1836 to 1911 What a difference 75 years made.

[Mountain]

Enemy rifle when my Dad was in grade school when Eisenhower was President:

Enemy rifle that put holes my my Dad's USMC helicopter during Vietnam when LBJ was President:

Enemy rifle during Trump's next term:

 

[Andy in NH]

Is that really true of the original service issued ones? I've heard the theory that they only became jam-o-matics after everyone in the civilian market started tightening tolerances.

Not sure about the originals, but Clint Smith has this to say, "The 1911 works, but sometimes requires a bit of tuning. The reason the custom gunsmiths have succeeded is because Colt got lazy and sloppy. In the late ’70s if you bought a 1911 for $500, you would then need to spend another $500, or more, to make it work."

 

[45Badger]

People also started selling 1911 marketing solutions in search of problems, like full length guide rods and shock buffs.

The gun was designed to shoot full (modest) power, 230 gr FMJ. 1911 “reliability issues” seem to have coincided with ammunition choices evolving, hand loading growing, powder and projectile choice expanding and people playing more games that chased speed and accuracy.

Amazing platform. Boomer love.

 

[Dennis in MA]

Not sure about the originals, but Clint Smith has this to say, "The 1911 works, but sometimes requires a bit of tuning. The reason the custom gunsmiths have succeeded is because Colt got lazy and sloppy. In the late ’70s if you bought a 1911 for $500, you would then need to spend another $500, or more, to make it work."

C'mon. Stop hurting their feelings. Now we're gonna have to give them a stuffed 1911 doll and ask them to show us where the bad man hurt them. LOL

I think most guys today are either too young or forget that 1911's were not so great OOTB for a long time. It was only when better quality parts were "mass" produced that it was nice. I knew an old gun smith. The jigs he had to work on a 1911 was staggering.

OTOH, it wasn't 20 years ago that someone wanted to headspace every single AR BCG with their barrel before firing and most recommended having a "competent gunsmith" check it for headspace and fit before using.

 

[Golddiggie]

Don't forget, the 45 ACP was also designed to be a one shot cow killer.

 

[tuna]

Not sure about the originals, but Clint Smith has this to say, "The 1911 works, but sometimes requires a bit of tuning. The reason the custom gunsmiths have succeeded is because Colt got lazy and sloppy. In the late ’70s if you bought a 1911 for $500, you would then need to spend another $500, or more, to make it work."

Another reason why the revolver held out for so long, "Six for sure" was more than just a catch phrase.

 

[cockpitbob]

Well, the 1911 couldn't have been that bad. It saw 75 years of service and is still popular as hell. As I understand it, it was replaced mainly to change to the 9mm allowing more rounds in your fist, it's NATO standard and..... it will blow a lung out of your body

 

[Dench]

Well, the 1911 couldn't have been that bad. It saw 75 years of service and is still popular as hell. As I understand it, it was replaced mainly to change to the 9mm allowing more rounds in your fist, it's NATO standard and..... it will blow a lung out of your body

The M9 replaced it. Which isnt saying a lot of good about the M1911

 

[gerrycaruso]

I agree with the first part. The last part was said by a senile old f*ck who knows nothing about ballistics.

 

[chris_1001]

The M9 replaced it. Which isnt saying a lot of good about the M1911

M9 had its own issues... And replaced by a Sig.

Should have just gone with a G19... (simple basic pistol)

 

[Dench]

M9 had its own issues... And replaced by a Sig.

Should have just gone with a G19... (simple basic pistol)

The glock that was submitted was some retarded version of a normal glock.

The military has no idea what its doing and their small arms procurement reflects that.

But yes, a simple G17, G19 or G45 would be 100% fine for military use.

 

[gerrycaruso]

Yes, they should go with a Glock. If you're going to hand a pistol to a kid who probably has little or no experience, give him something simple.

 

[Golddiggie]

Yes, they should go with a Glock. If you're going to hand a pistol to a kid who probably has little or no experience, give him something simple.

Thought they didn't do that. Give privates pistols that is.

 

[Dench]

M9 had its own issues... And replaced by a Sig.

Should have just gone with a G19... (simple basic pistol)

The M9 I had was ultra problematic with magazines. I had 3 issued to me. 2 of them were completely unserviceable and the last one was barely funtional enough to work most of the time.

 

[gerrycaruso]

Even 2nd Lieutenants are kids.

 

[Andy in NH]

M9 had its own issues... And replaced by a Sig.

Should have just gone with a G19... (simple basic pistol)

Units with less restrictions in their weapons procurement process often chose Glocks; MARSOC with the G19 and Delta with the G22.

 

[chris_1001]

The M9 I had was ultra problematic with magazines. I had 3 issued to me. 2 of them were completely unserviceable and the last one was barely funtional enough to work most of the time.

I remember they had to put some indents on the mags for sand issues

 

[nordic alien]

the top gun is a mil spec 1911 the only acceptable one . over 100 yrs later: the bottom is a woke gay 1911[ any 1911 with a rail is woke, double gay]

 

[bigben111435]

the comparison is proof that we really haven't progressed very much in the last 100 years. the current service pistol should be a f***ing laser when you look at the difference between flintlock and a 1911.

 

[Broc Tuah]

Yes, they should go with a Glock. If you're going to hand a pistol to a kid who probably has little or no experience, give him something simple.

What is so complicated about the current pistol?

 

[Picton]

Yes, they should go with a Glock. If you're going to hand a pistol to a kid who probably has little or no experience, give him something simple.

The Army has almost nobody who gets handed a pistol in the first place. In my experience, they seldom left the arms room even to go to the field.

It would be difficult, in any Big Army maneuver unit, to find a lower priority than pistol marksmanship.

 

[T-Unit]

Another reason why the revolver held out for so long, "Six for sure" was more than just a catch phrase.

Honestly, I think that still applies, but we're up to 7 shots now. Not all inflation is bad

 

[T-Unit]

Yes, they should go with a Glock. If you're going to hand a pistol to a kid who probably has little or no experience, give him something simple.

It's not that difficult to figure out how to shoot a pistol, I mean women are learning how to do it everyday, so it's not a simplicity issue. What does make a major difference is recoil and the most viable cartridges I can think of that is less recoil than 9mm are bottleneck .22's like the 5.7 or .22 TCM.

The military has been looking into submachine guns again for whatever reason (I'm sure there are situations where they're useful) and the 5.7 or .22 TCM from a subgun would be better than 9mm. Lower recoil, lighter ammo, higher rate of fire, bottleneck feeding, flatter trajectory, and more capable of defeating body armor.

 

[Dennis in MA]

Don't forget, the 45 ACP was also designed to be a one shot cow killer.

I had a buddy that was Coast Guard Reserve. He said once, when I was talking about guns, "The US Military invented the 45ACP to stop the vietnamese soldiers hopped up on PCP." I just looked at him. ROFL!

Well, the 1911 couldn't have been that bad. It saw 75 years of service and is still popular as hell. As I understand it, it was replaced mainly to change to the 9mm allowing more rounds in your fist, it's NATO standard and..... it will blow a lung out of your body

Note: Soldiers don't shoot pistols unless something has gone seriously wrong. You have to be in command or seriously F'd up to pull a pistol in the military, outside of MP's and such. So there wasn't much "using" of those 1911's for 75 years. Hence, no huge need to change, which keeps the budget down for missiles, planes and ships.

 

[tuna]

Air Force issues pistols to a lot of non combat AFSCs, like Operations, Command Post and Intel.
May as well go the European way and hand out .32 pocket guns.