chris_1001
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Bodyguard 2.0
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dcmdon
NES Member
We understand that you only worry about total size.
But the point is that the Bodyguard is both smaller overall AND more more capable than the G43.
It's more capable because it holds more ammo and has a combination of factors that make it shoot better for most people. By shoot better I mean shoot quickly with reasonable accuracy. Defensive shooting is not about bulls eye accuracy and a trigger with a "crisp break". It's about putting as much lead downrange as possible as quickly as possible with as much accuracy as is necessary.
The low bore axis, smooth rolling trigger break and longer grip all contribute to being able to most people being able to shoot the Bodyguard more accurately with speed than the G43.
Again, I write this as a dyed in the wool Glock biggot. I started shooting Glocks in IDPA in 1998. I know their strengths and flaws. Generally speaking the single stack offerings are unimpressive. Its why despite trusting Glocks 100%, I looked elsewhere for a micro 9 (P365) and a pocket gun (Kahr P380, LCP Max, Bodyguard 2.0)
That's very charitable of you. But the reality is that most people buy a gun, decide they like it and keep it without EVER knowing how well the alternatives work for them.
I can unequivocally say that for all mentally stable people (This excludes those who worship at the Altar of Gaston the Great) the Bodyguard 2.0 is a better gun than the G43.
I can say this unequivocally because I have owned and carried both. I have also shot standardized drills with both using a shot timer.
The only area that is unknown at this point is how well the Bodyguard 2.0 will stand up to high round counts. The G42 can go many thousands of rounds with little to no maintenance. (Striker spring every 5000 rounds and maybe a recoil spring assembly ever 2000 rounds)
Except he wasn’t saying subjective parameters. The dimensions are quite objective.
“Other than the barrel length, they are the same size” was the claim.
Now if the extra length and width of the G42 works for him and he prefers the G42, then sure that’s a subjective preference.
dcmdon
NES Member
Yup, they aren't even close to the same size.
The smith is definitely smaller. But somehow it manages to have a longer grip at both the front and back strap, which then also allows a higher hold and a lower bore axis.
I bought my G42 wanting to love it. I had been shooting almost exclusively Glocks and 1911s for 20+ years at that point. But it sucked. The gun now is better, the horrible trigger stacking has been fixed. But it's still big for what it holds. And it shoots very well. In fact it's the second best shooting micro 380 there is. After the Bodyguard.
It would be neat if someone did a comprehensive test with ballistics gel with one of them to test for penetration using various .380 defensive rounds. The Bodyguard 2.0 does have 1/2 inch shorter barrel than the Glock, so that could result in some ammo working better or worse.
Some .380's are snappy and unpleasant (think LCP). The G42 was pleasant for me. Since you've shot both, where does the BG 2.0 fall?
Handgun Self-Defense Ammunition - Ballistic Testing Data
Lucky Gunner tests more than 110 different 9mm, 45 ACP, 40 S&W and 380 ACP handgun self-defense ammunition loads in ballistic gel with analysis and video.
www.luckygunner.com
I linked that earlier, those tests for the .380 were done with the Glock so can that be a reliable source for the Bodyguard given different barrel lengths? That half inch could cause some of those defensive rounds to behave different, but by how much is the question.
Handgun Self-Defense Ammunition - Ballistic Testing Data
Lucky Gunner tests more than 110 different 9mm, 45 ACP, 40 S&W and 380 ACP handgun self-defense ammunition loads in ballistic gel with analysis and video.www.luckygunner.com
Sorry, didn’t see that. I would also love to know the answer to your question.
dcmdon
NES Member
There are TONS of videos on YouTube showing this kind of thing.
The general consensus these days is that the Lehigh Defense Extreme Penetrator or Extreme Defense is the best bullet for the .380.
Many different companies load this bullet, including Underwood.
The LCP was miserable to shoot, but it was the best .380 at the time of its introduction. My problem was that the front of the trigger guard would slap the back of my trigger finger every time I shot. So after a mag or two I was flinching in anticipation of the pain.
As an aside, if you want a truly tiny gun that's actually smaller than the original LCP that is pleasant to shoot, the answer is the Kahr P380. I call it my "always gun" since it's small and light enough to have with you all the time.
