So, I have BRD.... Help me decide...

[soloman02]

As the title says, I have BRD. I have a carbine (now with EoTech)


and a Pistol (Now with PA red dot and Sig Brace):


But I do not have an SPR. I sold my 308 bolt rifle for build the pistol.
And will need to sell one of my M1 Carbines (1944 USGI Winchester, non-import, in good condition for age). If anyone is interested in the M1 PM me for more details.

Both my AR's are 556 and I intend on keeping the lower the same (AR-15) due to cost and weight.

I thought about a 300BLK but the 300BLK has significant drop off at 200+ yards.

I feel a hankering for a different caliber than 556, something bigger. Only issue is what?

I only have access to a 300 yard range ATM but I'd like to be able to shoot farther if I find a place or range to do so. My parents are also moving to SC (near Gastonia, NC) so I will likely have options to shoot at farther distances in the future while visiting.

I have heard the 6.8SPC has a pretty severe drop off a longer distances and that the 6.5 Grendel does not. I looked into the 6.5 Grendel and it seems rather expensive to get into (Note: I am a cheap bastard who tries to balance quality with cost). It is looking like $900 for just a Grendel upper and I still need to buy glass .

Am I relegated to sticking with 556 since the upper will be cheaper?

 

[retroLS1]

What about building an AR-10?

 

[WargameHub]

SCAR 17s


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[soloman02]

Scar17? Thats a wee bit over my budget. By like a multiple of 3...

 

[crazymjb]

Scars are stupid fanboy crap, build an AR10.

My obligatory AR10 porn:

Mike

 

[Bonesinium]

I sold my 308 bolt rifle for build the pistol.

I feel a hankering for a different caliber than 556, something bigger. Only issue is what?

You should have kept the .308 bolt gun!

Scars are stupid fanboy crap, build an AR10.

Mike

If the SCAR was not so expensive I bet you wouldn't be saying that...they certainly are not 'crap'...

 

[ColdDayInHell]

If the SCAR was not so expensive I bet you wouldn't be saying that...they certainly are not 'crap'...

This

and I don't like the 300 BLK, go with a 7.62x54r (PSL or VEPR) you daylady.

 

[crazymjb]

You should have kept the .308 bolt gun!



If the SCAR was not so expensive I bet you wouldn't be saying that...they certainly are not 'crap'...

If I wamted a scar Id get a scar. Overpriced, heavy, proprietary mags, right side reciprocating charging handle... Ill pass.

Mike

Sent from my cell phone with a tiny keyboard and large thumbs...

 

[Bonesinium]

If I wamted a scar Id get a scar. Overpriced, heavy, proprietary mags, right side reciprocating charging handle... Ill pass.

Mike

Sent from my cell phone with a tiny keyboard and large thumbs...

Yes, it is over priced. But I'm not sure your gripe otherwise.

The charging handle can be placed on either side.
The weight is comparable (sometimes lighter) than most other .308 comparable rifles (Ar-10, M1A).
The vast majority of firearms use proprietary mags.

As I said, if it wasn't for the price, I doubt your opinion would be the same...

 

[warwickben]

I shot a scar 17 pretty nice if I had the cash and free state living I'd swap out the lower to the one that takes the pmags....

Since I'm broke I built a psl 54rak.


I say build a ar10 300blk is nice but if u want a longer range I say find a different cal.

 

[knfmn]

I shit a scar 17 pretty nice

I probably wouldn't call that a "pretty nice" experience. Probably pretty painful.

 

[Golddiggie]

Scars are stupid fanboy crap, build an AR10.

My obligatory AR10 porn:

Mike

Another AR10 vote... Build it with the DPMS pattern and you'll have more parts to select from. Plus your wallet should thank you. Get an 80% lower and it's even cheaper (it's easier to machine as the 80% AR15 lowers). Even with the AR10, you'll have a good amount of drop after 500 yards (even with a 24" barrel).

Personally, my AR10 will be for out to ~500 yards. After that, I'll just reach for the AR15 lower with the 50 BMG upper mated to it.

BTW, my 300 Blk rifle build is for up to 300 yards shooting. Of course, that's with a 1:7 twist barrel.

