AR pistol with fixed Mag? (In mass )

[amm5061]

BEV block came in today. Worked pretty well. It wasn’t as secure as some videos said, but it did the job. Had to crush the washer several times to get it to line-up.

Now I just need to go shoot it. Lol

Quit teasing us and show us the goods!

I finally got mine out to the range last week. Only put 20 rounds through it, but damn is it a fun little toy! I want to try it out in low light just to see what kind of flash I get out of that KAK flash can. It does do a nice job directing sound down range.

 

[Dennis in MA]

Wait. I might have a pic around. It's no great shakes. Lemme look

Here she is with the A2 brake on it.

 

[Shawnyc]

Wait. I might have a pic around. It's no great shakes. Lemme look

Here she is with the A2 brake on it.

That is clean! How much of a PITA is reloading?

 

[Dennis in MA]

Pop the rear pin and reload like a regular AR magazine, but already installed in the mag-well.

My "theory" is that it's a home defense gun. I'd rather have more than 10 rds, but the reality is that if I'm in a firefight in my house, a reload is the LEAST of my problems.

There are devices that will reload through the ejection port. So if I wanted another 10rds, I could do it. But even the "good" guys watching on Youtube struggle just a tad. It's specialized skill.

Now, will I even keep this for home defense in the bedroom? Who knows. I did it to do something I hadn't done before. Along with a cool HD weapon. It's small. Not as light as I'd like it. But it's pretty small.

 

[amm5061]

If you have the extended pins it's a little easier to pull the pin out.

Personally, mine is more for the "screw you, because I can" factor than anything really useful. Plus it's a fun toy at the range.

 

[Auto508]

I know this thread is a little old, and I apologize if this has already been asked, but how does everyone feel about an 80% lower with a fixed mag kit to build a pistol with? I’ve read threads on other sites where people say “what’s the point of using an 80%” or that it defeats the purpose of an 80% if you end up registering it. The reason I’m considering using an 80%, one, is because I have a few already, and two, because $50 for the lower plus $40 for the fixed mag kit is much cheaper than $250-350 for a fixed mag lower. As I understand it, the only stipulation on building a pistol vs rifle is that it has to be a virgin lower. I literally have everything including a finished 80%, a 10.5” upper, shockwave blade stabilizer and the Franklin armory dfm fixed mag kit and bolt catch. As I understand it, the fixed mag can be removed as long as the two receivers are not together. You may remove the mag as long as the lower is removed from the upper. I’m building it over the next day or two and will post pics, but just wanted to get your thoughts. Also, if I’m correct about the mag, this fixed mag is a great option for building a fixed mag lower and may scrap my dfm and pick up one of these. It has a slide button on the side and a door that opens, so you open the door and slide the spring down with the button and can reload the mag from the side while it’s still attached to the rifle.
View: https://youtu.be/3AykOHkCxsw

 

[amm5061]

I know this thread is a little old, and I apologize if this has already been asked, but how does everyone feel about an 80% lower with a fixed mag kit to build a pistol with? I’ve read threads on other sites where people say “what’s the point of using an 80%” or that it defeats the purpose of an 80% if you end up registering it. The reason I’m considering using an 80%, one, is because I have a few already, and two, because $50 for the lower plus $40 for the fixed mag kit is much cheaper than $250-350 for a fixed mag lower. As I understand it, the only stipulation on building a pistol vs rifle is that it has to be a virgin lower. I literally have everything including a finished 80%, a 10.5” upper, shockwave blade stabilizer and the Franklin armory dfm fixed mag kit and bolt catch. As I understand it, the fixed mag can be removed as long as the two receivers are not together. You may remove the mag as long as the lower is removed from the upper. I’m building it over the next day or two and will post pics, but just wanted to get your thoughts. Also, if I’m correct about the mag, this fixed mag is a great option for building a fixed mag lower and may scrap my dfm and pick up one of these. It has a slide button on the side and a door that opens, so you open the door and slide the spring down with the button and can reload the mag from the side while it’s still attached to the rifle.
View: https://youtu.be/3AykOHkCxsw

The Kommifornia-style fixed mag kits might not fly here, but no one knows. All the ones I've seen that have been ruled okay (or more accurately, have not been ruled as no-go since the AG doesn't seem to actually be saying things are okay) have been a pin job or a set screw. IANAL, but the DFM may be okay without the special bolt catch, since in that case if you wanted to remove it you would need to remove the bolt catch first. I can see it being no-go with the special bolt catch that lets you remove the magazine easily.

Truthfully, no one knows. Just make sure your keep your magazine capacity at 10 rounds or less. If you want to be extra careful, used a pinned/set screw mag. That's why I like the DSI lower I have, there's no place for a mag release, since it was never milled out of the lower. There's no ambiguity there, it can never accept a detachable magazine.

The CompMag would maybe be fine, but I would pin it in place as well.

EDIT: Is the AR-15 CompMag N.Y. Safe Act compliant? Not NY-Safe without additional steps, so probably wouldn't pass the AG's sniff test as is, either.

