H4885 and private sales post 8/1

[Vulkan18th40K]

I have spoken with a few local gun shops to get an understanding of purchasing AR type guns from private sellers, and they tell me the only way to obtain certain guns now are via private sales. With the several bans that have been implemented over the years and this current ban, I am trying to paint a picture of the process for what current MA residents need to do in order to purchase certain guns legally. Please give any clarification or understanding you have to this scenario so we can all have this resource available to us.

I have a friend how wants to buy an AR from another friend. Both people are valid LTC holders, both people live in MA. The AR has less than 2 of the "evil" features per the law. The seller had their AR registered mid 2023. The barrel is 20 inches, and it was manufactured after 1994. Now they can't do a transfer of firearms through a licensed dealer due to the 8/1 ban for the type of firearm. So they must use the Massachusetts Gun Transaction Portal, personal sale and transfer section. Once completed and submitted, can my friend can now legally take ownership of their friend's AR?

So does this sound right? Is this the new normal for buying certain guns from private sellers? Am I missing anything or incorrectly understanding something in this scenario? Is there a background check that the buyer or seller needs to do, if so how? Is it really just going to that website and putting the info in then its all set?

We don't need the FA10 form anymore because it all has to be done via the online portal, because that would only be needed if transferring through a dealer, right?

Any help on this is greatly appreciated, thanks.

 

[Compooky]

Your “friends” may proceed with the portal. This advice is worth what you paid.

 

[MAJoe]

FA10 = the current portal. The new system isn’t setup yet.

There are various schools of thought on where a post 2016 AR ends up based on the confusing wording of the new law. No one can tell you what is absolutely legal to do. Welcome to MA.

 

[Romokid]

I could very well be wrong (as my wife tells me that all the time), but I believe technically all you would need is a bill of sale as the EFA10 was no longer required after 10/2/2024 as the great state rushed this out without having their registration system up and running, although some people like to still use the EFA10 so as to feel like they are following the law.

 

[CrackPot]

I have spoken with a few local gun shops to get an understanding of purchasing AR type guns from private sellers, and they tell me the only way to obtain certain guns now are via private sales. With the several bans that have been implemented over the years and this current ban, I am trying to paint a picture of the process for what current MA residents need to do in order to purchase certain guns legally. Please give any clarification or understanding you have to this scenario so we can all have this resource available to us.

I have a friend how wants to buy an AR from another friend. Both people are valid LTC holders, both people live in MA. The AR has less than 2 of the "evil" features per the law. The seller had their AR registered mid 2023. The barrel is 20 inches, and it was manufactured after 1994. Now they can't do a transfer of firearms through a licensed dealer due to the 8/1 ban for the type of firearm. So they must use the Massachusetts Gun Transaction Portal, personal sale and transfer section. Once completed and submitted, can my friend can now legally take ownership of their friend's AR?

So does this sound right? Is this the new normal for buying certain guns from private sellers? Am I missing anything or incorrectly understanding something in this scenario? Is there a background check that the buyer or seller needs to do, if so how? Is it really just going to that website and putting the info in then its all set?

We don't need the FA10 form anymore because it all has to be done via the online portal, because that would only be needed if transferring through a dealer, right?

Any help on this is greatly appreciated, thanks.

So much misinformation and useless information in this post. Lets try to decompose.

First, any AR you can purchase via private sale you can also purchase from a dealer. There is nothing that pushes the sale to private sales only other than dealer ignorance of lack of stock.

You describe the AR that wants to be purchased privately as having less than 2 evil features. This is not useful or relevant. It is either an AR lawfully owned on 8/1/24 in which case it can have all 5 evil features OR it is a post 8/1/24 AR in which case no number of evil features will make it legal as it is an enumerated weapon and just straight illegal.

