Firearm License Address Alert

[GOALJim]

There are several sections of Chapter 135 that requires the state to notify licensed gun owners about new requirements. For the most part, this revolves around the new registration and serialization mandates.

We have not seen anything that states how the notification will happen, i.e. – email, snail mail, etc. Regardless of how it happens, this will result in a massive records check that will likely focus on correct mailing addresses. Since the 1998 Gun Control Act was passed, it has been a requirement to report any change of address, even a different apartment in the same building. Failure to comply would result in a license being revoked.

GOAL’s concern, and we are not tipping off the state to an anti-2A idea they already know, is that an unknown number of license holders have been unaware of this requirement. If there are, as we suspect, a great number of folks this could be very bad when the mass mailing is conducted. If a mandated notification is returned to the state as undeliverable, that license will certainly be revoked within the system. Because the address is not correct, the license holder will not receive the required notification.

To make matters worse, after a license is expired, suspended, or revoked there are no protections from criminal prosecution after 90 days. This would go very badly if such a person were checked by law enforcement for a variety of reasons. The officer would know that your license had been revoked and that you are illegally in possession of firearms and/or ammunition. This will be a felony charge in Massachusetts and with aggressively anti-2A district attorneys and Attorney General, well …

The only advice GOAL can give is to make sure your address is correct and is on file with the Firearms Record Bureau online portal.

 

[Broc Tuah]

Interesting. Unless someone gave an address to a place that doesnt exist, or the house / building doesn't exist anymore, how will somethign return as "undeliverable"?

I would expect most would be delivered to the old address and whoever lives there will throw it away.

My bigger concern is how they will require registration. Wasn't there something about requiring the gun owner to enter the date of purchase?

 

[Rob Boudrie]

To make matters worse, after a license is expired, suspended, or revoked there are no protections from criminal prosecution after 90 days. This would go very badly if such a person were checked by law enforcement for a variety of reasons. The officer would know that your license had been revoked and that you are illegally in possession of firearms and/or ammunition. This will be a felony charge in Massachusetts and with aggressively anti-2A district attorneys and Attorney General, well

A bit more detail is in order here:

If one has an expired LTC, possession/carry is the civil offense of carry on an expired license. This protection applies unless one of the following three exclusionary situations exist:

1. The former licensee has become statutorially ineligible to be issued in LTC
2. The former licensee has applied for a renewal and been denied
3. The former licensee had the LTC revoked for any reason other than failure to file a change of address

If anyone knows of any recent change to this provision of the law please correct me.

Goals advice to make sure your address on file is still sound.

 

[JoseyWales]

... after a license is expired, suspended, or revoked ... This would go very badly if such a person were checked by law enforcement .... you are illegally in possession of firearms and/or ammunition .…

Simply because a person has an LTC, then that is enough EVIDENCE (for a search warrant or whatever) of possession of a firearm/ammo?

 

[Masswhole]

A bit more detail is in order here:

If one has an expired LTC, possession/carry is the civil offense of carry on an expired license. This protection applies unless one of the following three exclusionary situations exist:

1. The former licensee has become statutorially ineligible to be issued in LTC
2. The former licensee has applied for a renewal and been denied
3. The former licensee had the LTC revoked for any reason other than failure to file a change of address

If anyone knows of any recent change to this provision of the law please correct me.

Goals advice to make sure your address on file is still sound.

@Rob Boudrie does that also apply to ltc holders who have moved out of state without notifying re change of address?

 

[Rob Boudrie]

@Rob Boudrie does that also apply to ltc holders who have moved out of state without notifying re change of address?

It would appear so, however, I am not a lawyer. Despite the declaration of self professed experts who generally offer substantatition like "its obvious" or "I'd like to see you be the test case" rather than a statute or court decision, there is nothing in the law that renders a license void if you move out of state.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Simply because a person has an LTC, then that is enough EVIDENCE (for a search warrant or whatever) of possession of a firearm/ammo?

When you consider search warrant applications are reviewed ex-parte (you have no chance to refute the claim), in practice the answer is yes. I read one warrant for suspicion of lawful behavior (possession of a firearm in a car, not on one's person, on school property) because they had an LTC and a loose round of brass in plain sight. All the cop has to do is add something like "based on my experience and training, I believe this provides clear evidence of <insert illegal or possibly even a legal act here>".

 

[MAJoe]

I’ve had mail returned as undeliverable to a valid address before. That would be quite a “jump to conclusions” if permits are revoked based on USPS undeliverable notices. If the address still physically exists, it’ll be “delivered” even if you don’t live there.

Doesn’t mean a revocation can’t or won’t happen though.

 

[pastera]

Going after people for not updating an address in a database that could easily be verified in the driver's license database could cause problems for Mass.
But that's assuming that SCOTUS would actually take a 2a case, which currently is quite doubtful.

 

[Broc Tuah]

I’ve had mail returned as undeliverable to a valid address before. That would be quite a “jump to conclusions” if permits are revoked based on USPS undeliverable notices. If the address still physically exists, it’ll be “delivered” even if you don’t live there.

Doesn’t mean a revocation can’t or won’t happen though.

This.

Imagine your mail box is full (very common if living in a multi family or condo building).

However, I wouldn't put it past this State to do something that stupid.

 

[CATI]

My prediction is that a mailing like this will provide them with the cover to accidentally leak the entire list.

 

[TJRaccoon]

does that also apply to ltc holders who have moved out of state without notifying re change of address?

Moved out of state over a year ago.
Notified Local Mass PD and new NH PD of my change of address for my C&R with a copy of BATFE paperwork.
Local PD (Woburn) pinged me to submit change of address when they saw 03 FFL paperwork.

