Shield MA release date

I have what will be an unpopular suggestion regarding all this speculation on when the Shield will be available to MA gun owners . . . I suggest stop all the speculation and here is why I say this:

You need to understand the process of approval to understand that dates are unpredictable, even if you personally ask the president of the company making the gun.

- Mfr has to submit the gun to one of five state-approved test labs (there may now be one more or less labs in use).
- Test lab has to do their thing on their production schedule and submit the data back to mfr, who then submits to GCAB.
- GCAB has to put it on their agenda for their next meeting, discuss and RECOMMEND approval (or not) to the Secretary of Public Safety.
- Secretary of Public Safety has to accept/reject the recommendation of GCAB. There is NO schedule for this. I remember being told (a few years ago) by a member of GCAB that a "pile" of recommendations were just sitting on the Secretary of Public Safety's desk with no action taken for as much as 6 months!!
- Once approved, everyone has to wait until EOPS publishes a new list in the Boston Globe (they pay full rate for it) which is done 4x/year. [So if a gun is approved by Sec. of Pub Safety one day after a new list is published, the gun can't be sold for ~3 months until the next list comes out!]
- Then the mfr has to self-certify to the distributors/dealers that the gun also meets the AG Regs (the AG will NOT approve and nothing must be submitted to them). [I do understand (3rd hand info) that some mfrs send a copy of the letter to the AG, but that is not a requirement and the AG never responds unless she DISAPPROVES (which is usually after guns are in the channel, with threats of heavy fines)!]

So given the above scenario, you need a fortune tellers license and a Ouija board to figure out when a particular gun will be available to the MA residents and nothing else will be a good substitute. I suggest consulting One-Eyed Jack for further advice! [wink] [laugh]



ETA: Especially for the new folks here that don't know how these things work, I hope the above provided them with some useful info so that they better understand the idiocy of how things really work in MA!
 
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LenS said:
I have what will be an unpopular suggestion regarding all this speculation on when the Shield will be available to MA gun owners . . . I suggest stop all the speculation and here is why I say this:

You need to understand the process of approval to understand that dates are unpredictable, even if you personally ask the president of the company making the gun.

- Mfr has to submit the gun to one of five state-approved test labs (there may now be one more or less labs in use).
- Test lab has to do their thing on their production schedule and submit the data back to mfr, who then submits to GCAB.
- GCAB has to put it on their agenda for their next meeting, discuss and RECOMMEND approval (or not) to the Secretary of Public Safety.
- Secretary of Public Safety has to accept/reject the recommendation of GCAB. There is NO schedule for this. I remember being told (a few years ago) by a member of GCAB that a "pile" of recommendations were just sitting on the Secretary of Public Safety's desk with no action taken for as much as 6 months!!
- Once approved, everyone has to wait until EOPS publishes a new list in the Boston Globe (they pay full rate for it) which is done 4x/year. [So if a gun is approved by Sec. of Pub Safety one day after a new list is published, the gun can't be sold for ~3 months until the next list comes out!]
- Then the mfr has to self-certify to the distributors/dealers that the gun also meets the AG Regs (the AG will NOT approve and nothing must be submitted to them). [I do understand (3rd hand info) that some mfrs send a copy of the letter to the AG, but that is not a requirement and the AG never responds unless she DISAPPROVES (which is usually after guns are in the channel, with threats of heavy fines)!]

So given the above scenario, you need a fortune tellers license and a Ouija board to figure out when a particular gun will be available to the MA residents and nothing else will be a good substitute. I suggest consulting One-Eyed Jack for further advice! [wink] [laugh]



ETA: Especially for the new folks here that don't know how these things work, I hope the above provided them with some useful info so that they better understand the idiocy of how things really work in MA!
Click to expand...

I agree Len, it is a mystery in MASS, a very sad Mystery in fact.

I hope with the new blood in GOAL that we maybe able to change some of these stupid MASS laws.

As far as the section of your post that I put in RED, I wonder if that is what happened with the Ruger LC9 ???

It has been pulled from the MASS OKed List, I think it is just like the S&W M&P with the trigger. As everyone knows it should be OK because it has a safety, but that isn't OK with Martha, she still wants the 10 Lb MASS trigger.

All the talking that everyone is doing with everyone they know isn't going to help.

When it finely shows up on Gun Store counters is when we low life gun owners (that's MASS's view on us) will know it is For Sale in the Commywealth Of MASS.
 
DavidC77 said:
I agree Len, it is a mystery in MASS, a very sad Mystery in fact.

I hope with the new blood in GOAL that we maybe able to change some of these stupid MASS laws.

As far as the section of your post that I put in RED, I wonder if that is what happened with the Ruger LC9 ???

