has anybody here ever applied for
a class 3 perimt? and if so how do you go about it
and what does it entail
a class 3 perimt? and if so how do you go about it
and what does it entail
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green card?
- Thread starter sickone777
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You need to have your C&R FFL.
http://northeastshooters.com/viewtopic.php?t=125
There are details on it.
Its 35$, and pretty much shall issue. Fill out two apps. One goes to the ATF for the application process, one goes to your local PD (for their files only, they dont do anything with it).
Then call them up and schedule. Good luck!
http://northeastshooters.com/viewtopic.php?t=125
There are details on it.
Its 35$, and pretty much shall issue. Fill out two apps. One goes to the ATF for the application process, one goes to your local PD (for their files only, they dont do anything with it).
Then call them up and schedule. Good luck!
sickone777 said:
Sickone - are you referring to a machine gun license? I thought you meant machine gun license because a C&R is not a green card.
If so, I don't have the link for it, but I'm sure someone here does. You have to have your chief's permission to get it - that much I know.
Rob Boudrie
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Green Card
I suspect the C&R was mentioned since the current CMR states that posession of a C&W FFL establishes that you are a "bona fide collector" - one of only two reasons considered valid under MGL (the other being "trainer of law enforcement"). One PD told me they require either a C&R or evidence of regular "collecting activity" to even consider issuing a green card. I don't know how the courts would rule on an appeal today (but I can guess), but prior to the regulation establishing that a C&R FFL holder is a bona-fide collector, the courts would regularly agree with chiefs who took the position "I don't care what you have to say about your activities, I've decided it's not collecting, so you don't qualify."
I suspect the C&R was mentioned since the current CMR states that posession of a C&W FFL establishes that you are a "bona fide collector" - one of only two reasons considered valid under MGL (the other being "trainer of law enforcement"). One PD told me they require either a C&R or evidence of regular "collecting activity" to even consider issuing a green card. I don't know how the courts would rule on an appeal today (but I can guess), but prior to the regulation establishing that a C&R FFL holder is a bona-fide collector, the courts would regularly agree with chiefs who took the position "I don't care what you have to say about your activities, I've decided it's not collecting, so you don't qualify."
.
I got one (relitivly easly too). I go it in 2002 right before the price went up. I just went in and applied for it. I had my C&R, the chief wanted proof of an alarm in the house and want to know if I had a safe. They put bona collector on mine. I wish that I could afford to have more than one. Prices for MG are insane.
I got one (relitivly easly too). I go it in 2002 right before the price went up. I just went in and applied for it. I had my C&R, the chief wanted proof of an alarm in the house and want to know if I had a safe. They put bona collector on mine. I wish that I could afford to have more than one. Prices for MG are insane.
If the new law passes so long as you can prove you were living in the US for 6 years or more they'll just GIVE YOU ONE!!!
......oh, you mean there's a different Green Card?
What's it do?
......oh
Dude that SUCKS!
![[crying]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/006.gif "Crying [crying]")
-Weer'd Beard
......oh, you mean there's a different Green Card?
What's it do?
......oh
Dude that SUCKS!
-Weer'd Beard
sickone777 said:
I have had my "green card" for about 10 years now.
Depends on the town...just go down and pick up an application and see what they want...you will likely in some way need to show you are a "bona fide collector" and most PD's like to ensure you have a truely secure location to keep them...
I didn't think that you needed a license.
I thought that all you needed was a C&R and the stamp for the transfer. You also need a license? Is this a MA thing?
I've never had the urge to really pursue this as I really can't afford Full Auto.
I thought that all you needed was a C&R and the stamp for the transfer. You also need a license? Is this a MA thing?
I've never had the urge to really pursue this as I really can't afford Full Auto.
C-pher said:
Yup, there's a Machine Gun License that you have to get. In MA, there are two ways you can get your MGL...One being [I believe] if you are a Trainer for Police Forces [???Something along these lines???], OR in most everyone's circumstance, if you are a Bona Fide Collector, in which case you must have your C&R.
I can't afford it either, sadly, because I'd own an MP5 and Thompson Sub Machinegun.
The "green card" (because, big shock, it is green in color) is a Mass license to Possess Machineguns, it is needed in addition to the all the federal stuff ($200 tax, prints, photos,CLEO sig, ect), infact NFA will not approve the transfer unless you include a copy of the "green card" with everything.
Where C&R license's play a role is two ways.
#1. there are two reasons for issue of a green card, being a LEO Instructor, or "Bona Fide Collector", though not in any statutue most PD's require you to have a C&R to "prove" you are a "Bona Fide Collector".
#2. if you want to buy a C&R MG from out of state you can have it sent right to you (after transfer is approved) which will often save you a dealers fee and one $200 tax. You still need a "green card" and all the federal transfer stuff, and it only "works" with C&R MG's (not all MG's are C&R).
As long as that sear is a pre86 transferable sear, yes you can buy a sear have it transfered to you, and use it to "convert" a gun. But in sear guns you aren't actually converting anything, because the sear itself is actually the registered/serialized MG and the gun it is just the host. But if you question is "does a "green card" let me convert my AR15 into an M16" No it doesn't, Federal law doesn't allow anyone to make new transferable MG's since 1986, so all transferable MG's/sears have to have been registered prior to May of 1986...
Where C&R license's play a role is two ways.
#1. there are two reasons for issue of a green card, being a LEO Instructor, or "Bona Fide Collector", though not in any statutue most PD's require you to have a C&R to "prove" you are a "Bona Fide Collector".
