Robar frames for Glocks

It's basically a new gun with your old Glock slide.

There is a disclaimer in the fine print:

Replacement alloy frames are serialized and considered handguns by the ATF. All Robar REVIVE! Program packages can only be shipped back to licensed FFL dealers. Your original Glock frame will be returned as well.
Click to expand...

I am assuming this will not fly in MA...ever.
 
Why not? If I understand correctly, a frame is not considered a firearm in Mass, and therefore does not require an FA-10. Isn't that how we were able to do the Caspian 1911 group buy?
 
dixidawg said:
Why not? If I understand correctly, a frame is not considered a firearm in Mass, and therefore does not require an FA-10. Isn't that how we were able to do the Caspian 1911 group buy?
Click to expand...

Yeah something like that. But it may still be tough to find a dealer willing to bring them in. As long as the dealer doesn't feel the need to fill out a fa-10 when they sell it to you then they shouldn't run in to any problems.
 
The funny thing is this doesn't involve breaking a law. A frame transfer is
legal. Whether or not a dealer will do it or not is another issue entirely.

-Mike
 
There are FFLs in MA who will transfer in Caspian 1911 frames. Otherwise, both Derr and LaRocca would be out of business. I don't see how these are any different.
 
Rob said:
For which gun model? And your impressions? (fit & finish, weight distribution, etc)

Inquiring minds want to know. [smile]
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G35. Fit and finish seemed great... kinda weird picking up a glock that was heavier than a 1911 though. Turned that .40 into a 9mm. [wink]
 
drumenigma said:
Oops, my bad. Yeah the polymer frames have been working well so why throw a wrench in and see if the machine still works right?
Click to expand...

yes.. I meant that everyone is going plastic.. hk, sig, sw,springfield, etc.. at this polymer seems to be well accepted by both mfrs as well as shooters. What isgained by going back to metal..

aside from the noted metal shrapnel from a kaboom of course.. Maybe that would be considered a novel and exciting feature?
 
seanc said:
yes.. I meant that everyone is going plastic.. hk, sig, sw,springfield, etc.. at this polymer seems to be well accepted by both mfrs as well as shooters. What isgained by going back to metal..

aside from the noted metal shrapnel from a kaboom of course.. Maybe that would be considered a novel and exciting feature?
Click to expand...

IPSC Limited.
 
Madball13 said:
Just curious, but have you ever seen a Glock KB? I see you trash the Glocks constantly and i'm wondering if it's by experience and should i truly be worried
Click to expand...

The Glock .40's have a partially unsupported chamber. This can be part of a tolerance stack (lead fouling, bullet setback, overcharged rounds) that cause the gun to frag. This is exacerbated by the prevalence of Glock pistols - some people that maybe shouldn't have one do. If the same person had a Sig or HK they would probably make that blow up as well.

It is fairly well documented at this point, simply search for "Glock unsupported chamber".

If you stick to factory manufactured jacketed ammo and clean it every so often you don't have anything to worry about.
 
$649 and YOU supply a gun? On the base package or $1449 for the level 4 package on your gun.

I don't think so. For that you can have 2 guns.
 
edirtyfour said:
The Glock .40's have a partially unsupported chamber. This can be part of a tolerance stack (lead fouling, bullet setback, overcharged rounds) that cause the gun to frag. This is exacerbated by the prevalence of Glock pistols - some people that maybe shouldn't have one do. If the same person had a Sig or HK they would probably make that blow up as well.

It is fairly well documented at this point, simply search for "Glock unsupported chamber".

If you stick to factory manufactured jacketed ammo and clean it every so often you don't have anything to worry about.
Click to expand...

Is that only true of .40 Glocks? How about 9mm and .45ACP?
 
edirtyfour said:
If the same person had a Sig or HK they would probably make that blow up as well.
Click to expand...

Well, it depends on the cause of the blowout, and how severe it is.

Typically, whenever I see pics of Glock KBs the guns are almost always a total loss, or pretty close to it. A lot of Sig KBs just blow out the mag and
extractor. HK's can blow up pretty good as well, but usually the upper ends up being undamaged, although with a big enough KB you can crack a frame
on a USP. There are even pics of a MK23 frame being blown up... which frankly, had to be a severe overload or a double charge.

The other danger on Glocks is out of battery ignition. In a lot of Glocks, the gun will still fire in a slight OOB condition, which is a big part of what makes some of the KBs very spectacular- if the gun can fire while out of battery, even if it is only slightly out, this can cause a KB of epic proportions- I have no doubt that this is a large source of Glock KB's with factory ammo.

This is very easily avoided by keeping the gun clean and using a recoil spring that isn't trash. To test your recoil spring, do the following.

Unload the pistol. Make sure it is unloaded. REALLY make sure it is unloaded. Point in a safe direction and pull trigger. Keep holding the
trigger. Point the gun skyward, and pull the slide back all the way, and slowly release the slide about 95% of the way, then let go. If your spring is good, the slide will go -completely- into battery. If your slide does not go into battery on its own, your recoil spring is junk and needs to be replaced, or the gun is dirty. Note that a lot of reduced power springs will fail this test, so I suppose for those springs, that's normal... but any Glock factory spring will not fail this test.