 

[Dennis in MA]

If you've got an 80% and the wherewithal to make it into a complete fixed-mag lower, it'll be cheaper and I say go for it.

 

[amm5061]

I've been meaning to give my feedback on the Mean Arms Loaders I purchased specifically for this build. I bought two of them and so far I would say that they are easier than opening the bastard up to load.

There is a slight learning curve. I didn't get it fully seated in the ejection port the first time I used it, and as a consequence I had the last round jam while trying to shove the rounds into the magazine.

I still don't know what the f*** the deal was with it. I couldn't shove the thing in further to seat the round into the magazine, and I couldn't withdraw the loader because half the round was stuck in the loader and half in the magazine. This resulted in me popping the base plate off the mag, dumping the loaded rounds, and proceeding to hammer the shit out of the loader until it popped out. Thanks to the fact the thing is plastic, it eventually deformed itself and the round enough through brute force to pop out.

The loader was only a little chewed up but not seriously damaged and functioned perfectly the next time I used it despite the hammering it went through. The stuck round was a total loss, though. The brass was actually bent in the middle at about a 30 degree angle.

After this disaster, I learned to make sure the thing is fully seated before slamming the rounds home into the mag. I've had no trouble using either of the two I purchased since then.

It did take Mean Arms several weeks to ship them out to me, but I suspect they had and still have a large demand to meet from Kommiefornia so I'm not too bothered by it.

 

[Dennis in MA]

Is it hard to load the fixed mag when you open yours??? Mine is a BEAR to load. I'm having some FTF issues that I suspect are mag related. I'm thinking the springs are too tight or something.

 

[wmassregulators]

Supposing someone was to build one of these.
Would there be anything stopping them from using a maxim pdw brace?

 

[pupchow]

Supposing someone was to build one of these.
Would there be anything stopping them from using a maxim pdw brace?

ATF Prosecutes Ohio Man for AR Pistol with Brace

 

[slap shot]

ATF Prosecutes Ohio Man for AR Pistol with Brace

And? "Luckily there was a happy ending to the saga, with the jury returning a not guilty verdict after a short deliberation. The most alarming part of this indictment is that the U.S. Attorney’s Office for the Northern District of Ohio even sought to prosecute the case. The [Prince Law Offices blog] (ATF Unhinged: Prosecutions Made Up Out of Whole Cloth – You Might Be Next…) went as to far as saying the U.S. Attorney’s Office invented the charges ‘out of whole cloth,’ completely fabricating the entire basis for the case."

 

[pupchow]

And? "Luckily there was a happy ending to the saga, with the jury returning a not guilty verdict after a short deliberation. The most alarming part of this indictment is that the U.S. Attorney’s Office for the Northern District of Ohio even sought to prosecute the case. The [Prince Law Offices blog] (ATF Unhinged: Prosecutions Made Up Out of Whole Cloth – You Might Be Next…) went as to far as saying the U.S. Attorney’s Office invented the charges ‘out of whole cloth,’ completely fabricating the entire basis for the case."

Yup.

 

[amm5061]

Is it hard to load the fixed mag when you open yours??? Mine is a BEAR to load. I'm having some FTF issues that I suspect are mag related. I'm thinking the springs are too tight or something.

It's actually not too bad loading from the top. Mine uses a 10-round pmag and the .223 rounds seem to go in pretty easily. I can't testify for any other rounds, and being a pmag, big bore rounds are basically a no go.

Supposing someone was to build one of these.
Would there be anything stopping them from using a maxim pdw brace?

I see no issues here since it's a fixed mag. A pistol arm brace is a pistol arm brace.

 

[DosesR1]

I had a question since it’s no longer an AW with a fix mag then I wouldn’t have to weld a the muzzle break ? I could put a compensator at the end and call it a day ? I’m trying to go with this set up for the upper but I don’t wanna get stuck with something I can’t legally use

 

[amm5061]

I had a question since it’s no longer an AW with a fix mag then I wouldn’t have to weld a the muzzle break ? I could put a compensator at the end and call it a day ? I’m trying to go with this set up for the upper but I don’t wanna get stuck with something I can’t legally use

Fixed mag means you can have all the evil features you want. Have at it.

 

[allen-1]

Pop the rear pin and reload like a regular AR magazine, but already installed in the mag-well.

My "theory" is that it's a home defense gun. I'd rather have more than 10 rds, but the reality is that if I'm in a firefight in my house, a reload is the LEAST of my problems.

There are devices that will reload through the ejection port. So if I wanted another 10rds, I could do it. But even the "good" guys watching on Youtube struggle just a tad. It's specialized skill.

Now, will I even keep this for home defense in the bedroom? Who knows. I did it to do something I hadn't done before. Along with a cool HD weapon. It's small. Not as light as I'd like it. But it's pretty small.

Neat. And I get the whole "I did it just 'cause I haven't done it before". Nice looking little gun.