You say it was registered in mid 2023. It was not. A record of the transaction including possibly telling the state it was assembled may have occurred in mid 2023. The state website misnames the later as "registration" but there is no such thing under the old law and the new law is not yet implemented. So mid 2023 he recorded via FA10 he built it. Nice but not useful. The only information that matter is, was it lawfully possessed in the commonwealth on 8/1/24 by a dealer or LTC holder. He can "prove" he possessed it pre 8/1/24 but that does not matter. Only ON 8/1/24 matters.

Post or pre 1994 means nothing under the new law. Under the old law, post 1994 means it was limited to 2 features until the new law came into effect.

Today only one thing matters. 8/1/24 and lawful possession. If yes, good to go private sale OR through a dealer and it can have full evil features. If NO, not good to go, illegal to possess, no one can have or transfer.


So yes, you have misunderstanding by adding a lot of information and detail that has no bearing on the answer to your question. 8/1/24, lawfully owned? Yes good, no bad.

Your local gun shops may not touch these guns but they can in fact sell/transfer/possess 8/1/24 ARs. I have many in stock and sell them all the time.

 

[MAJoe]

So much misinformation and useless information in this post. Lets try to decompose.

First, any AR you can purchase via private sale you can also purchase from a dealer. There is nothing that pushes the sale to private sales only other than dealer ignorance of lack of stock.

You describe the AR that wants to be purchased privately as having less than 2 evil features. This is not useful or relevant. It is either an AR lawfully owned on 8/1/24 in which case it can have all 5 evil features OR it is a post 8/1/24 AR in which case no number of evil features will make it legal as it is an enumerated weapon and just straight illegal.

You say it was registered in mid 2023. It was not. A record of the transaction including possibly telling the state it was assembled may have occurred in mid 2023. The state website misnames the later as "registration" but there is no such thing under the old law and the new law is not yet implemented. So mid 2023 he recorded via FA10 he built it. Nice but not useful. The only information that matter is, was it lawfully possessed in the commonwealth on 8/1/24 by a dealer or LTC holder. He can "prove" he possessed it pre 8/1/24 but that does not matter. Only ON 8/1/24 matters.

Post or pre 1994 means nothing under the new law. Under the old law, post 1994 means it was limited to 2 features until the new law came into effect.

Today only one thing matters. 8/1/24 and lawful possession. If yes, good to go private sale OR through a dealer and it can have full evil features. If NO, not good to go, illegal to possess, no one can have or transfer.


So yes, you have misunderstanding by adding a lot of information and detail that has no bearing on the answer to your question. 8/1/24, lawfully owned? Yes good, no bad.

Your local gun shops may not touch these guns but they can in fact sell/transfer/possess 8/1/24 ARs. I have many in stock and sell them all the time.

This came to my attention recently:

https://irp.cdn-website.com/7a261750/files/uploaded/3.14.25_Packet.pdf

See the draft of the roster at the end of this, p. 12 - 21.

Two interesting points:

Firearms not exempted from § 131M even if not listed on this roster
• Any assault-style firearm as defined in § 121 that was not lawfully possessed within the
Commonwealth, registered, and serialized on August 1, 2024.

Weapons Which Are Not Assault Style Firearms
Any assault-style firearm lawfully possessed within the Commonwealth on August 1, 2024, by an owner in possession of a license to carry firearms issued under c. 140, § 131 or by a holder of a license to sell under c. 140, § 122; provided that the assault-style firearm is registered in accordance with c. 140, § 121B and serialized in accordance with c. 140, § 121C on or before that date. “Lawfully possessed” means possession which complied with all relevant legal standards, including the Attorney General’s July 20, 2016 Enforcement Notice on Prohibited Assault Weapons.

 

[CrackPot]

Weapons Which Are Not Assault Style Firearms
Any assault-style firearm lawfully possessed within the Commonwealth on August 1, 2024, by an owner in possession of a license to carry firearms issued under c. 140, § 131 or by a holder of a license to sell under c. 140, § 122; provided that the assault-style firearm is registered in accordance with c. 140, § 121B and serialized in accordance with c. 140, § 121C on or before that date. “Lawfully possessed” means possession which complied with all relevant legal standards, including the Attorney General’s July 20, 2016 Enforcement Notice on Prohibited Assault Weapons.

