M1917 and other cool new toys

[Eugenio.FV]

Hey gang. I got VERY lucky and came upon a few items from a person who had it in the family, and didnt want them. With the lot was a Nambu 14, a 1941 Mauser Luger (Hope its real, its impecable and seems to have only 1 unmatched part), and the one im most curious about, this M1917.

Seems to be a 1918 made Remington M1917, however im not sure how original the finishes are. Where these ever blued? The barrel seems to have very good rifling, but im just not sure about the finish, seems redone as I think the stock was, and I just dont know what else to look for to see if its real / in working order. Can anyone recommend a knowledgeable gunsmith / historian that can help me learn more on this?




Any input would be appreciated, as I would love to take this one out to the range. I also dont see any cartridge markings, will any 30-06 work?

Thanks,

 

[slap shot]

Hey gang. I got VERY lucky and came upon a few items from a person who had it in the family, and didnt want them. With the lot was a Nambu 14, a 1941 Mauser Luger (Hope its real, its impecable and seems to have only 1 unmatched part), and the one im most curious about, this M1917.

Seems to be a 1918 made Remington M1917, however im not sure how original the finishes are. Where these ever blued? The barrel seems to have very good rifling, but im just not sure about the finish, seems redone as I think the stock was, and I just dont know what else to look for to see if its real / in working order. Can anyone recommend a knowledgeable gunsmith / historian that can help me learn more on this?

View attachment 599269


Any input would be appreciated, as I would love to take this one out to the range. I also dont see any cartridge markings, will any 30-06 work?

Thanks,

On the 1917 it could be 30-06, mine is. Should be marked somewhere tho. Might have to pull mine out. There are some great forums devoted to these and you should check them out. There were some issues with micro cracks in the receiver and those are iffy to shoot. Many were rebarreled. You already searched year of mfg so just keep searching. And nice
Score.

 

[Picton]

Original finish was a phosphate bluing. But that also included the bolt, of course, which has been polished on your example.

As a rule, 1917s reworked for WWII were parkerized. I think yours was messed with by a prior owner.

 

[Mountain]

Nice 1917! Lucky dog...

A good place for info on US milsurps is the CMP forum, bolt action sub-forum. They can get a little crusty and there might be one or two whose confidence exceeds their knowledge, but there are a few real gurus who will have the best info to be found.

CMP Bolt Action Rifles - CMP Forums

 

[Sweeney]

The finish has definitely been polished and blued. From the factory, except for late production Eddystone rifles, the finish was bluing over an unpolished surface. If marked 'Model of 1917' and produced in 1918 then it should most definitely be chambered in 30-06 unless it has been altered.

 

[Eugenio.FV]

Great, thanks all for the advice, ill look at those resoruces. The rifle was certainly messed with, its very highly polished, and the barrel seems to have been sanded down. You can barely see the bomb and date stamps, and you cant even see the manufacturer stamp, but it carries the same polished blue under the handguard, and those stamps are clearer. All the components have the R tho, except for the barrel which I just cant tell. The stock also seems to have been quite heavily sanded down, as it doesnt have any stamps or markings, and the pins are sticking out, also seems to have a reddish lacquer to it. Ill see if I can find a replacement stock.

Seems the previous owner loved polished blue, also in his collection was a late 70's Colt Python and Colt Gold Cup NM, both with peeeeerfect finish. Here is the luger and Nambu:

 

[mac1911]

The NM would be a nice grab
I dont care what people say a nicely tuned 1911 is just a joy to shoot.
Especially with some nice target loads.

TheM1917 looks like a nice rifle and alot of these old war dogs that previous owners made pretty is often they needed it or they actually shot the rifles and wanted them to look well doing it.
Since I am a shooting collector I dont mind finding rifles in this condition as Im going to continue to shooting the items.

 

[Eugenio.FV]

The NM would be a nice grab
I dont care what people say a nicely tuned 1911 is just a joy to shoot.
Especially with some nice target loads.