#2. if you want to buy a C&R MG from out of state you can have it sent right to you (after transfer is approved) which will often save you a dealers fee and one $200 tax. You still need a "green card" and all the federal transfer stuff, and it only "works" with C&R MG's (not all MG's are C&R).
C-pher said:
As long as that sear is a pre86 transferable sear, yes you can buy a sear have it transfered to you, and use it to "convert" a gun. But in sear guns you aren't actually converting anything, because the sear itself is actually the registered/serialized MG and the gun it is just the host. But if you question is "does a "green card" let me convert my AR15 into an M16" No it doesn't, Federal law doesn't allow anyone to make new transferable MG's since 1986, so all transferable MG's/sears have to have been registered prior to May of 1986...
Registered Sear can go in an AR of any age. (some are more work than others, ie some colts have the block in them, other brands have a higher "shelf") but legally you can use any AR
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You do NOT avoid the $200 tax with a C&R FFL. You ONLY avoid a dealer's transfer fee (and allow the seller to ship to you directly). You must have a "Green Card" (MA MG License) as well and many chiefs will absolutely refuse to issue them regardless of any reason or C&R FFL that you hold.
Everything else is the same whether you have a C&R or not.
Everything else is the same whether you have a C&R or not.
LenS said:
Please reread my post "which will often save you a dealers fee and one $200 tax."
This is how. Lets say you buy a C&R MP40 from Joe in Florida, if you are not a C&R holder (or it is not a C&R gun) the transfer from Joe to a Mass dealer will be $200 transfer tax, then the transfer from the Mass dealer to you will be another $200 tax, for a total of two $200 transfer taxes.
Whereas if you have a C&R license(and it is a C&R gun) it can go direct from Joe to you with only one $200 transfer tax.
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I am NOT certain that there is a $200 transfer tax everytime it goes on an FFLs books. I believe that tax is only done on the retail transaction.
However, I am NOT an expert on Fed gun laws, have no interest in F/A (too expensive for my blood to keep/support them), and thus will readily stand correction if anyone can cite a Fed Law or Reg on the matter.
However, I am NOT an expert on Fed gun laws, have no interest in F/A (too expensive for my blood to keep/support them), and thus will readily stand correction if anyone can cite a Fed Law or Reg on the matter.
Hey, C-pher, if we are talking about Masschusetts, and we are talking about a gun, any gun, let alone a machine gun, should it be surprising that you must have a state-issued license before you can legally get your gat? ![[wink]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/002.gif "Wink [wink]")
LenS said:
Basicly any time an idividual is invovled either selling or recieving there is a $200 tax, and since individuals can't transfer over state lines there will be at least one dealer invloved, so like I said, seller to dealer $200tax, then dealer to you another $200 tax.
Can't really say if there would be a statute to cite. Instead you need to show some way other than a Form 4 ($200 transfer) to get a transferable live machinegun from an individual to a dealer, or from a dealer to an individual. You will find it can only be done with end result of two form4 ($200) transfers. (dealer to dealer is "tax free" on a Form3, but an individual can niether sell or recieve on a form 3)
If you want to look around for yourself visit:
http://www.cs.cmu.edu/afs/cs.cmu.edu/user/wbardwel/public/nfalist/nfa_faq.txt
So, I have a buddy in Ohio that has at S&W that he wants to dump. I have my C&R. He's paying the 500 a year for his MG dealer. SO, I believe that he's a dealer when it comes to MGs. Anyway, if he were to transfer it to a dealer in MA, no $200 tax. And, being that it's a C&R, he can send it to me, provided I have my green card, and get the stamp approved from my local PD. Again, one $200 tax. So, even if it went from Him (dealer) to a Mass dealer to me, only $200.
But, if he only had his C&R. In theory, it might have to go to a dealer, $200 because that Dealer has to pay that stamp because my buddy isn't a dealer. Then the dealer to me, $200. So, it could cost me 400 bucks if I went that route. But only $200 if we sent it to me directly.
What a pain in the ass. And I really don't have the 6K to buy it from him anyway. But it got me thinking when he told me that he was getting rid of it the other day.
But, if he only had his C&R. In theory, it might have to go to a dealer, $200 because that Dealer has to pay that stamp because my buddy isn't a dealer. Then the dealer to me, $200. So, it could cost me 400 bucks if I went that route. But only $200 if we sent it to me directly.
What a pain in the ass. And I really don't have the 6K to buy it from him anyway. But it got me thinking when he told me that he was getting rid of it the other day.
C-pher said:
Since you have a C&R licnese (as already discussed you would also need a "green card") the transfer can go direct to you, with one $200 transfer tax.
Since he is a dealer, you could also do as you say and have it first sent (tax free) to a MA dealer then from that dealer to you with a $200 tax (but doing that would like cost you a "dealer fee" from the Mass dealer, and tack at least an extra month on your wait.
C-pher said:
NO! As long as it is a C&R gun and you have a C&R license, the gun can be transfered direct to you from an out of state seller, regardless of if the seller is a Dealer, C&R holder, or regular joe.
But Yes it were not a C&R gun(or if it were a C&R gun and you didn't have a C&R license), then yes it would have to go from the seller to a dealer (it can go direct to a Mass dealer) with a $200 tax, and then from that dealer to you with another $200 tax.
C-pher said:
Its not that bad once you do your first, and figure out what needs to be done. But once you get your first the problem becomes how do you get your next, and next, and next...I think I am on my 3rd or 4th "this is the last MG I'm going to buy" But really this last one will be it
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