This attempt to codify in the roster an opinion offered by the executive branch on the interpretation of a federal statue retroactively will be an interesting court case.

I can also hope that the "banned guns" federal court case is successful eventually. It might take the CA roster case making it to SCOTUS first, but I think it will get there eventually. Banning commonly used guns is clearly in violation of Bruen so...

 

[Yotacrawler]

At this point the existing portal could be used to generate a firearms license verification for a private sale right? Then a bill of sale and you are Good to go.

 

[MAJoe]

At this point the existing portal could be used to generate a firearms license verification for a private sale right? Then a bill of sale and you are Good to go.

It can be yeah

 

[Vulkan18th40K]

So much misinformation and useless information in this post. Lets try to decompose.

First, any AR you can purchase via private sale you can also purchase from a dealer. There is nothing that pushes the sale to private sales only other than dealer ignorance of lack of stock.

You describe the AR that wants to be purchased privately as having less than 2 evil features. This is not useful or relevant. It is either an AR lawfully owned on 8/1/24 in which case it can have all 5 evil features OR it is a post 8/1/24 AR in which case no number of evil features will make it legal as it is an enumerated weapon and just straight illegal.

You say it was registered in mid 2023. It was not. A record of the transaction including possibly telling the state it was assembled may have occurred in mid 2023. The state website misnames the later as "registration" but there is no such thing under the old law and the new law is not yet implemented. So mid 2023 he recorded via FA10 he built it. Nice but not useful. The only information that matter is, was it lawfully possessed in the commonwealth on 8/1/24 by a dealer or LTC holder. He can "prove" he possessed it pre 8/1/24 but that does not matter. Only ON 8/1/24 matters.

Post or pre 1994 means nothing under the new law. Under the old law, post 1994 means it was limited to 2 features until the new law came into effect.

Today only one thing matters. 8/1/24 and lawful possession. If yes, good to go private sale OR through a dealer and it can have full evil features. If NO, not good to go, illegal to possess, no one can have or transfer.


So yes, you have misunderstanding by adding a lot of information and detail that has no bearing on the answer to your question. 8/1/24, lawfully owned? Yes good, no bad.

Your local gun shops may not touch these guns but they can in fact sell/transfer/possess 8/1/24 ARs. I have many in stock and sell them all the time.

Really??? Then why do all the local gun shops in my area confirm after 8/1 they are no longer allowed to sell or transfer any ARs period. They are stuck with their inventory and left eating the cost with out being able to get rid of inventory. Multiple stores confirmed that the only way to legally get an AR in Massachusetts is via private sales now. Even then you have to make sure that the gun doesn't violate any current state bans due to later modifications made to it.

My friend has a AR he registered in 2023 but due to restrictions from Healey in 2016. He isn't sure if he is able to actually sell the gun to another individual. This is all thanks to the vague nature of wording and from that 2016 ban. Most places recognize that ARs lawfully owned before the 2016 ban can be sold and transferred but those afterwards are left in limbo. Again this being confirmed from multiple stores in the greater Boston area.

Also the 08/01 ban prevents the the transfer of ARs from FFL dealers/stores to individuals. So private is the only way to go and I am trying to figure out the nuances of how to make sure that is legally done.

I'm here trying to get clarification for people on how to appropriately get an AR firearm legally in MA.

If you think you're actually right, that you can legally buy an AR from a store, go right ahead. I'm sure you and your friends will find out how quickly you will lose your second amendment rights.

If you're not familiar with the recent changes to the laws , then may be don't confuse others and risk them losing their rights the way you seem to gamble with yours. I would not trust any store that tells you they can blatantly break the law...