TheM1917 looks like a nice rifle and alot of these old war dogs that previous owners made pretty is often they needed it or they actually shot the rifles and wanted them to look well doing it.
Since I am a shooting collector I dont mind finding rifles in this condition as Im going to continue to shooting the items.

I really dislike Colt as a company, but my god is that a nice 1911. It’s so tightly fitted I can barely take the bushing out, can’t wait to take it out. That one had a bit of rust coloring in the rails, so I’m guessing it was stored like 20+ years dry, but it all cleaned right up.

 

[CulperJr]

Hey gang. I got VERY lucky and came upon a few items from a person who had it in the family, and didnt want them. With the lot was a Nambu 14, a 1941 Mauser Luger (Hope its real, its impecable and seems to have only 1 unmatched part), and the one im most curious about, this M1917.

Seems to be a 1918 made Remington M1917, however im not sure how original the finishes are. Where these ever blued? The barrel seems to have very good rifling, but im just not sure about the finish, seems redone as I think the stock was, and I just dont know what else to look for to see if its real / in working order. Can anyone recommend a knowledgeable gunsmith / historian that can help me learn more on this?

View attachment 599269


Any input would be appreciated, as I would love to take this one out to the range. I also dont see any cartridge markings, will any 30-06 work?

Thanks,

The M1917 was originally blued, but it appears that your bolt was chromed. This is usually the case in parade rifles. If your blueing is exceptional, which it looks like it is, it was likely re-blued during it's parade rifle clean up. Not a huge deal, but not "original". Since it was likely a parade rifle, I would also check for dabs of spot weld near the safety, bolt face, and chamber.

Since the rifle has US markings, it is most likely .30-06. However, the M1917 has arguably one of the strongest milsurp actions and the rifle was routinely re-chambered for magnum level cartridges. I would take it to a gunsmith if you are unsure of how to check for things like this. I would have someone check the headspace too, as it is a good idea to make sure old rifles have correct headspace especially since bolts are not serialized for US rifles and there can be minor variances. I have gauges if you are near me (Boston area).

Also, if you have an original barrel (dated to around the serial number of the rifle) it should be an excellent shooter if the rifling is intact. The original barrel also has five-groove rifling as opposed to traditional 4 groove rifling. There is some math involved, but this makes the bore diameter smaller compared to contemporary US rifles (i.e. 1903 style). In practice, this makes the M1917 "Enfield" an incredibly accurate rifle, with very tight rifling. Combined with the extra few inches of sight radius, the M1917 is a pleasure to shoot. It's heavier than many other early 1900s standard issue rifles, long sight radius and a "cock on close" action. Very pleasant shooting range rifle, maybe not so much if you're in the fields of France! If you would like any other detail about your rifle, I would be happy to help you. I am not a gunsmith but collect quite a few US Milsurp rifles. Good luck! I would shoot any 170gr or lower bullet weight .30-06. Mine shoots 150gr and 125gr hand loads very well.

 

[Eugenio.FV]

The M1917 was originally blued, but it appears that your bolt was chromed. This is usually the case in parade rifles. If your blueing is exceptional, which it looks like it is, it was likely re-blued during it's parade rifle clean up. Not a huge deal, but not "original". Since it was likely a parade rifle, I would also check for dabs of spot weld near the safety, bolt face, and chamber.

Since the rifle has US markings, it is most likely .30-06. However, the M1917 has arguably one of the strongest milsurp actions and the rifle was routinely re-chambered for magnum level cartridges. I would take it to a gunsmith if you are unsure of how to check for things like this. I would have someone check the headspace too, as it is a good idea to make sure old rifles have correct headspace especially since bolts are not serialized for US rifles and there can be minor variances. I have gauges if you are near me (Boston area).