- - - Updated - - -

I probably wouldn't call that a "pretty nice" experience. Probably pretty painful.

So you'd get a decent 'SCAR' out of it??

 

[WargameHub]

The weight is comparable (sometimes lighter) than most other .308 comparable rifles (Ar-10, M1A). ...

Only a couple of AR10s are around the same weight (8-9 lbs). Most others run 2-3 lbs more, including all the decent piston ones.


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[soloman02]

Another AR10 vote... Build it with the DPMS pattern and you'll have more parts to select from. Plus your wallet should thank you. Get an 80% lower and it's even cheaper (it's easier to machine as the 80% AR15 lowers). Even with the AR10, you'll have a good amount of drop after 500 yards (even with a 24" barrel).

Personally, my AR10 will be for out to ~500 yards. After that, I'll just reach for the AR15 lower with the 50 BMG upper mated to it.

BTW, my 300 Blk rifle build is for up to 300 yards shooting. Of course, that's with a 1:7 twist barrel.

- - - Updated - - -



So you'd get a decent 'SCAR' out of it??

I did an AR10 build list at work, Mostly DPMS parts and it came in just under $1500 including a lower. Before shipping.

I then remembered I know three people who work for Sig. Soooooo I am probably gonna get a Sig 716 (50% off MSRP) or get a long barrel M400. The problem is that the 716 is OMG WTF expensive before the discount. $2200 for the 16" patrol and $2800 for the 18" DMR. The DPMS build list I compiled was more or less the same as the Patrol model except it had an 18" barrel and was gas impingement whereas the Sig is a piston.

So my choices are:

Note, I didn't skimp out on the brands either. I chose top quality brands for the core components (except the AR10 build because the AR10 is not standardized so I don't know what works with what.

20" 556 upper build: $880
20" 6.5 Grendel upper build: $930
DPMS complete 18" rifle build: $1500
Sig 716 Patrol 16": $2200-50% discount= $1100 http://sigsauer.com/CatalogProductDetails/sig716-patrol.aspx
Sig 716 DMR 18": $2800-50% discount = $1400 http://sigsauer.com/CatalogProductDetails/sig716-dmr.aspx
Sig M400 Predator 18": $1384-50% discount = $692 http://sigsauer.com/CatalogProductDetails/sigm400-predator.aspx

One final option would be a bolt gun, the Sig SSG 3000 Patrol cause it is $1500-50%=$750, but I like semi-autos.....

Oh and I haven't even touched upon the glass that I need to put on any of these.....

Why must this shit be so expensive?

 

[crazymjb]

Only a couple of AR10s are around the same weight (8-9 lbs). Most others run 2-3 lbs more, including all the decent piston ones.


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My AR10 is about 8lbs with no optic.

Mike

Sent from my cell phone with a tiny keyboard and large thumbs...

 

[Golddiggie]

Just be aware that the Sig AR10's are not true DPMS pattern. I know one person that purchased a Sig AR10 upper to mate to a DPMS pattern lower (80% lower) and it wouldn't. The pivot/takedown pins are either not in the same location, or one wasn't even a round hole. He got the upper since it was a piston gas system. A true DPMS pattern upper matted to the lower without issue.

Personally, I'd stay clear of a firearm that is unique to a single manufacturer. You should be able to use widely available parts in it.

BTW, I actually enjoy milling out the 80% lowers. Then figuring out which parts I want to use to complete the build.

Oh, and for the glass, plan to spend at least what you do on the rifle if you want something good for long range shooting.

 

[soloman02]

If I went with the Sig it would be a whole complete rifle (which is what those prices listed get me, discount included). So no need to worry about incompatibilities. But that issue is what makes me shy away from the AR10 a bit is that there are incompatibilities unlike the AR15 platform.

 

[warwickben]

If I went with the Sig it would be a whole complete rifle (which is what those prices listed get me, discount included). So no need to worry about incompatibilities. But that issue is what makes me shy away from the AR10 a bit is that there are incompatibilities unlike the AR15 platform.

Have you seen the colt ar10/ar15 hybrids.
The use a special block to work with ar15 uppers and mags.
I see that as a mess waiting to happen .