I feel slightly more recoil with the Bodyguard but it is still very pleasant to shoot. I can shoot the Bodyguard just as fast as I could the 43. I didn't own both at the same time so I'. going from memory, but I'd say while the smith pushes more than the 42, the muzzle doesn't rise any more.
I didn't really carry my 42 much because I pretty quickly realized it was too large for me to pocket carry.
I ended up putting +3 extensions on all the mags so the gun ended up with a full length grip. Set up that way, I could shoot it faster than a G17.
The G42 with a +3 extension on it was very fast. I ended up keeping it for several years as a gun to introduce my pre-teen daughters to centerfire handguns.
The short reach to the trigger and small grip circumference worked with their small hands. I'd say that with something that lengthens the grip, the 42 is the best shooting .380 you can buy.
One key thing with the Bodyguard is that with a flush fitting mag, I can get my pinky on the grip, whereas with the 42 I can't with a flush mag. This is a big deal since even though your pinky isn't your strongest finger, its got the best leverage (longer lever arm) and adds about 40% (based on what I've read) to your ability to control muzzle flip. With an extended mag on the 42, that advantage goes away.
When I say shoot faster, there is a plate rack at my gun club that I've been using for years as a consistent test of how well I shoot a given gun quickly.
One HUGE factor that comes into play into this is how proficient I am. In the winter, I may go a month without shooting and all of it may be indoors, toes on the line, slow fire.
So I'm really rusty in the spring.
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dcmdon
NES Member
I'd advise testing any ammo you plan to carry.
Ammo sensitivity is part of the trade off with any of these tiny guns. My Kahr is horribly unreliable with 75% of the hollow points that are out there.
But it runs very very well with Hornady XTP.
In fact I bought 1000 rounds of the XTP and now use that in the Bodyguard. It's not the latest and greatest. But I KNOW it runs well in both guns and its a decent combination of expansion and penetration. (Remember that with low powered .380, you don't want a ton of expansion or it won't penetrate. )
When I was building reloads for my G42 and Kahr years ago, I did a bunch of testing with both guns. I wanted a cartridge overall length (COAL) and bullet shape that worked well in both the 42 and the P380.
I actually screwed up and ended up with something without enough power to cycle the Kahr reliably. The Bodyguard runs fine on those so I've been burning them up.
Mesatchornug
NES Member
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Related, it looks like Target Sports is selling out of all their Apex ammo. Their 380 uses the XD bullet. At $9.20/20, it could be worth investigating for someone that doesn't want to roll their own right now.
Target Sports USA APEX Xtreme Defense 380 Auto Ammunition 65 Grain Solid Copper - TS380XD
Target Sports USA APEX Xtreme Defense 380 Auto Ammunition 65 Grain Solid Copper - TS380XD for sale at TargetSportsUSA.com. Enjoy free shipping on bulk|^||^|
www.targetsportsusa.com
Sf Becket
NES Member
All I ever use for carry for the 380 is factory ball. Sig makes 100 grain and that’s the best IMERelated, it looks like Target Sports is selling out of all their Apex ammo. Their 380 uses the XD bullet. At $9.20/20, it could be worth investigating for someone that doesn't want to roll their own right now.
Target Sports USA APEX Xtreme Defense 380 Auto Ammunition 65 Grain Solid Copper - TS380XD
Target Sports USA APEX Xtreme Defense 380 Auto Ammunition 65 Grain Solid Copper - TS380XD for sale at TargetSportsUSA.com. Enjoy free shipping on bulk|^||^|
pinefd
NES Member
Related, it looks like Target Sports is selling out of all their Apex ammo. Their 380 uses the XD bullet. At $9.20/20, it could be worth investigating for someone that doesn't want to roll their own right now.
