First Sig took away the 2nd mag...

[Cabin Fever]

And now they put a plastic guide rod in my new 229! Plus, the groups (off a sandbag) are almost off the paper at 25 yards! I am wondering if this is something they would fix on their dime.

What is going on in Exeter?

 

[jpattersonnh]

Mass compiant weapons! You have different parts. My buddy works there, they roll in the rack for Compliant weapons and roll out the rack for standards.

 

[terraformer]

And now they put a plastic guide rod in my new 229! Plus, the groups (off a sandbag) are almost off the paper at 25 yards! I am wondering if this is something they would fix on their dime.

What is going on in Exeter?

You sure it is plastic and not a hollow metal guide rod?

 

[Cabin Fever]

You sure it is plastic and not a hollow metal guide rod?

I am positive. It is definitely plastic.

 

[terraformer]

I am positive. It is definitely plastic.

Wow. That is a new low. They had moved from solid metal to a hollow metal rod years ago. Now they are picking up Beretta's bad habits. Although the 92 FS is a browning type slide system and it doesn't handle the lateral loads of the sig slide system.

 

[Kid Presentable]

wow that's pretty bad...makes me appreciate my full metal guide rod even more..

 

[VMCman]

Ever since the Kimbar crew took over, things at Sig have gone down hill.

 

[drgrant]

Wow. That is a new low. They had moved from solid metal to a hollow metal rod years ago. Now they are picking up Beretta's bad habits. Although the 92 FS is a browning type slide system and it doesn't handle the lateral loads of the sig slide system.

Some of the older sigs had plastic guide rods, this isn't news. (My P239/9mm has a plastic rod. The gun is a 1996 model and still has the original rod. )

Lateral loads? Not sure what you mean by that. All the guide rod really does is hold the spring in place. Even if the rod did flex I don't see how it would make a functional difference. I had an SW99 once that had a really bent plastic guide rod (I think it was deformed from heat during firing) and it didn't change the operation of the gun one bit.

Frankly I'd be more worried about the quality control of the guns than what kind of guide rod they're using. For a couple of years there, sig QC really sucked. (especially when the GSR first came out... what a stinker that was initially. )

-Mike

 

[vellnueve]

As long as Sigs don't morph into full-blown Glocks, I think you're ok

 

[terraformer]

Lateral loads? Not sure what you mean by that. All the guide rod really does is hold the spring in place. Even if the rod did flex I don't see how it would make a functional difference. I had an SW99 once that had a really bent plastic guide rod (I think it was deformed from heat during firing) and it didn't change the operation of the gun one bit.

The spring holds a force along the plane of the guide rod. When the slide comes back there is a force shoving the guide rod off that plane (the guide rod is connected to the barrel, not the slide and the barrel changes orientation). That act of the slide pushing the barrel up/down puts lateral force on the guide rod while the spring provides force along the plane of the rod. Now, I bet plastic is likely the best material for a guide rod since it flexes small amounts without permanent damage. Steel does not do that. That was what I was saying. I know nothing about the 239. But the 226 came with a hollow steel rod as recently as this august.

 

[Dmac82]

Yeah, the consensus over at sigforum is they have really started to take a Down turn. cheaper parts, cheaper over sized cases, one mag, poor QC, Poorer customer service. All for the same price.

 

[PaulD]

Mass compiant weapons! You have different parts. My buddy works there, they roll in the rack for Compliant weapons and roll out the rack for standards.

Why would they put a plastic guide rod in the MA compliant version?

 

[terraformer]

Why would they put a plastic guide rod in the MA compliant version?

Because we have no choices and so they can cut corners and we can't do dick about it. So if you stop buying sig, what are you going to buy? S&W and Ruger? WTF else choice do we have?

 

[nanerclip]

They are all plastic now, not just the MA compliant pistols, ALL of them.

Replace it with a Bedair S/S guide rod...
http://guiderod.com/

 

[Jason]

Are they cheaping out on the base models or the "Elite models" as well?

 

[Bugs100]

Starting next month their being delivered in brown paper bags.

 

[Fooped]

I had one Sig and it was a rattletrap. I ditched it and haven't missed it one bit.