 

[Shawnyc]

How does everyone like their 7.5” builds? My SBR is a 10.5”. It’s loud but tolerable, and I find the length to be much more maneuverable than a 16”. Those of you with 7.5” builds, do you wish you went with a longer barrel?

 

[amm5061]

How does everyone like their 7.5” builds? My SBR is a 10.5”. It’s loud but tolerable, and I find the length to be much more maneuverable than a 16”. Those of you with 7.5” builds, do you wish you went with a longer barrel?

I have no regrets about mine. Accurate enough at 50-100 yards with a red dot, runs great with the pistol length gas system, and the 3" long flash can on the front actually makes it almost as long as a 10.5" barrel. I've toyed with the idea of doing another 7.5" with just an A2 flash hider and maybe a cooler hand guard from SLR Rifleworks, but that would just be for fun.

That said, I've also toyed with the idea of doing a 10.3" MK18 clone upper as well. Once again, that would be just for fun.

 

[Mr.E]

Here's mine: JC Arms lower, Ghost Vital 7.5" upper, Colt bcg & ch, Sig SBX15 brace, Sig Romeo4, S&J Hardware Nano linear comp. MeanArms Feed ramp & loaders.
View attachment 239779
View attachment 239781

for the uninitiated such as myself, can you give the "AR pistols in MA for dummies" explanation of how this works? I know SBR's (a little) but have been playing with the idea of a pistol and want to make sure I cover my bases.

 

[Dennis in MA]

I'll give it a whirl:

Gotta build it from scratch. From the frame up AS a pistol. You cannot convert a rifle into a pistol.

Can't be more than a 10rd mag.

Can't be removable mag (which would make it hi-cap by definition). Magazine has to be "not easily converted" into removable mag.

Can't have a traditional buttstock, but can have an arm-brace.

Barrel can't be longer than. . . . I forget, but longer than you'd want a PISTOL length carbine to be.

Unless I missed something, there isn't much else. Because it's a pistol but NOT an AW, it doesn't violate any AWB regulations. Because it's a pistol AND fixed mag. It's a uni-ma-corn of the firearms world. I'm really surprised someone didn't try this from 1994-2004. (Gosh, did the federal AWB retire almost 15 years ago??? I scored SO many preban mags right after it expired. Wow.)

 

[Shawnyc]

Also should add a AR pistol CANNOT have a VFG, AFG is ok.

 

[Mr.E]

I'll give it a whirl:

Gotta build it from scratch. From the frame up AS a pistol. You cannot convert a rifle into a pistol.

Can't be more than a 10rd mag.

Can't be removable mag (which would make it hi-cap by definition). Magazine has to be "not easily converted" into removable mag.

Can't have a traditional buttstock, but can have an arm-brace.

Barrel can't be longer than. . . . I forget, but longer than you'd want a PISTOL length carbine to be.

Unless I missed something, there isn't much else. Because it's a pistol but NOT an AW, it doesn't violate any AWB regulations. Because it's a pistol AND fixed mag. It's a uni-ma-corn of the firearms world. I'm really surprised someone didn't try this from 1994-2004. (Gosh, did the federal AWB retire almost 15 years ago??? I scored SO many preban mags right after it expired. Wow.)

So the only thing stopping this from being an SBR is the lack of a traditional buttstock.? Are there legal options besides an arm brace?

 

[Wildweasel]

Arm brace or no stock/brace. it has to be a pistol after all.

 

[amm5061]

So the only thing stopping this from being an SBR is the lack of a traditional buttstock.? Are there legal options besides an arm brace?

You can put a stabilizer on it like a KAK blade or as others have said leave the pistol buffer tube bare.

 

[amm5061]

Barrel can't be longer than. . . . I forget, but longer than you'd want a PISTOL length carbine to be.

As far as I know you can put any barrel you want on it federally. I'm not sure where the state gets bitchy about things. If they do, it'll be at 16" since that's the minimum length for a rifle barrel.

Also if the OAL of the firearm with the brace collapsed (if applicable because the ATF is being shitty about this again) and not including the muzzle device if not permanently attached (pinned & welded) exceeds 26" then you can put a vertical fore-grip on it without it becoming an AOW. Can you add a vertical fore-grip to an AR pistol?

 

[Yankee Clipper]

I have an Aero upper on mine. No wobble whatsoever. Hope that helps.

 

[Yankee Clipper]

Now what BCG did you end up going with? And was there any reasoning for choosing a 7.5" vs a 10.5"?

 

[DJBrad]

Good questions. Brownell’s had a sale on their toolcraft lightweight bcg’s so I went with the TiN finish for the reduced weight and felt recoil. Only negative was some said the extractor gasket needed to be replaced to properly eject brass? Finish was scratching too. We’ll see. That’s a way to test Brownell’s warranty.


I went with the 7.5” because I wanted as small a package as possible. I haven’t read much of anything negative regarding the Ghost uppers and the ceracote options were nice. Price was nice too. I considered the flashcan version but I already have a Troy Claymore muzzle brake to use which diverts all flash forward. Saw some in action and loved it.