 

[Golddiggie]

If I went with the Sig it would be a whole complete rifle (which is what those prices listed get me, discount included). So no need to worry about incompatibilities. But that issue is what makes me shy away from the AR10 a bit is that there are incompatibilities unlike the AR15 platform.

If the rifle is built true to either DPMS or Armalite pattern, then those are the standards. There's not a single standard across the entire build though (unlike with the AR15). One of the reasons I went with the DPMS pattern lower was ability to use PMags in it (10 and 20 with 25 round capacity coming soon). If you get the DPMS pattern upper and lower receiver, those are the main items you have to worry about. With the DPMS pattern, you can almost use a standard AR15 LPK in it (same FCG, unlike with Armalite pattern). Only changes are the bolt catch, pivot and take-down pins. Magazine catch from the AR15 can be used, or you can use the AR10 version (your choice). With Armalite, you need the LPK that's more specific. This means you can get a nice two stage AR15 FCG and drop it into the DPMS pattern AR10. Makes repair/replacement parts easy to get.

My AR10 will be a scope only gun. So I'll probably just end up putting a free float tube on the upper. Basically, something to connect a bipod to and that's all.

 

[drgrant]

If I wamted a scar Id get a scar. Overpriced, heavy, proprietary mags, right side reciprocating charging handle... Ill pass.
.

I dunno about the .308 version but the 5.56 version definitely isn't that heavy, I thought it was pretty light for a piston gun, actually. And everything in .308 is "heavy" to some degree or another. The charging handle can be moved; NBD.... and proprietary mags? In .308 everything is proprietary at this point unless you consider the DPMS mags to be the standard.

The only thing that truly sucks about the SCAR is the price.

-Mike

 

[ChevyGuy91]

But I do not have an SPR. I sold my 308 bolt rifle for build the pistol.
And will need to sell one of my M1 Carbines (1944 USGI Winchester, non-import, in good condition for age). If anyone is interested in the M1 PM me for more details.

Both my AR's are 556 and I intend on keeping the lower the same (AR-15) due to cost and weight.

I thought about a 300BLK but the 300BLK has significant drop off at 200+ yards.

I feel a hankering for a different caliber than 556, something bigger. Only issue is what?

I only have access to a 300 yard range ATM but I'd like to be able to shoot farther if I find a place or range to do so. My parents are also moving to SC (near Gastonia, NC) so I will likely have options to shoot at farther distances in the future while visiting.

I have heard the 6.8SPC has a pretty severe drop off a longer distances and that the 6.5 Grendel does not. I looked into the 6.5 Grendel and it seems rather expensive to get into (Note: I am a cheap bastard who tries to balance quality with cost). It is looking like $900 for just a Grendel upper and I still need to buy glass .

Am I relegated to sticking with 556 since the upper will be cheaper?

If 5.56 isn't cutting it for you, go 308. To me, fancy 6.5 ammo, mags, barrels, and bolts, negate the benefit of using the same lower. When you factor ammo and all the parts needed in, it will likely be cheaper and easier to just spend the money on 308 gas gun.

 

[drgrant]

If 5.56 isn't cutting it for you, go 308. To me, fancy 6.5 ammo, mags, barrels, and bolts, negate the benefit of using the same lower. When you factor ammo and all the parts needed in, it will likely be cheaper and easier to just spend the money on 308 gas gun.

Not to mention if you're going to reload it .308 Win brass (and suitable projectiles) are probably a hell of a lot easier to come by than 6.8 SPC is.

-Mike

 

[rkwjunior]

From what ive read 6.8spc is a very good round, it's a great hunting round and has better performance than 300blk. The other obvious advantage is you can still use the 556 platform, you just need to do the obvious changes. If you ever wanted to go back, it's not that difficult. I did look around for 6.8 ammo and it can be found for less than a dollar, and relatively available, you just have to look a litttle harder . It's definitely a lot easier to find than 6.5, which i wouldn't buy unless i was in competition. I also think it would cost less to build a 6.8 gun than a 308, and obviously lighter. I've also learned lately that i like to have calibers most people always don't use, yes, this can have a disadvantage but it does sometimes have it's advantages. 308 and 556 are now the most popular AR calibers, but suppose the SHTF tommorrow, all 556 and 308 ammo will be gone, naturally the 6.8 will go too, but probably last. I kind of compare it to .40 s&W, most people hate it so it's always easy to find and i happen to like it even more for this reason.

