Bill Nance
Banned
I had an interesting interchange with some friends in Europe recently. I posted a pic of my new 556 for my Swiss friends to look at . (I was teasing them about picatinny rails. Had to say something, since they have the full-auto version)
From Australia: "Coming from a gun-free (well, almost; there is of course an illegal gun market and farmers and police are allowed guns but that's about it) culture those guns look profoundly f***ed up."
From the UK: "It always confused me why people want to own guns which are designed specifically to kill other people. Here in the UK I'm pretty sure anything any more military than a 12-bore shotgun or at a pinch, a small caliber hunting rifle, is strictly illegal.
5.56mm rounds are designed to kill people, not animals. 9mm rounds are designed to kill people, not animals. Yet from what I can tell you can walk into a store in the US and buy a crapload of this ammunition, without being asked why the hell you want to buy ammo designed to kill people. Having used these weapons personally (just on a firing range in the Army), I can honestly say the power of them is frightening. You see the puff of dust behind the target before you hear the bang. And the thought of what that'd do to someone standing between you and the target is pretty horrible. As for what it'd do to a boar, well, you'd better hit him in the head, because you'd ruin all the good meat hitting it in the flank.
Damn crazy yanks."
Another (a lady friend of mine from years back) from the UK: "I'm with XXX and XXX - I just dont get it."
From Switzerland: "Guess what, here in Switzerland you're forced to keep your Military Rifle along with 50 Bullets at home, till your done with your Service. Btw Bill, your SIG 556 looks like the little Brother of my SIG 550 http://www.sportschutter.nl/Wsig 550 cal 223 compleet.jpg
Another from New Zealand: "Oh, the good old university days... I guess if burglars knew that every 2nd home had a loaded automatic weapon, they would either break in with a gun and kill you (like in the USA) or just not break in knowing they might die (like somewhere else I guess) Still, its great fun taking a 22 out and shooting the magpies (pied crows to some) that attacked our horses and for the rabbit infestations I guess Tasmanian girls need them to keep their brothers off... Scared the f*** out of me when I was walking around Jerusalem, people sitting there drinking in the street, with a Steyr over their shoulder or out at dinner with their gun.
MY RESPONSE: (bear in mind, these are very long-term friends, so I'm not willing to get into a flame war and destroy a friendship over a disagreement)
"XXX, you have an irrational fear of an inanimate object. Israel, which has private gun ownership bordering on universal, has one of the world's lowest murder rates. Switzerland, last time I checked isn't exactly Dodge City either.
One of the reasons the crime rate is so high in the U.S. is that where crime is worst, they also have the most restrictive gun laws. (Washington DC).
Everywhere in the U.S. gun-laws are less restrictive, there are proportionally smaller crime rates.The idea that guns cause crime or murder is a myth. Ask the stabbing victims in London how much safer they were because they couldn't have a gun to defend themselves.
As of 2002 the most dangerous cities in the country were as follows: (1) Washington, DC (2) Detroit (3) Baltimore (4) Memphis (5) Chicago (6) Philadelphia (7) Columbus 18.1 (8) Milwaukee (9) Los Angeles (10) Dallas. Every one of those cities with the exception of Dallas has a virtual ban on private handgun ownership."
Another response from the UK: "The problem is, you can look at a statistic like that and say 'omg, tight gun control = high murder rate'. But what if, say, people in those cities eat less peas than in the other cities, you could equally argue that eating plenty of peas reduces crime, so we should all be stocking up on peas for the sake of national security. Both are ridiculous. The village of Ilkley in Yorkshire has a pretty low gun-related murder rate and you go to prison for a really long time there if you so much as pretend to own a gun. These statistics are created and highlighted to demonise gun control laws. The fact remains, nobody outside the police or military has the need to own weapons which are designed specifically to kill people. So it makes absolutely no sense to allow people to own them."
From Belgium: "I think mainly because they enforced it when the ship had allready sunk? to each his own froggie, but I live here in belgium. we have lotsa laws and regulations about guns. It's not easy to get one, and you'd have to have a damn good reason to get one. Fact is, we have maybe 1 (?) gun related issue every few months or so, if that. as for the cultural difference? I'd agree. There's a huge cultural difference between most european countries and the USA. Definatly not saying we're doing it the right way, but I do feel safer." On a side note, how the hell can you hold a gun with them flippers!" (My nick on this forum is frogman... long story.
And my final response:
"I'm glad you trust your government to be forever benign. Since you are now totally powerless to resist them.
That's the reason the U.S. has a personal right to keep and bear arms enshrined in our constitution. We remember when the government tried to enforce tyranny by first disarming us.
And no, I'm not trying to demonize gun control laws. The point I'm making is that if gun control works, then how come the cities with the strictest laws are virtually always the most dangerous?
Of course the UK is not the U.S. I totally understand that, and I wouldn't mind living in the UK for a while. Nice place and as you all know I like it there.
So perhaps the issue is seen differently by geographical location/culture/history. I think we'll have to agree to disagree. As for me, the government can take my guns "from my cold dead hands." It's kept us free for 230 years, I'm not surrendering my rights without a fight."
