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Be sure to enter the NES/Pioneer Valley Arms February Giveaway ***Smith & Wesson SD9VE 9MM***
Experiences with Walther PPQ M2
- Thread starter iofneedle
- Start date
iofneedle
NES Member
Well, I took the PPQ out to the range today...just had time to shoot one box thru it. My very brief impressions:
The trigger was sent by the way of heaven. Consistent 5-ish lbs pull. Super clean break and shortest reset this side of the Mississippi.
Used the large back-strap...it was a pleasure to hold. Easy to aim.
Accuracy outstanding...certainly 200 more times better than me.
Recoil seemed about the same (to me) as the Glock 19
Muzzle flip slightly more than other 9mm I've shot. No trouble bringing it back on target.
Oh, and its f**king beautiful
The trigger was sent by the way of heaven. Consistent 5-ish lbs pull. Super clean break and shortest reset this side of the Mississippi.
Used the large back-strap...it was a pleasure to hold. Easy to aim.
Accuracy outstanding...certainly 200 more times better than me.
Recoil seemed about the same (to me) as the Glock 19
Muzzle flip slightly more than other 9mm I've shot. No trouble bringing it back on target.
Oh, and its f**king beautiful
mikelawtown
NES Member
glad you like it, I'm in the market for one but really haven't looked good.
The only feature i find lacking on the PPQ are the sights. Granted the rear sight is adjustable which is a nice feature, but their 3 dot layout sucks and the rear notch is quite large....good for rapid acquisition but I find the gun difficult to aim at longer ranges. Unfortunately ameriglo doesnt make i-dot sights for it.....if they did i would install in a heartbeat.
OP have you shot an M&P 9? They dont get much love around here but I still find my M&P w apex trigger to be one of the finest 9's I have ever shot.....wicked accurate and ~3k rounds without a malfunction.
OP have you shot an M&P 9? They dont get much love around here but I still find my M&P w apex trigger to be one of the finest 9's I have ever shot.....wicked accurate and ~3k rounds without a malfunction.
iofneedle
NES Member
You're the second one to say that to me this week...hmmmmm
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Yes, they cripple the larger mags.
The five inch version is the best looking (non-1911) pistol I've seen in a long time.
mikelawtown
NES Member
If the Navy is more $ than the Reg PPQ its a waste.They are pretty much the same.
View attachment 131972View attachment 131973only diff between the 2 and Not sure but the Navy might have a Tenifer finish
View attachment 131972View attachment 131973only diff between the 2 and Not sure but the Navy might have a Tenifer finish
Great gun, glad you got it! I had posted on the "glock killer" thread that if there was going to be a glock killer, this would be it. I tried both the 4.25 inch and 5 inch models. Both are great. Based on my grip coupled with the handgun balance I am betting that the 4.25 inch will have less muzzle flip than the 5 inch - just my opinion.
My experience has been the 5" shoots pretty much the same, still on the flippy side for a 9mm. The only noticeable difference for me was the sight radius -> tighter groups, but again the stock sights hold it back. IMO if someone is going w the 5" model it's worth upgrading the sights and really taking advantae of the sight radius.
iofneedle
NES Member
Do you think the muzzle flip would me higher on the 5 inch secondary to the increased velocity? I would assume it would be slightly less...
Varmint
NES Member
5" has a longer lever arm, that could be why.
my observation is that compared to other guns, moving from 4 -> 5" on the PPQ doesn't seem to improve recoil much. the guns are still relatively snappy for 9mm regardless....not that i'm saying they're too snappy to shoot well but compared to other 9mm's in their class they aren't as soft shooting.
Varmint
NES Member
By this I mean the force when the bullet leaves the barrel has a vertical component due to the bore axis being above the center of mass of the gun, so a longer barrel would apply more torque upward than a shorter barrel.
Could be a stretch, but seems to make sense from a physics standpoint.