Long story short (some) local PDs are expecting change of address when you leave the people"s republic!

 

[JRLB]

what would one put as an address if you lived on a boat on a mooring?

 

[granitestater]

Interesting. Unless someone gave an address to a place that doesnt exist, or the house / building doesn't exist anymore, how will somethign return as "undeliverable"?

I would expect most would be delivered to the old address and whoever lives there will throw it away.

My bigger concern is how they will require registration. Wasn't there something about requiring the gun owner to enter the date of purchase?

NH mails drivers licenses RETURN SERVICES REQUESTED. What that means is if the name on the envelope has filed a forwarding order the post office will return it to NH DMV and provide the new address. Mass might could do that and there you have it.

 

[Reptile]

what would one put as an address if you lived on a boat on a mooring?

Now that is a question for a gun lawyer.

I would not just ask the police that question.

 

[DarthRevan]

It would appear so, however, I am not a lawyer. Despite the declaration of self professed experts who generally offer substantatition like "its obvious" or "I'd like to see you be the test case" rather than a statute or court decision, there is nothing in the law that renders a license void if you move out of state.

I’m a test case in waiting

 

[dans]

Interesting. Unless someone gave an address to a place that doesnt exist, or the house / building doesn't exist anymore, how will somethign return as "undeliverable"?

I would expect most would be delivered to the old address and whoever lives there will throw it away.

My bigger concern is how they will require registration. Wasn't there something about requiring the gun owner to enter the date of purchase?

Only first class mail (I’m pretty sure) is forwarded. But only for a defined period.

Third class definitely NOT forwarded

 

[Waher]

Someone that became homeless is going to have to civil rights case since the state license scheme requires a fixed address to exercise a core right.

 

[Len-2A Training]

I’ve had mail returned as undeliverable to a valid address before. That would be quite a “jump to conclusions” if permits are revoked based on USPS undeliverable notices. If the address still physically exists, it’ll be “delivered” even if you don’t live there.

Doesn’t mean a revocation can’t or won’t happen though.

USPO only forwards mail for x months (I think it is 6) after you give them a notice of a change of address. After that, everything that is 1st class mail gets returned to sender as undeliverable.

Most mail addressed to the prior homeowner in NH gets returned to sender and is not found in my mailbox.

Only first class mail (I’m pretty sure) is forwarded. But only for a defined period.

Third class definitely NOT forwarded

Correct.

 

[paul73]

a fixed address to exercise a core right

but it is not a right, as if it is licensed - it is by definition - a privilege. you gave up your right when you agreed to a license.

 

[Garys]

I can attest to that.

It would appear so, however, I am not a lawyer. Despite the declaration of self professed experts who generally offer substantatition like "its obvious" or "I'd like to see you be the test case" rather than a statute or court decision, there is nothing in the law that renders a license void if you move out of state.

 

[Garys]

I think it's a year, but I didn't save the notice.

USPO only forwards mail for x months (I think it is 6) after you give them a notice of a change of address. After that, everything that is 1st class mail gets returned to sender as undeliverable.

Most mail addressed to the prior homeowner in NH gets returned to sender and is not found in my mailbox.


Correct.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

I think it's a year, but I didn't save the notice.

You can pay for extended forwarding:

Standard Forward Mail | USPS

Keep getting your mail and packages whereever you go: See how to temporarily forward mail or permanently change your address.

www.usps.com

 

[Drix]

Of all the things GOAL has ever said, this feels like the most drummed up scare tactic.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Of all the things GOAL has ever said, this feels like the most drummed up scare tactic.

But the advice is solid. Keep your addess up2date. Do not give the state any ammunition to use against you as a gun owner.

 

[Garys]

Thanks. I think 16 months post move we finally have them all updated. The last one was the beginning of the month when the credit union called to say that the loan on my Tacoma was paid off. The address they still had was the PO Box I set up before we even moved down here. I thought that I'd changed it because I was getting mail from them to our new address, but apparently their loan department didn't have that.

Even the college that I went to in the 1970s, that I never donate to has sent me donation requests to the new address.

You can pay for extended forwarding:

Standard Forward Mail | USPS

Keep getting your mail and packages whereever you go: See how to temporarily forward mail or permanently change your address.

www.usps.com

 

[Taipan01]

Of all the things GOAL has ever said, this feels like the most drummed up scare tactic.

Not really. It was a lesser known/cared about fact about 35 years ago, at least to me and probably others and really should be taken to heart.

I almost got hung up on my renewal due to a change of address. I bought a house 2 miles down the road from a condo complex where we were renting one and within the same town. I had about 3-4 months when it would expire but that was the last thing on my mind at the time between moving with a 6 month old, cancelling then turning on utilities, getting a room ready for the baby and any place else he would be, getting appliances, repairs, etc..

Long story short, when I went to renew, the licensing officer (who was known to be a dickhead, since replaced) spent an extra 15 minutes going over the minutia and weighing his opinion on the balance beam of justice to do so before granting my privilege.

 

[steven grammont]

I live in a rural area , and I only check my mailbox when I know I have a package coming

This.

Imagine your mail box is full (very common if living in a multi family or condo building).

However, I wouldn't put it past this State to do something that stupid.

 

[HARRYM]

Nefarious Intentions.

 

[GM-GUY]

Simply because a person has an LTC, then that is enough EVIDENCE (for a search warrant or whatever) of possession of a firearm/ammo?

Unfortunately, yes as it's probable cause. Something else to blow your mind - you can't Red Flag a gang member as they don't have an LTC. I could be Red Flagged EX-Parte by my brother (who hates me and is in prison) and would result in confiscation until I get my day in court - usually takes months.