Target Sports USA APEX Xtreme Defense 380 Auto Ammunition 65 Grain Solid Copper - TS380XD
Target Sports USA APEX Xtreme Defense 380 Auto Ammunition 65 Grain Solid Copper - TS380XD for sale at TargetSportsUSA.com. Enjoy free shipping on bulk|^||^|
First off, I have found that the Lehigh Defense XD bullet works fine in my BG 2.0. I think I've had just one FTF in around 250 rounds, and it just took a quick rack of the slide to get back on track. Secondly, my preferred carry ammo for this gun is the Underwood XTreme Defender which uses the Lehigh bullet, but they're kinda pricey. So for practice, and to make sure that the BG gets used to this type of bullet, I've been using these TS Apex "equivalents", since they're cheaper than the Underwood.
I actually like shooting the Apex, but won't use them for my EDC choice because of penetration concerns. Note that the muzzle velocity for the Apex is only 1050, compared to the Underwood at 1300, and the muzzle energy of the Apex at 159 versus the Underwood at 255.
Frank
Note that ball ammo creates a crush path that is actually smaller than the bullet diameter. The curve pushes some tissue aside rather than crushing.
That is one of the big benefits of the Lehigh XD/XP. You get reliable penetration, but creates a bigger crush path than FMJ.
I’ve read that. It seems there is a lip on the frame, below the feed ramp that is the issue. I know people have tried polishing the feed ramp, but not sure if people have tried smoothing out they lip so it matches the feed ramp angle.
pinefd
NES Member
I know there was a lip on the earlier guns that was a problem, but mine, which I purchased about two months ago now, doesn't have that lip. So I assume (or would hope) that they've resolved that problem.
Frank
dcmdon
NES Member
The lip is not on all guns. If it exists it seems to cause some issues feeding certain bullets.
Mine does not have the lip.
You slightly mis state the issue. The lip isn't "on the frame , below the feed ramp". The gun actually has a feed ramp that is part of the frame and part that is the barrel. A lot like some 1911s.
So the part of the frame that may have the lip is actually metal and is intended to be the lower part of the feed ramp.
I don't know anyone with a gun made in the last few months that has had that lip.
I spoke to a knowledgeable person about this, it was their opinion that doing this allowed them to get the slide lower on the frame. So it's a necessary trade off in order to get the bore axis so low. But again, if the ramps line up and are flush, there doesn't seem to be a problem.
Another glowing review:
www.thefirearmblog.com
TFB Review: Smith & Wesson Bodyguard 2.0 - The 380 Auto Reimagined
The Smith & Wesson Bodyguard 2.0 is by all metrics a reimagined pistol from the ground up, but to get to the final product that we have before us today, there was quite a journey that occurred.The original Smith & Wesson Bodyguard 380 came out around 2010.Simple, tiny, and functional, it was the...
www.thefirearmblog.com
The only ammo I ever had an issue with in my Glock 42 was the Ruger ARX (maybe 'cause it was made by a competing brand. Duuuhh!)
![[rofl]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/013.gif "ROFL [rofl]")
The nose would jam on the feed ramp. Always good to test what you want to carry.That review really is turning me on.
I'm a Glock guy, though.
I can fix any Glock easily.
What if my BG breaks?
How will I ever fix it?
What is the turn around if I need to send it to S&W?
This BG does not look very user serviceable like a Glock.
If I had some confidence that I could fix it - I might decide to carry this, again.
My Alabama Holster is coming soon!
I already put on a Hogue Pimp Sleeve, have extra mags, and CCW ammo.
I'm a Glock guy, though.
I can fix any Glock easily.
What if my BG breaks?
How will I ever fix it?
What is the turn around if I need to send it to S&W?
This BG does not look very user serviceable like a Glock.
If I had some confidence that I could fix it - I might decide to carry this, again.
My Alabama Holster is coming soon!
I already put on a Hogue Pimp Sleeve, have extra mags, and CCW ammo.
zork51
NES Member
Nice. Too bad about the XS. Did you try contact them directly about it? It looks like right now, that would be the only option as far as I know from stock sights. I was all set to get a set then.................. There is a YT vid for DIY'ers from XS about installing these sights. I know nothing personally about gunsmithing, but the guy uses Red Loctite on the sights after install? That would kinda show that the sights may not be a tight fit as you suggested.
R3D 2.0 Installation - Hammer & Punch - S&W Bodyguard 2.0 - YouTube
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWNPruu4byU&t=70s
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