SJan
NES Member
Actually its the opposite. Picture a handgun with a 10 or even 20" barrel compared to the same with a 2" barrel. Now draw a line from the center of the muzzle to the highest point the web of your hand can grip the handgun. Compare that line with a line drawn through the bore. The shorter the barrel is, the steeper the angle between the two lines. The longer the barrel is, the closer the lines get to being parallel
nicely done SJan.. i am impressed. but there is another component to that is weight,
though from a kinesiology standpoint. the closer the guns weight is directly over your hand it would seem it would have a shorter moment arm with its weight/COM closer to your Axis of rotation being the wrist ? a longer gun would shift the COM away from your wrist , increasing the moment arm
no wonder i love my glock 21sf shooting more than my 30sf.. while the 21sf has more flip due to its COM being farther out slightly but it recoils less due to mass+weight , the 30's COM is closer to the AoR than the 21 so most of its recoil energy gets shoved back into your hand and wrist .. instead of flip
though from a kinesiology standpoint. the closer the guns weight is directly over your hand it would seem it would have a shorter moment arm with its weight/COM closer to your Axis of rotation being the wrist ? a longer gun would shift the COM away from your wrist , increasing the moment arm
no wonder i love my glock 21sf shooting more than my 30sf.. while the 21sf has more flip due to its COM being farther out slightly but it recoils less due to mass+weight , the 30's COM is closer to the AoR than the 21 so most of its recoil energy gets shoved back into your hand and wrist .. instead of flip
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AFAIK The only advantage of a shorter barrel is ease of carry or portability. Some would argue they can acquire a target quicker but I think this somewhat subjective.
a longer barrel/slide is advantageous in EVERY other way.
-sight radius
-muzzle velocity
-muzzle flash
-blast/concussion
IMO the effects of barrel length are drastically different depending on each type of gun. For example I notice considerably more perceived recoil from a 4.25" 1911 compared to a 5" model. On the flip side the concussion from a 357 mag is waaaay more from a short barrel.
For 9mm I find very little difference all the way from a PM9 to a glock 17....its just sort of a wash. For the PPQ the 5" seems to do nothing to how the gun shoots.....this gets back to why IMO the reason for 5" is really the sight radius (or aesthetics - cool factor).
just my experience.....YMMV, which it should because people certainly perceive recoil differently.
a longer barrel/slide is advantageous in EVERY other way.
-sight radius
-muzzle velocity
-muzzle flash
-blast/concussion
IMO the effects of barrel length are drastically different depending on each type of gun. For example I notice considerably more perceived recoil from a 4.25" 1911 compared to a 5" model. On the flip side the concussion from a 357 mag is waaaay more from a short barrel.
For 9mm I find very little difference all the way from a PM9 to a glock 17....its just sort of a wash. For the PPQ the 5" seems to do nothing to how the gun shoots.....this gets back to why IMO the reason for 5" is really the sight radius (or aesthetics - cool factor).
just my experience.....YMMV, which it should because people certainly perceive recoil differently.
SJan
NES Member
Sight radius like you said, and you get a bit for FPS out of the longer barrel. Helps with Power Factor in the shooting games
Varmint
NES Member
Hmm, you're right, and thinking of it that way, I think there's no difference between 2 and 20" barrel in terms of rotational force, since the vertical distance from bore to hand is the same. And the longer barrel with more weight should recoil less.
Oh I am separating muzzle flip from felt recoil. Two examples. When I owned Sigs - my 229 (in fortay) had less flip than my 226. Barrel length advantage to 226 but slide weight advantage to 229.
Now with my CZ toys - p01 vs 75bd vs sp-01 (increasing barrel length and slide weight) - reduced felt recoil and flip left to right.
other experiences from Walther's site
http://www.waltherforums.com/forum/ppq/35310-ppq-4-vs-5-muzzle-flip.html
Now with my CZ toys - p01 vs 75bd vs sp-01 (increasing barrel length and slide weight) - reduced felt recoil and flip left to right.
other experiences from Walther's site
http://www.waltherforums.com/forum/ppq/35310-ppq-4-vs-5-muzzle-flip.html
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