Just thought I'd post the interchange here. It's always interesting to know how the rest of the world ticks, even if they are wrong.
From Australia: "Coming from a gun-free (well, almost; there is of course an illegal gun market and farmers and police are allowed guns but that's about it) culture those guns look profoundly f***ed up."
From the UK: "It always confused me why people want to own guns which are designed specifically to kill other people. Here in the UK I'm pretty sure anything any more military than a 12-bore shotgun or at a pinch, a small caliber hunting rifle, is strictly illegal.
5.56mm rounds are designed to kill people, not animals. 9mm rounds are designed to kill people, not animals. Yet from what I can tell you can walk into a store in the US and buy a crapload of this ammunition, without being asked why the hell you want to buy ammo designed to kill people. Having used these weapons personally (just on a firing range in the Army), I can honestly say the power of them is frightening. You see the puff of dust behind the target before you hear the bang. And the thought of what that'd do to someone standing between you and the target is pretty horrible. As for what it'd do to a boar, well, you'd better hit him in the head, because you'd ruin all the good meat hitting it in the flank.
Damn crazy yanks."
Another (a lady friend of mine from years back) from the UK: "I'm with XXX and XXX - I just dont get it."
From Switzerland: "Guess what, here in Switzerland you're forced to keep your Military Rifle along with 50 Bullets at home, till your done with your Service. Btw Bill, your SIG 556 looks like the little Brother of my SIG 550 http://www.sportschutter.nl/Wsig 550 cal 223 compleet.jpg
Another from New Zealand: "Oh, the good old university days... I guess if burglars knew that every 2nd home had a loaded automatic weapon, they would either break in with a gun and kill you (like in the USA) or just not break in knowing they might die (like somewhere else I guess) Still, its great fun taking a 22 out and shooting the magpies (pied crows to some) that attacked our horses and for the rabbit infestations I guess Tasmanian girls need them to keep their brothers off... Scared the f*** out of me when I was walking around Jerusalem, people sitting there drinking in the street, with a Steyr over their shoulder or out at dinner with their gun.
MY RESPONSE: (bear in mind, these are very long-term friends, so I'm not willing to get into a flame war and destroy a friendship over a disagreement)
"XXX, you have an irrational fear of an inanimate object. Israel, which has private gun ownership bordering on universal, has one of the world's lowest murder rates. Switzerland, last time I checked isn't exactly Dodge City either.
One of the reasons the crime rate is so high in the U.S. is that where crime is worst, they also have the most restrictive gun laws. (Washington DC).
Everywhere in the U.S. gun-laws are less restrictive, there are proportionally smaller crime rates.The idea that guns cause crime or murder is a myth. Ask the stabbing victims in London how much safer they were because they couldn't have a gun to defend themselves.
As of 2002 the most dangerous cities in the country were as follows: (1) Washington, DC (2) Detroit (3) Baltimore (4) Memphis (5) Chicago (6) Philadelphia (7) Columbus 18.1 (8) Milwaukee (9) Los Angeles (10) Dallas. Every one of those cities with the exception of Dallas has a virtual ban on private handgun ownership."
Another response from the UK: "The problem is, you can look at a statistic like that and say 'omg, tight gun control = high murder rate'. But what if, say, people in those cities eat less peas than in the other cities, you could equally argue that eating plenty of peas reduces crime, so we should all be stocking up on peas for the sake of national security. Both are ridiculous. The village of Ilkley in Yorkshire has a pretty low gun-related murder rate and you go to prison for a really long time there if you so much as pretend to own a gun. These statistics are created and highlighted to demonise gun control laws. The fact remains, nobody outside the police or military has the need to own weapons which are designed specifically to kill people. So it makes absolutely no sense to allow people to own them."
From Belgium: "I think mainly because they enforced it when the ship had allready sunk? to each his own froggie, but I live here in belgium. we have lotsa laws and regulations about guns. It's not easy to get one, and you'd have to have a damn good reason to get one. Fact is, we have maybe 1 (?) gun related issue every few months or so, if that. as for the cultural difference? I'd agree. There's a huge cultural difference between most european countries and the USA. Definatly not saying we're doing it the right way, but I do feel safer." On a side note, how the hell can you hold a gun with them flippers!" (My nick on this forum is frogman... long story.
And my final response:
"I'm glad you trust your government to be forever benign. Since you are now totally powerless to resist them.
That's the reason the U.S. has a personal right to keep and bear arms enshrined in our constitution. We remember when the government tried to enforce tyranny by first disarming us.
And no, I'm not trying to demonize gun control laws. The point I'm making is that if gun control works, then how come the cities with the strictest laws are virtually always the most dangerous?
Of course the UK is not the U.S. I totally understand that, and I wouldn't mind living in the UK for a while. Nice place and as you all know I like it there.
So perhaps the issue is seen differently by geographical location/culture/history. I think we'll have to agree to disagree. As for me, the government can take my guns "from my cold dead hands." It's kept us free for 230 years, I'm not surrendering my rights without a fight."
Just thought I'd post the interchange here. It's always interesting to know how the rest of the world ticks, even if they are wrong.