best press for precision reloading?

I use large primer. My current load is lapua brass, federal gold match large primers, 41.6gr of H4350, and 144gr Berger Hybrid Long Range Target bullets. I am getting an average of 2740 fps out of a 26in barrel with an SD of 2.5 and an ES of 4.9. I do spend a lot of time prepping the brass.
 
TBK said:
I use large primer. My current load is lapua brass, federal gold match large primers, 41.6gr of H4350, and 144gr Berger Hybrid Long Range Target bullets. I am getting an average of 2740 fps out of a 26in barrel with an SD of 2.5 and an ES of 4.9. I do spend a lot of time prepping the brass.
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off topic , but are you annealing your brass and what twist rate ?
 
50wt said:
off topic , but are you annealing your brass and what twist rate ?
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Yeah, realized that after I replied.

Not annealing yet. I did ask Santa for an annealer. Twist rate is 1:8.

Edit: I use Redding Competition Dies and my old Hornady single stage press. I only bump the shoulder 0.002. I have not measured any stretching of the brass.
 
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TBK said:
Yeah, realized that after I replied.

Not annealing yet. I did ask Santa for an annealer. Twist rate is 1:8.

Edit: I use Redding Competition Dies and my old Hornady single stage press. I only bump the shoulder 0.002. I have not measured any stretching of the brass.
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Nah, my post was off topic. I was going to send a pm to you , but figured the op should know as well .
 
I had some time this week and made up a shorter handle for the old co-ax. MUCH better.
20241221_080107.jpg 20241221_080129.jpg

Did I tell you the story behind this press? I was at KTP and they had a box behind the counter full of reloading stuff that someone had sold/traded in. I saw the red press and knew what it was. I asked "how much for the press in that box?". The guy said "I think that's a LEE. How about $50?"
"Sold!"
 
gerrycaruso said:
Why do you need a single stage press? Can't a progressive be used as a single stage?
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they`re trying to sell a story that a beaten up 50yr old single stage junk will be better than a new 750 dillon for precision reloading. [rofl] [rofl] [rofl]

of course it makes no damn difference, a press is a press.
 
Mudflap621 said:
Resetting what? Ya'll not using lock rings or something? I don't have issue screwing a die out of my MEC and screwing another one in and it not being where I left it. I can literally change a die in 10 seconds...

Some are overthinking this, and and doing stuff that doesn't make a difference to accuracy that most can achieve. Y'all cleaning primer pockets, wet tumbling, weight sorting, and checking runout take that time spent and use it training it'll be better served.



Serious question but why have a body die and neck die and not just full length resize if doing both?
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I only wet tumble in pins so my stuff looks pissa.
 
paul73 said:
they`re trying to sell a story that a beaten up 50yr old single stage junk will be better than a new 750 dillon for precision reloading. [rofl] [rofl] [rofl]

of course it makes no damn difference, a press is a press.
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I want to know what accuracy gains is everyone looking for ,
Are “you guys” loosing by group size, X count
Would “accuracy” improve with less time in the reloading room and more time on the range?
 
mac1911 said:
I want to know what accuracy gains is everyone looking for ,
Are “you guys” loosing by group size, X count
Would “accuracy” improve with less time in the reloading room and more time on the range?
Click to expand...

👍👍👍
 
The title of this thread contains the term "....precision reloading...". It is true that many (most?) shooters would be better served with more time behind the trigger instead of behind the press handle. But there are some shooters who have reached the limit of their equipment and are looking for that extra little advantage they can get from taking more time with their handloads.
 
This thread has had me thinking about it more than any other thread on NES (except for the blinking lights in the tree thread)

First I went down a mental rabbit hole on the question of benefit of more practice time vs more time in the reloading room to make better ammo. I initially thought you quickly get to point of diminishing returns on better ammo. But the joking answer is “ why not both?”

For me I quit load development when I had consistent 3/4” 5 shot groups at 100 yards with an speed SD of less than 10 fps. Done!

Then miraculously I got the group size to shrink to 1/2”!

That improvement was a result of neither more trigger time nor reloading improvements. I put same handloads through the same rifle after switching from the factory barrel to custom barrel ( criterion)

After that my changes in reloading room have been aimed at producing same results with less effort (time)
 
paul73 said:
of course it makes no damn difference, a press is a press.
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I really believe this is the right answer.

The other mental rabbit hole I went down because of this thread is should I try to improve my hand loads? Three pages of notes and a flow chart later and my best internet research says yes. I’ll start another thread on that.

But let me tell you why I believe press doesn’t make a difference. There is an online blog ( Precision rifle blog, what the pros use) where they survey the top 200 pro series shooters. One of the recent surveys was on reloading,( and 97% of the top 200 hand load their own ammo)

If you review the whole survey ( three parts) you see a great deal of agreement on things that matter, and very little agreement on things less critical. Bullets? Pick a caliber and 66-76% Berger, 10-16% Hornady, the rest in the noise ( although Sierra does ok in tactical decision of .223 and 308.). Side note on Hornady bullets- I was surprised to see that not a single competitor in top 200 used the ELD match bullet. The only Hornady bullet used was the A tip.(Aluminum tip)
Brass is pretty much two vendor race.