If you want German engineering, go for H&K. (suprise suprise! )

 

[terraformer]

I had one Sig and it was a rattletrap. I ditched it and haven't missed it one bit.

If you want German engineering, go for H&K. (suprise suprise! )

Huh? And H&K (which I love by the way and have 2 of them and would have more if I didn't live in this crap hole) are not rattle traps? A loaded mag in an USP is like a child's rattle...

 

[drgrant]

I had one Sig and it was a rattletrap. I ditched it and haven't missed it one bit.

If you want German engineering, go for H&K. (suprise suprise! )

Rattletrap? Did you own a P239? (almost every P239 has a slide that
rattles).

At he next NES shoot I'll bring my P228 in factory nickel finish. That gun
locks up like a bank vault.


-Mike

 

[drgrant]

Huh? And H&K (which I love by the way and have 2 of them and would have more if I didn't live in this crap hole) are not rattle traps? A loaded mag in an USP is like a child's rattle...

You talking about the MA cripplemags? Both Sig and HK cripplemags
rattle when loaded to 10 round capacity, with the exception of the .45 ACP
ones.

-Mike

 

[terraformer]

You talking about the MA cripplemags? Both Sig and HK cripplemags
rattle when loaded to 10 round capacity, with the exception of the .45 ACP
ones.

-Mike

Nope, 15 rd pre-bans. They hook up on the mag release and then really don't sit well inside the mag well. They pivot on the mag release and swing back and forth into the sides of the mag well. Both the USP and to a much lesser extent the Mk 23 have this issue.

 

[Fooped]

Huh? And H&K (which I love by the way and have 2 of them and would have more if I didn't live in this crap hole) are not rattle traps? A loaded mag in an USP is like a child's rattle...

Nope. My P7's lock up like Fort Knox. The USP is the Ferrari Mondial of their line. Although they are great polymer pistols, the P7 and P9 series are really the cream of the H&K pistol crop. A noteable exception to this is the Mk23 Socom.

To each their own of course. Nor did I/do I think that Sigs are bad guns, I just wasn't impressed with mine.

Edit: FWIW, HK's stance is that there NO pre-ban mags available for the USP series as they were not circulated in the US until after the ban date. This has come under some debate, but the official word is no.

 

[drgrant]

Nope, 15 rd pre-bans. They hook up on the mag release and then really don't sit well inside the mag well. They pivot on the mag release and swing back and forth into the sides of the mag well. Both the USP and to a much lesser extent the Mk 23 have this issue.

Strange, never really noticed that on my USPf .40.

-Mike

 

[drgrant]

Edit: FWIW, HK's stance is that there NO pre-ban mags available for the USP series as they were not circulated in the US until after the ban date. This has come under some debate, but the official word is no.

You mean, for the USP45 and MK23. There are -definitely- prebans for the USP9 and USP40 guns out there. I know, because I have a dozen prebans for my USP40. Some of them are even date stamped.

-Mike

 

[Fooped]

You mean, for the USP45 and MK23. There are -definitely- prebans for the USP9 and USP40 guns out there. I know, because I have a dozen prebans for my USP40. Some of them are even date stamped.

-Mike

Yes, you are correct. My apologies, I should have been clearer about that.

 

[PaulD]

Nope. My P7's lock up like Fort Knox. The USP is the Ferrari Mondial of their line.

You should use a different analogy. The Mondial was crap as Ferraris go. F430 is the model you're looking for.

 

[Fooped]

You should use a different analogy. The Mondial was crap as Ferraris go. F430 is the model you're looking for.

My point exactly.

 

[PaulD]

My point exactly.

Ah, sorry. I misread the first time around.

 

[terraformer]

You mean, for the USP45 and MK23. There are -definitely- prebans for the USP9 and USP40 guns out there. I know, because I have a dozen prebans for my USP40. Some of them are even date stamped.

-Mike

My USP is a 9 mm and my MK23 only gets 10 rounders unfortunately.

 

[terraformer]

Nope. My P7's lock up like Fort Knox. The USP is the Ferrari Mondial of their line. Although they are great polymer pistols, the P7 and P9 series are really the cream of the H&K pistol crop. A noteable exception to this is the Mk23 Socom.

I am dying for a P30 but even if one shows up here, I won't pay the kind of premium that it is going to fetch.