 

[soloman02]

Currently, I'm being a cheap bastard (again lol ) and leaning towards the Sig M400 Predator cause with that discount it is cheaper than any quality 556 upper I can build. Apparently the Sig even comes with a match trigger to boot! 5.56 is also cheaper than 308 and the 6.x calibers.

I should still be able to reach out and "touch" a blue UN helmet at 400 -500 yards with a 5.56 18" barrel no?

Going that route should also allow me to have enough cash leftover to buy some decent glass.

 

[ChevyGuy91]

Currently, I'm being a cheap bastard (again lol ) and leaning towards the Sig M400 Predator cause with that discount it is cheaper than any quality 556 upper I can build. Apparently the Sig even comes with a match trigger to boot! 5.56 is also cheaper than 308 and the 6.x calibers.

I should still be able to reach out and "touch" a blue UN helmet at 400 -500 yards with a 5.56 18" barrel no?

Going that route should also allow me to have enough cash leftover to buy some decent glass.

Yes, if you do your part, you will be fine.

I am thinking about re-barreling one of my uppers with a good 16" barrel and free float and putting a 1-6x on it to do what you are thinking about.

 

[frenchman]

Hands down,without even to have to think about it, the SSG3000. I've handled it at the PROstore the other day, and it was hands down the smoothest action I've ever cycled. SIG claims sub MOA all day, the stock is rigid and has a semi decent adjustable cheekpad. For $750 you'd get one of these rotten REM 700s with that fagotty hogue overmolded stock, which is a rifle I wouldn't touch with a telephone pole if I was surrounded by zombie hordes. The SSG, I'd carry in the field, no doubt. Screw semi for long range. If bolts are good enough for the Marines, SOCOM and every special forces unit in the world, then it's good enough for you.

 

[soloman02]

So apparently DPMS released a new AR10. One that is lighter than current AR10 designs and balances like an AR-15.

They also seem to take more AR-15 items.

The guys at Snipers Hide who have gotten a hold of them seem to think highly of em.

http://forum.snipershide.com/snipers-hide-semi-auto-rifles/231007-dpms-gii-308-rifles.html

http://dpms-gii.com/full.html


[video=youtube_share;k4jg9VRa7fE]http://youtu.be/k4jg9VRa7fE[/video]


Pricing at Buds Gun Shop (Free S&H):

16" Recon 1759-359 = 1400 (threaded)
20" Hunter 1699-394 = 1305 (NOT threaded)
18" SASS 2379-580 = 1799 (threaded)
24" Bull 1759-684 = 1075 (NOT threaded)
16" AP4 1499-349 = 1150 (threaded)

Hmmmmmmm.

 

[rkwjunior]

Currently, I'm being a cheap bastard (again lol ) and leaning towards the Sig M400 Predator cause with that discount it is cheaper than any quality 556 upper I can build. Apparently the Sig even comes with a match trigger to boot! 5.56 is also cheaper than 308 and the 6.x calibers.

I should still be able to reach out and "touch" a blue UN helmet at 400 -500 yards with a 5.56 18" barrel no?

Going that route should also allow me to have enough cash leftover to buy some decent glass.

I have 2 friends with m400's and they say the trigger isn't that good, at least not as good as one of their Black rain triggers, i also believe that one of them liked their bushmaster trigger better than the m400. I definitely think the m400 is a great rifle for the money though.

 

[frenchman]

To reach out and touch someone with 5.56 at 4-500 yards, you will need decent ammo, like MK262 mod1, Hornady TAP 75gr, remington premier 77gr, GMM 77gr, or similar. Be ready to drop a dollar and up per pop. Almost the same as 308 match, give or take a quarter.

 

[AllaSnackbah]

if you go the bolt gun route, how bout an FN TSR?

don't cheap out on an AR10, if your going to build one do it right.