But other things are all over the place with no agreement. What press used is all over the place. #1 press for resizing was RCBS rock chucker, but only at 20%. Dillon third at 15 or so. All kinds of single stage progressives and arbor presses

Press used for seating bullets had similar results. Rock chucker #1 20% ish, Dillon third. Arbor presses did a little better for seating press

So I’d say press doesn’t matter

Now you want to blow your mind? While press doesn’t seem to matter, there was a great deal of agreement on what they used for sizing dies and seating dies, and I have to say I don’t have any of those brands in my reloading room. The die choice seems to matter more than press choice
 
#1 dies for sizing and seating ( over 50% used them) was from Short action Custom. Approximately $300 each ($600 set). #2 was Redding competition dies Third for sizing was a company I never heard of and don’t recall. Third for seating die was le Wilson die. If you look at what top 200 are doing and what top 25 are doing they are usually the same. The le Wilson seating die broke that trend as it was the #1 choice of top 25
 
northny said:
#1 dies for sizing and seating ( over 50% used them) was from Short action Custom. Approximately $300 each ($600 set). #2 was Redding competition dies Third for sizing was a company I never heard of and don’t recall. Third for seating die was le Wilson die. If you look at what top 200 are doing and what top 25 are doing they are usually the same. The le Wilson seating die broke that trend as it was the #1 choice of top 25
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I’ll say although the SAC sizing die is expensive, it is my go-to for sizing. Ive been running them for the last few years. Its machining is amazing and sizes easier than anything else on my bench. Also their bushing and mandrel selection really lets you dial in your sizing exactly where you want it. I prefer a mandrel as last step to set neck tension so use their decap mandrel as well. This die setup cuts my press strokes in half compared to my Forster sizing die and 21st century expander as well as giving me easier control of how much sizing I do and where.

The SAC die/decap mandrel is like $500 all set up once you buy the mandrel and collet needed. It is very expensive, it cost twice as much as the actual press I use it in (MEC Marksman). This setup has produced most consistent sizing i've done to date as well as cutting press strokes in half so it was worth it in my eyes.

As stated, find what actually matters and do that as consistently and best you can and it will produce good ammo. With the majority of premium loading products you're really just paying for the experience or time savings. Every person will have a different cost associated with this and needs to find out if it's worth the investment.
 
Mudflap621 said:
I’ll say although the SAC sizing die is expensive, it is my go-to for sizing. Ive been running them for the last few years. Its machining is amazing and sizes easier than anything else on my bench. Also their bushing and mandrel selection really lets you dial in your sizing exactly where you want it. I prefer a mandrel as last step to set neck tension so use their decap mandrel as well. This die setup cuts my press strokes in half compared to my Forster sizing die and 21st century expander as well as giving me easier control of how much sizing I do and where.

The SAC die/decap mandrel is like $500 all set up once you buy the mandrel and collet needed. It is very expensive, it cost twice as much as the actual press I use it in (MEC Marksman). This setup has produced most consistent sizing i've done to date as well as cutting press strokes in half so it was worth it in my eyes.

As stated, find what actually matters and do that as consistently and best you can and it will produce good ammo. With the majority of premium loading products you're really just paying for the experience or time savings. Every person will have a different cost associated with this and needs to find out if it's worth the investment.
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Thanks for taking time to post. Always nice to hear from someone with actual experience with a product
 
mac1911 said:
I want to know what accuracy gains is everyone looking for ,
Are “you guys” loosing by group size, X count
Would “accuracy” improve with less time in the reloading room and more time on the range?
Click to expand...

This is my 300 yard offhand target with 10 shots. I just want to tighten my group.

sany1219-jpg.98800
 
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gerrycaruso said:
Why do you need a single stage press? Can't a progressive be used as a single stage?
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Using a progressive as a single stage would be like using a clothes wringer to masturbate. Sure, it can do it, but it's a real pain.

Single stages have advantages in terms of strength, durability, ease of use. For stuff you're only doing 20-50 rds at a time, they're a lot better than tearing down a progressive that's already set up.

paul73 said:
they`re trying to sell a story that a beaten up 50yr old single stage junk will be better than a new 750 dillon for precision reloading. [rofl] [rofl] [rofl]

of course it makes no damn difference, a press is a press.
Click to expand...
You won't know if that 50 yr old press can do a better job if you don't try, but in general if I'm buying a press dedicated to precision rifle it's going to buy a brand name that's known for it.
 
T-Unit said:
Using a progressive as a single stage would be like using a clothes wringer to masturbate. Sure, it can do it, but it's a real pain.

Single stages have advantages in terms of strength, durability, ease of use. For stuff you're only doing 20-50 rds at a time, they're a lot better than tearing down a progressive that's already set up.


You won't know if that 50 yr old press can do a better job if you don't try, but in general if I'm buying a press dedicated to precision rifle it's going to buy a brand name that's known for it.
Click to expand...
I ended up getting a Forster press.
 
northny said:
Press used for seating bullets had similar results. Rock chucker #1 20% ish, Dillon third.
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dunno, i have loaded a lot of ammo on my 750 dillon and i have no issues with consistency, plate alignment, seating deviations, etc.

to each their own, i have a very limited space in my reloading room, and 750 dillon with 2 tool heads per caliber does it all for me.
1 head for priming/sizing with redding bushing dies, other head with dedicated powder drop, bullet feed die and reading seating dies with micrometers.
everything works just fine with 0 issues. those who complain about dillon, i mostly suspect got their upper tentacles growing out of a wrong spot.
 
paul73 said:
dunno, i have loaded a lot of ammo on my 750 dillon and i have no issues with consistency, plate alignment, seating deviations, etc.

to each their own, i have a very limited space in my reloading room, and 750 dillon with 2 tool heads per caliber does it all for me.
1 head for priming/sizing with redding bushing dies, other head with dedicated powder drop, bullet feed die and reading seating dies with micrometers.
everything works just fine with 0 issues. those who complain about dillon, i mostly suspect got their upper tentacles growing out of a wrong spot.
Click to expand...
No one said Dillon could not load precision ammo. What the survey results indicated was you can load top quality ammo on any type of press (single stage, arbor, progressive- pick your own brand)

I personally load my PRS ammo and 600 yard AR ammo on Dillon 550. It’s not better than what I load on Rock Chucker, but it is faster
 

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