It has been pulled from the MASS OKed List, I think it is just like the S&W M&P with the trigger. As everyone knows it should be OK because it has a safety, but that isn't OK with Martha, she still wants the 10 Lb MASS trigger.

All the talking that everyone is doing with everyone they know isn't going to help.

When it finely shows up on Gun Store counters is when we low life gun owners (that's MASS's view on us) will know it is For Sale in the Commywealth Of MASS.
Click to expand...
tumblr_m5qildERLx1qmlfbh.jpg
 
Len is right though, you might as well stop all the mindless speculative fapping about lists and release dates, it's stupid. TALK TO YOUR DEALERS and don't just call one dealer, either. That's the only thing that matters, really. It being on the list or not or CMR940 or any of that garbage, does not matter to YOU as the consumer. Or as willy the mailroom clerk, of touch tone terrorist fame, would say "I tell you about yo package- It's doin what its doin, it's on its way. "

-Mike
 
drgrant said:
Len is right though, you might as well stop all the mindless speculative fapping about lists and release dates, it's stupid. TALK TO YOUR DEALERS and don't just call one dealer, either. That's the only thing that matters, really. It being on the list or not or CMR940 or any of that garbage, does not matter to YOU as the consumer. Or as willy the mailroom clerk, of touch tone terrorist fame, would say "I tell you about yo package- It's doin what its doin, it's on its way. "

-Mike
Click to expand...
Len maybe 100% correct in how the process goes but we should not find this acceptable or normal just because we live in Massachusetts.
 
Enzo said:
Len maybe 100% correct in how the process goes but we should not find this acceptable or normal just because we live in Massachusetts.
Click to expand...

Well where were you when they held the hearing on implementing the EOPS List? [You are forgiven if you were too young . . . it occurred in 1999.] I was there and testified as to how it could be streamlined, but my suggestions were not incorporated in the CMR.

We can all get angry about it, stomp our feet and post on NES but I'll tell you that until a US Court (not MA) rules against it, we are stuck with it and there is nothing we can do to change it. Support Comm2A as that is our only hope, in US District Court.
 
Thanks Len, it always amazes me that we even have sling shots in Ma., given the tangle of procedures, process, laws, regulations, lists and/or lack of clear direction in all of these relevant to firearms. Reading what you and others write that actually understand and have the ability to wrap your mind around the processes and laws is educational, but also ming numbing!! Makes one wonder if they don't intentionally make things so difficult just to get people frustrated so they just give up!!

Glad I am happy with my M&P9c and who knows maybe I'll buy a Shield when I retire!! [laugh]
 
October is what I'm hearing as well. Honestly, that loaded indicator pop up would be a deal breaker for me, I'd rather have the hole drilled into the chamber for a visual. Just have to wait I guess.
 
Lltth886 said:
I just checked the approved roster and the shield is not on it. It was updated recently and both the 9mm and the 40 are on it.

Here is the link for the roster http://www.mass.gov/eopss/docs/chsb/firearms/approved-weapons-roster-4-2012.pdf
Click to expand...

Just because it is on that list does not mean that it is now legal to sell here in MA. It has to be tested by the state and pass the CMR940 regulations before dealers can sell them. You will see every Glock on the EOPS list, that doesn't mean they can sell them here for retail sale.
 
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trigger is no big deal. thats easily fixed. it doesn't have the LCI which is all that matters to me.

i think people get a little nutty over trigger weight. just swap some parts or have someone do a trigger job. anything in the M&P line is a whole lotta gun for the $ and well worth the trigger job that needs to be done.

maybe it's more about the rule and regs sucking though. i guess i'm just used to that now
 
Michael J. Spangler said:
trigger is no big deal. thats easily fixed. it doesn't have the LCI which is all that matters to me.

i think people get a little nutty over trigger weight. just swap some parts or have someone do a trigger job. anything in the M&P line is a whole lotta gun for the $ and well worth the trigger job that needs to be done.

maybe it's more about the rule and regs sucking though. i guess i'm just used to that now
Click to expand...


[smile] True
 
It has a manual safety. WHY does it have a manual safety?
I'll keep my Walther PPS.
Apples and oranges aside, the Shield has a MSRP that is $150 less than a PPS
 
i was really worried that the safety would be a POS but i handled one and it was great. very positive on and off. easy to control. it looked likt it was going to be flimsy and too low of a profile to be able to use it but i was wrong.

all of my carry guns have manual safeties so i'm used to it. i think they did a good job with it

i know that its not really needed or wanted on a striker fire pistol but it doesn't bother me
 
 
I just looked at the new roster (7-12) and the S&W Shield 9 & 40 are on the list.........

S&W website says it will be available in Oct.
 
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