Another thing for reloaders- at least according to Dean Speir @ TGZ, an alarming number of Glock KBs are somehow linked to Accurate Arms #5
powder- nobody has figured this one out yet, but I would stay away from that as a general rule, just because the number of KBs linked to that
powder has been more than just a statistical anomaly. Either there was a funny run of that powder, or there's some kind of weird pressure curve
relationship with it that hasn't fully been ferreted out. (Of course, some guy is going to come along and tell me he loaded 20,000 rounds through his
Glock with AA#5 and said he had no problem, but frankly, with all the powders on the market, it's easier for me to just choose something else. )

FWIW I still would buy a Glock, despite the fact that I don't think they are as rugged in this regard. The "event" we're guarding against here is
pretty rare, and easily avoided, by taking a few simple precautions. If one is buying a really old gun, (eg, a first or 2nd gen) it is also useful to send the pistol off to Glock to get it refurbed; often times parts are replaced/upgraded as part of this service. I've found the factory to be pretty easy to deal with in this regard.

-Mike
 
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PaulD said:
Is that only true of .40 Glocks? How about 9mm and .45ACP?
Click to expand...

I'd say .40s are the most likely to KB, there are probably more .40 S+W KBs in Glocks than all the other calibers combined, although there's a statistically significant number in .45 ACP as well.

Every caliber of Glock has KBs, but .40 dwarfs them numerically. Of course, part of this is attributed to the fact that .40 S+W sees heavy use in law enforcement, so the number of .40 S+W Glocks in circulation is probably also higher than the others. 9mm and .357 Sig Glocks also tend to have better chamber support and don't bung up the brass nearly as much, so that has something to do with it, as well.

All that aside, I still would buy a .40 S+W Glock. There are tons of people who pour tons of ammo through theirs and have never had a KB... that alone is good enough for my conscience.

-Mike
 
drgrant said:
Well, it depends on the cause of the blowout, and how severe it is.

Typically, whenever I see pics of Glock KBs the guns are almost always a total loss, or pretty close to it. A lot of Sig KBs just blow out the mag and
extractor. HK's can blow up pretty good as well, but usually the upper ends up being undamaged, although with a big enough KB you can crack a frame
on a USP. There are even pics of a MK23 frame being blown up... which frankly, had to be a severe overload or a double charge.

The other danger on Glocks is out of battery ignition. In a lot of Glocks, the gun will still fire in a slight OOB condition, which is a big part of what makes some of the KBs very spectacular- if the gun can fire while out of battery, even if it is only slightly out, this can cause a KB of epic proportions- I have no doubt that this is a large source of Glock KB's with factory ammo.

This is very easily avoided by keeping the gun clean and using a recoil spring that isn't trash. To test your recoil spring, do the following.

Unload the pistol. Make sure it is unloaded. REALLY make sure it is unloaded. Point in a safe direction and pull trigger. Keep holding the
trigger. Point the gun skyward, and pull the slide back all the way, and slowly release the slide about 95% of the way, then let go. If your spring is good, the slide will go -completely- into battery. If your slide does not go into battery on its own, your recoil spring is junk and needs to be replaced, or the gun is dirty. Note that a lot of reduced power springs will fail this test, so I suppose for those springs, that's normal... but any Glock factory spring will not fail this test.

Another thing for reloaders- at least according to Dean Speir @ TGZ, an alarming number of Glock KBs are somehow linked to Accurate Arms #5
powder- nobody has figured this one out yet, but I would stay away from that as a general rule, just because the number of KBs linked to that
powder has been more than just a statistical anomaly. Either there was a funny run of that powder, or there's some kind of weird pressure curve
relationship with it that hasn't fully been ferreted out. (Of course, some guy is going to come along and tell me he loaded 20,000 rounds through his
Glock with AA#5 and said he had no problem, but frankly, with all the powders on the market, it's easier for me to just choose something else. )

FWIW I still would buy a Glock, despite the fact that I don't think they are as rugged in this regard. The "event" we're guarding against here is
pretty rare, and easily avoided, by taking a few simple precautions. If one is buying a really old gun, (eg, a first or 2nd gen) it is also useful to send the pistol off to Glock to get it refurbed; often times parts are replaced/upgraded as part of this service. I've found the factory to be pretty easy to deal with in this regard.

-Mike
Click to expand...

I understand the whole concept and why the KB happens. I think it's funny it is repeatedly used as a punch line from people that have never seen a KB first hand or even heard one happened from people on a board that has 6000 paid members.
 
Madball13 said:
I understand the whole concept and why the KB happens. I think it's funny it is repeatedly used as a punch line from people that have never seen a KB first hand or even heard one happened from people on a board that has 6000 paid members.
Click to expand...

Don't get me wrong, they ARE rare. Disregarding internet sources, I've only ever run into two people that said that they witnessed a KB "in the flesh" so to speak, and even in those two cases, I did not get enough detail from the witness to get a full picture of what actually transpired, although one of the two was an LE training environment, which basically indicates use of factory ammo. I'd put the odds of having a KB right around the realm of getting hit by lightning, or thereabouts.

To put things into perspective, There's an acquaintance of mine that does completely idiotic things with his G22, and hasn't managed to blow it up
yet. Shoots tons of lead through the factory barrel, uses max loads on it all the time, etc. Even he still hasn't managed to blow himself up -YET-. [laugh] Obviously a sample of 1 isn't worth much.... but it does show that variables are often hard to track, and separating hype from reality is difficult.

ETA- Another reason why you might not hear KB reports firsthand, is a lot of times, if the person knows they did something stupid to cause it (eg, firing after a squib, or double charging a round) they might be less likely to report it, out of a matter of "pride" or ego or whatever. IMO this really isn't a loss stats wise, since "user induced" KBs really shouldn't be included. Almost any centerfire handgun can be blown up, just ask Clark Magnuson. (Although, I think he stated he was unable to blow up a .25 ACP, simply because the case was incapable of holding enough powder to do the job. )


-Mike
 
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