Also, if you have an original barrel (dated to around the serial number of the rifle) it should be an excellent shooter if the rifling is intact. The original barrel also has five-groove rifling as opposed to traditional 4 groove rifling. There is some math involved, but this makes the bore diameter smaller compared to contemporary US rifles (i.e. 1903 style). In practice, this makes the M1917 "Enfield" an incredibly accurate rifle, with very tight rifling. Combined with the extra few inches of sight radius, the M1917 is a pleasure to shoot. It's heavier than many other early 1900s standard issue rifles, long sight radius and a "cock on close" action. Very pleasant shooting range rifle, maybe not so much if you're in the fields of France! If you would like any other detail about your rifle, I would be happy to help you. I am not a gunsmith but collect quite a few US Milsurp rifles. Good luck! I would shoot any 170gr or lower bullet weight .30-06. Mine shoots 150gr and 125gr hand loads very well.

Great notes, the barrel seems to be sandblasted so you can faintly see a 2 and an 8, but it does seem to have veyr strong rifling, and appears to be the 5 grooves. I also didnt see any spot welds however the finish like you said seems to be good polished bluing with a chromed (or polished SS?) bolt.

If its ok with you, id like to take you up on headspacing and taking a look at the rifle, as I dont have the tools nor i have any idea how to do it / what to look for, and I would love to have this be a shooter for me. this would be my first milsurp, so hoping to take it out to the range.

Im in quincy, so would be happy to met you at your convenience, and let me know your beer of choice.

thanks,

 

[CulperJr]

Great notes, the barrel seems to be sandblasted so you can faintly see a 2 and an 8, but it does seem to have veyr strong rifling, and appears to be the 5 grooves. I also didnt see any spot welds however the finish like you said seems to be good polished bluing with a chromed (or polished SS?) bolt.

If its ok with you, id like to take you up on headspacing and taking a look at the rifle, as I dont have the tools nor i have any idea how to do it / what to look for, and I would love to have this be a shooter for me. this would be my first milsurp, so hoping to take it out to the range.

Im in quincy, so would be happy to met you at your convenience, and let me know your beer of choice.

thanks,

That sounds good. I can meet you tomorrow afternoon or Sunday morning in Quincy. Please feel free to PM me- I'll bring my Eddy to compare.

 

[JuergenG]

The Luger appears to be polished, too. Sideplate doesn't match the receiver, same as the disassembly lever. The mag appears to be a postwar Erma.
What's the serial on the front of the frame, along w/ suffix?

 

[Eugenio.FV]

The Luger appears to be polished, too. Sideplate doesn't match the receiver, same as the disassembly lever. The mag appears to be a postwar Erma.
What's the serial on the front of the frame, along w/ suffix?

You are right, It’s not matching, and the finish seems too good to be original, almost similar to the rifle. The top says Byf 41, and most of the slide components are 17. The mag is super crappy, has a plastic base and kept jamming in the range, couldn’t get more than 2 shots off. The bore was also somewhat pitted, but other than that it shot quite accurate.

 

[Eugenio.FV]

Took the rifle to Noahs in Saugus, and got a wealth of information buy, he knows his stuff!

He looked at the rifle and confirmed its a 2/1918 build with original barrel with 5 grooves and original stock. Seems it wasn't shot much, and had a throat erosion #3 and muzzle rifling erosion #2. The headspace is 1.943, and test fired it. The rifle was indeed finished after, but all in all seems its a good rifle and he mentioned it shot well. He also added some tung oil tot he stock, and what a difference does it make!

Now to find some ammo, cant wait to take it out. The wife is gonna kill me, but I may have to order a basic RCBS kit and just take the plunge.

 

[jpm]

Took the rifle to Noahs in Saugus, and got a wealth of information buy, he knows his stuff!

He looked at the rifle and confirmed its a 2/1918 build with original barrel with 5 grooves and original stock. Seems it wasn't shot much, and had a throat erosion #3 and muzzle rifling erosion #2. The headspace is 1.943, and test fired it. The rifle was indeed finished after, but all in all seems its a good rifle and he mentioned it shot well. He also added some tung oil tot he stock, and what a difference does it make!

Now to find some ammo, cant wait to take it out. The wife is gonna kill me, but I may have to order a basic RCBS kit and just take the plunge.

You don't need any special ammo for it, it will easily handle any 30-06 ammo you can find.