into their time machine and pickup an 80% lower for cash using anonymous email address from out of state. register your homemade ar15 so you wont have to have the gay california grip.
TZCHRIS
NES Member
And when your done with that time machine I need to borrow it to go back and change a couple bets I made! Thanks
Screw bets, I'm going back to the 60's and buying a shit ton of M16s.
And then the 20s and buying Thompsons.
dcmdon
NES Member
I don't actually know what your point is here.
The ATF has nothing to do with anything here. So lets skip to CT. CT does not have a history of unlawfully prosecuting people for legitimately exercising their rights within the law.
It sounds like you are advocating getting rid of anything that is categorized as an AW. Thats ridiculous. Either keep it and register it. Of course mistakes will be made, that is why you make copies of everything you submit and audio or video record every interaction you have with DPS. But you can't let a 1 in a 10,000 chance from keeping your firearm.
Or keep it and don't register it with a thorough understanding that civil disobedience could get you prosecuted (persecuted)
Either way, you suggestion that compliance with the law does not give you much protection is patently WRONG.
The previous AWB had been in place for 19 years. Can you please provide me with 1 citation of someone wrongly accused of violating the law.
I'll be waiting.
Been reading the new law, but could use clarification on the laws with the .22LR like the MP15-22, Colt .22lr, etc.
What are the laws now regarding purchasing these? Is there still just a background check and a 2 week wait for those without the CC permit? I read about the long gun eligibility certificate, but I couldn't seem to find when this all went into effect. Can anyone shed some light on this in terms of the new CT laws?
What are the laws now regarding purchasing these? Is there still just a background check and a 2 week wait for those without the CC permit? I read about the long gun eligibility certificate, but I couldn't seem to find when this all went into effect. Can anyone shed some light on this in terms of the new CT laws?
I am also confused on buying a long gun. At the beginning of the act in Section 1, subsection c it states,
(c) On and after April 1, 2014, no person may purchase or receive any long gun unless such person holds a valid long gun eligibility certificate issued pursuant to section 2 of this act, a valid permit to carry a pistol or revolver issued pursuant to subsection (b) of section 29-28, as amended by this act, a valid permit to sell at retail a pistol or revolver issued pursuant to subsection (a) of section 29-28 or a valid eligibility certificate for a pistol or revolver issued pursuant to section 29-36f, as amended by this act, or is a federal marshal, parole officer or peace officer.
So on or after April 1st 2014 (next year) you need the long gun certificate or pistol permit. That implies that until then its status quo and a pistol permit or current hunting license will be all you need to avoid the 2 week wait when buying from a dealer. That's not that part I'm confused about.
What I am confused about is the private sale which is addressed in the next part, subsection d, I guess. It is long and rambling and written in inane political legalize with the clear intent to confuse and confound gun owners and sellers. The way I read it, as of the passage date of this BS (4/4/13) everyone has to go through a backround check, even private sales. However, I have called the CT SLFU three times and been told by three different people that for now private sales don't need anything additional from what they did before this law. In my case I hold a C&R FFL and I want to buy a C&R SKS and they all said no problem, just buy it, have it shipped to your house and record it in your bound book, just like before, that's it. They said the new background requirements go into effect later (one said specifically July 1st this year). They were all very nice and polite and seemed to dislike this new law almost as much as we do but I still think they are wrong and we all know, even if you have a written response from the SLFU (which I am trying to get via e-mail) you are still in hot water if they are wrong and you end up breaking the law.
There is more if you read on in the Act that just gets even more confusing. Any thoughts on what the real deal is here for private sales of legal long guns (not assault rifles)?
(c) On and after April 1, 2014, no person may purchase or receive any long gun unless such person holds a valid long gun eligibility certificate issued pursuant to section 2 of this act, a valid permit to carry a pistol or revolver issued pursuant to subsection (b) of section 29-28, as amended by this act, a valid permit to sell at retail a pistol or revolver issued pursuant to subsection (a) of section 29-28 or a valid eligibility certificate for a pistol or revolver issued pursuant to section 29-36f, as amended by this act, or is a federal marshal, parole officer or peace officer.
So on or after April 1st 2014 (next year) you need the long gun certificate or pistol permit. That implies that until then its status quo and a pistol permit or current hunting license will be all you need to avoid the 2 week wait when buying from a dealer. That's not that part I'm confused about.
What I am confused about is the private sale which is addressed in the next part, subsection d, I guess. It is long and rambling and written in inane political legalize with the clear intent to confuse and confound gun owners and sellers. The way I read it, as of the passage date of this BS (4/4/13) everyone has to go through a backround check, even private sales. However, I have called the CT SLFU three times and been told by three different people that for now private sales don't need anything additional from what they did before this law. In my case I hold a C&R FFL and I want to buy a C&R SKS and they all said no problem, just buy it, have it shipped to your house and record it in your bound book, just like before, that's it. They said the new background requirements go into effect later (one said specifically July 1st this year). They were all very nice and polite and seemed to dislike this new law almost as much as we do but I still think they are wrong and we all know, even if you have a written response from the SLFU (which I am trying to get via e-mail) you are still in hot water if they are wrong and you end up breaking the law.
There is more if you read on in the Act that just gets even more confusing. Any thoughts on what the real deal is here for private sales of legal long guns (not assault rifles)?
Part of that for you is that a C&R is a form of FFL, so it wouldn't be a private transfer in that case. Honestly, this is part of why I'm going to go get my AR lower from Arizona in person rather than having it shipped out to me, don't want to run into any hassle about it (parents bought it for me in December, notarized Bill of Sale/Transfer dated in January). Going to comply and register it so I can have all the features I want on it.
I don't see what registration has to do with you putting what you want on it.
Good point with the C&R but the law refers to FFL dealers, no mention of C&R FFLs. Technically a C&R is not a dealer, just a collector so I'm not sure the FFL part applies to C&Rs. I suspect it's a lack of clarity in the law due to the fact that the people making up these ridiculous laws have no clue as to what they are legislating about.
I didn't really tell my story right. Actually two of the three people I spoke with didn't know I had a C&R, they just said I could still buy legal long guns via a private sale wihtout a dealer, one said with no paperwork needed, the other said I just had to send in one form after the fact (didn't tell me which form) but that the seller didn't need to do anything, at least for now. It was the last guy, a Sargeant in the CT firearms tech division (or something like that) who also had a C&R who discussed that with me. Sorry for being unclear. The way I read the law not one of those three scenarios is correct (but I could be reading the law wrong).